British troops get U.S. rifles to tackle the Taliban.

Daily Mail (UK) ^ | 16th January 2010 | Mail On Sunday Reporter

[PotatoHeadMick]

British soldiers are to be given a powerful new U.S.-made rifle to take on Taliban fighters in Afghanistan.

The Ministry of Defence has spent £1.5million on 440 Sharpshooter semi-automatic rifles, which use 7.62mm ammunition that can kill at up to 900yards.

The order follows concern that the Army's standard issue SA80 A2 assault rifle, which fires smaller 5.56mm bullets, is less effective because its 'kill' range is limited to around 300yards.

[The KG9 Kid]

All I have to say is that 52 years later, troops are finally using the original AR10 design that Armalite and Eugene Stoner intended.

[AnAmericanMother]

Don't own an M-16 or any of the SKS variants, no .223 or 7.62x39 in the house. Hubby gets the FN (it's technically "his"), I wish to goodness we HAD an M-14, all we have is an M-1. Which means we would have to carry 2 different kinds of ammo. Bummer. Probably I'd have the M-1 with my little .308 Ruger M-77 bolt action deer rifle just in case I managed to shoot through all the Lake City match ammo (hubby would frown on that, but if the S really HTF I guess it doesn't matter). And I'd throw in the Remington 870 too because you can't break it and it always works. And I've got plenty of .303 for my Long Branch sniper SMLE . . . .

Sounds like a REALLY good excuse to get another semi-auto chambered in .308 to me . . . .

[AnAmericanMother]

My little Win 92 lever action rifle in .357 is impressive at short range . . . . and I could carry THOUSANDS of rounds of that stuff and have a sidearm too. That is a light and handy little item, and I built a speed loader for it (for cowboy action) that means I can get ten rounds back in it in a hurry. It’s probably as fast as a plunger type speed loader in a revolver, plus I get 10 rounds instead of 6.

[randomhero97]

You need special skills to engage a person at 500 - 900 meters with a rifle.

/thread

[Eagles6]

Reporter and editor should be fired, obviously haven’t a clue as to what they are talking about.

[Ruy Dias de Bivar]

***And now the Israelis are using M-16s. Go figure.***

The Galil, Valmet and South African rifles were in .223.

[randomhero97]

Pretty much. I would give heavier 5.56 loads an effective kill range of 500 yards.

[Joe 6-pack]

"The SA-80 has been a POS."

Mechanically it has been, but ergonomically, (for me anyways) it's one of the best designed weapons I've ever fired.

[12Gauge687]

Marine friends informed me that it’s not the size of the round, it’s the guy pulling the trigger. For close-in urban work, they prefer the M4 to long guns but the old M14 and the bolt-action M40, both in 7.62x51 NATO, are great to reach out and touch someone.

I think you’re on to something in your last sentence. The SA80 has been re-worked by H&K but MARSOC Marines I know say it’s still not a very robust design.

[Frantzie]

Thanks. In .308 semi-auto chambered, I have been looking at DSA Rifles SA58 or STG58 FAL clones.

Speaking of Ruger, their newish SR-556 is an AR with their own pistol driven system like an AK for better reliability.
Looks very nice but it is not cheap.
http://www.ruger.com/products/sr556/index.html

[300winmag]

This new rifle sounds like that updated version of the M-14. You know the rifle McNamara killed for the M-16. I think this is the updated M-14 the SEALs are using.

That's an oversized M-16 designed to fire the same 7.62mm round that the M-14 does. It's basically a match-grade sniper rifle, and there are only a couple of troops in each unit that can be trained to use it to its maximum effectiveness. It's a very specialized rifle that has more use in mountainous country than in cities.

[randomhero97]

I have been looking at DSA Rifles SA58 or STG58 FAL clones

FAL discussions

That's the link to the FAL discussions at ar15.com. Good info there.

[Ruy Dias de Bivar]

***and I built a speed loader for it (for cowboy action) that means I can get ten rounds back in it in a hurry.***

OH, OH, How do you do that! I have a .357 (1873) and an old (bought in 1968) 1894.44 mag!

[Frantzie]

I think this is needed for the windy canyons of Afghnaistan:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Soldiers_patrol_Waygul_Valley_2009.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Army_M14_Sage_Stock.jpg

[Frantzie]

Thanks. :-)

[JayVee]

There seems to be considerable confusion regarding the 5.56mm (M-16. SA-80, the 7.62x39 (Ak, SKS) and the 7.62x51 (M-14, M-60 LMG). The 5.56 cartridge is the military version of the .223 Remington, a round considered adequate for groundhogs among hunters in the US. The 7.62x39 is considered to be a round of “intermediate” power, its ballistics being about 10% hotter than the venerabl.30-30 Winchester. The 7.62x51 equates to the .308 Winchester and is basically the .30-06 Springfield with a shorter case due to improved powders.
During the fighting in Fallujah, the 5.56’s shortcomings became very evident when used against adversaries who were doped up on a mixture of cocaine and adrenaline. One insurent was hit 17 times and when the Marines went to make sure he was really dead, the bad guy was still trying to set off his bomb belt.
You NEED a “real rifle.”

[AnAmericanMother]

Ruger's never cheap. Even their 10-22 is pricey - although I bought mine when they first came out so I've forgotten about the pain .. . .

That FN site looks interesting - his and her FNs would be a nice touch.

[AnalogReigns]

that can kill at up to 900yards

Heh, I have a 7.62 X 54 Finnish Mosin (bolt action) with an 1894 Russian receiver, with sights that go beyond 1200 meters.

[AnalogReigns]

Here's the gun in question (don't know about that hat though...)

Nothing like an M-14

I must admit, I wish modern military weapons just had a little bit of wood on them...makes them much more human, I think.

[AnAmericanMother]

It's really quite easy. Take a length of PVC supply line pipe the right diameter so that your cartridges slide neatly down it but don't rattle. Take a dowel that fits pretty snugly in the pipe. Cut it the proper length for the number of rounds you want to load at a time, put a drawer pull or other wooden knob on the end.

You load the bullets in the PVC tube, put it against the loading gate, and shove the dowel home. All the bullets just slide in one after the other, as quickly as you can push the dowel. You have to experiment a little with the angle of the cut on the loading gate end.

Here's somebody who's made something quite similar: Lever Action Speed Loader. He got a whole lot fancier than I did on the workings, with the kerf cut and screws and inner tube and all . . . but on the other hand MINE is covered with buckskin and has Crow-style beadwork all the way down the side.