No, Obama's grandmother didn't say he was born in Kenya (Presstitutes spinning Certifigate)

Salon ^ | July 23, 2009 | Alex Koppelman

[2ndDivisionVet]

Among those on television who've been covering the sudden public resurgence of the Birther movement -- but in a much more responsible way than Lou Dobbs -- is MSNBC's Chris Matthews. The other day, he beat up pretty badly on Rep. John Campbell, R-Calif., who's a co-sponsor of the "Birther bill" that would require future presidential candidates to provide proof of their natural-born citizenship. Thursday, he hosted Watergate burglar turned radio host G. Gordon Liddy, who's fallen under the Birthers' sway.

Liddy himself looked decidedly unwell, and sounded out of sorts -- even Matthews seemed to realize that making him into a piñata would be unsporting. I'm not going to do it either, but you can watch the video below.

I'm posting on the appearance, though, because of something Liddy said during it: "You've got a deposition, which is a sworn statement, from the step-grandmother, who says, 'I was present and saw him born in Mombasa, Kenya.'"

Liddy got this particular myth a little garbled, but it's a favorite of the Birthers'. I've covered it before, but it's worth posting on now, I think, because cable news is just getting back to this story (there was some coverage late last year, when the Supreme Court declined to hear one of the Birther lawsuits) and hosts like Matthews don't know all the crazy twists of the conspiracy theory well enough to knock them down.

What Liddy was referring to is actually an affidavit filed by a street preacher named Ron McRae, who conducted an interview with Sarah Obama, the second wife of President Obama's grandfather, through a translator. (Sarah Obama is not the president's biological grandmother, but he calls her "Granny Sarah.")

In that interview, Sarah Obama does in fact say at one point that she was there for her grandson's birth. But that was a mistake, a confusion in translation. As soon as a jubilant McRae began to press her for further details about her grandson being born in Kenya, the family realized the mistake and corrected him. And corrected him. And corrected him. (The audio is available for download here.)

No matter, though, because people who believe in a conspiracy theory simply hear what they want to hear. So some Birther sites have posted transcripts and YouTube clips that end abruptly with the mistranslation and don't include the corrections. McRae, for his part, included the full translation in his affidavit -- he thinks it's all just part of the conspiracy. "Some few younger relatives, including [translator Vitalis Akech Ogombe]," McRae wrote in his court filing, "have obviously been versed to counter such facts with the common purported information from the American news media that Obama was born in Hawaii."

Here's the conversation:

MCRAE: Could I ask her about his actual birthplace? I would like to see his birthplace when I come to Kenya in December. Was she present when he was born in Kenya?

OGOMBE: Yes. She says, yes, she was, she was present when Obama was born.

MCRAE: When I come in December. I would like to come by the place, the hospital, where he was born. Could you tell me where he was born? Was he born in Mombasa?

OGOMBE: No, Obama was not born in Mombasa. He was born in America.

MCRAE: Whereabouts was he born? I thought he was born in Kenya.

OGOMBE: No, he was born in America, not in Mombasa.

MCRAE: Do you know where he was born? I thought he was born in Kenya. I was going to go by and see where he was born.

OGOMBE: Hawaii. Hawaii. Sir, she says he was born in Hawaii. In the state of Hawaii, where his father was also learning, there. The state of Hawaii.

(VIDEO AT LINK)

[NurdlyPeon]

And with all that text in that link, there does not appear to be any legislation that defines natural born citizen.

Ya, I pretty much came to the same conclusion. Oh well, welcome to July 24, 2009, US of A.

[Mouton]

Many are going to get a great education on what happens when you elect a Mogabe like person “president”. This guy is not about harmony, he is about getting back for perceived slights over the years. That comment at the conclusion of Wednesday's press conference about the situation in Cambridge is an excellent entree into his thinking: His friend is black...the officer was white...therefore the officer acted stupidly. Unfortunately for him, it did not end there because we got a two minute harangue on how Blacks are treated by the POlice (and he threw in Latino to bring them into the racial equation). I bet his handlers wanted to give him the hook. A snippet here and a snippet there, pretty soon everyone will have a complete picture. Alas by the time most of the dummies wake up, they will be like that frog in the pot of water as it heats up.

[Aquabird]

All this attention to the ‘Birthers’ is so funny. What is also even more delicious are posters like trumandogz who are in rampant mode about it.

Obama’s political career is not by winning elections so much as finding the opponent disqualified. His Democrat and Republican competitors he had disqualified and thrown out of the race.

He attempted to disqualify John McCain. How? He did so based on the grounds that McCain wasn’t a naturalized citizen since he was born in Panama. Now, this issue came up in 2000 when McCain earlier ran, and McCain’s lawyers went through the motions to show why McCain was a naturalized citizen. All is fine and well.

It would make perfect sense to ask Obama to prove he was a naturalized citizen, as he forced McCain to do. Where there is smoke, there is fire. There is much smoke around this issue.

-Obama flying to Hawaii at the last days of the campaign to seal his birth certificate.

-Appointing a photo from a single website called ‘Factcheck’ as sole authority that it is his ‘birth certificate’ in which there has been no verification and no certificate of live birth.

-Kenyan ambassador and Kenyan grandmother saying he was born in Kenya. Kenyan officials now not letting journalists in to investigate and forbidding the family to talk to journalists.

-Obama spending a million dollars in legal fees just to prevent him from revealing his birth certificate.

-Obama mentioning multiple hospitals at which he was born.

-Obama having odd gaffes such as “57 states” or “my Muslim religion...”

-Pentagon dropping the order to Major Cook just to drop the challenge Cook presented to not have to prove Obama legitimate.

The louder the articles and media goes against this issue, which is receiving far more attention than the kooky 9/11 truther movement, points out that someone is worried.

If birthers were complete morons, it would be best to let them be morons and have them commit political suicide. But since the media is doing all these stories on the ‘birthers’, it shows someone wants these ‘birthers’ to shut up.

Where there is smoke, there is fire...

[2ndDivisionVet]

Very good summation! Bravo!

[2ndDivisionVet]

The difference is that Mr. Mogabe doesn’t control thousands of nuclear weapons, 15 or so aircraft carrier battle groups, millions of troops, a huge bureacracy, thousands of warplanes, ACORN and the world’s largest economy. We are in for a VERY rough ride, no matter how this turns out.

[Red in Blue PA]

A DEPOSITION IS NOT A BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

Period.

[NurdlyPeon]

Still, there are two other points that need to be considered.

1) The preponderance of evidence seems to indicate that Obami is not a “natural born” citizen. His reluctance to show his birth certificate, or any other of his records. The fact that he has spent almost on million dollars to keep it under wraps, rather than spending $10 to put an end to the controversy (which is weakening both himself and the military). The fact that he has admitted his fathers British citizenship. The recording of his granny saying that he was born in Kenya, etc. etc. While there may not be an exact definition of "natural born" citizen in place, I think the combination of his being born in Kenya, and his father being a British citizen, should pretty much seal the deal.

2) People seems to think that we should be attacking him on other fronts instead of this one. I didn't know that it was an either/or situation. We should continue this attack, and attack on other fronts as well. Attack on ALL fronts. NEVER LET UP, on ANY front. As far as the MSN calling us crazy, this is just right out of the Alinski playbook. Ridicule is a powerful weapon. Personally, I think our suspicions have a pretty solid grounding. If people want to call me a “kook”, or a “conspiracy nut”, I'll just file that under “ya, whatever”. We need to keep up this attack. I'm not expecting it to be a knock-out blow, it's just one more thing to hurt him and weaken him.

[sushiman]

Bravo indeed . Kudos !

[Aquabird]

And with all that text in that link, there does not appear to be any legislation that defines natural born citizen.

God, you're a dunce. There can't be any legislation because it is in the Constitution. Nothing the Legislative Branch, or the Executive or Judicial Branch, can say about it. The Constitution is higher than they are.

And as I recall, Chief Justice Roberts and Justices Scalia, Thomas and Alito have had multiple opportunity to take the Obama NBC case and have refused.

And what precedent are they to follow? You don't know, because you don't have the slightest clue what you are talking about.

In my Constitutional Law class, the subject of 'naturalized citizen' came up and the professor wondered openly to the class why the founders put that in there (this was in early 2000s). To a Con Law scholar, it is one of those fun puzzles. Founders obviously put it in there for a reason. What would it be?

Anyway, the reason why the Supreme Court has not dealt with this issue is because there is absolutely no precedent. If the Supreme Court did go on this issue, they would not only be doing something the Supreme Court has never done before, they would also be going against the Executive Branch and the Legislative Branch wouldn't be too happy. They would also be going against the American people who gave the votes to the guy.

Remember when John Roberts botched the Presidential Oath? Accidental slip-up? I don't think so. He knows. He is also being bullied by the Obama types. If every other high ranking member of the government is getting bullied, why not Supreme Court justices?

But there is one element that cannot be bullied: the American people. As Rush as said, the birth certificate issue has been bubbling up. This is why the media is a massive campaign to attempt to stomp the sprout before it grows into the unmovable tree.

[Non-Sequitur]

His father's Kenyan/British citizenship disqualifies him from the office he currently occupies as a usurper, according to the laws in place at the time and the framers of the U.S. Constitution.

Can you quote the law in place at the time that prevents it?

[2ndDivisionVet]

See post #6.

[trumandogz]

In my Constitutional Law class, the subject of 'naturalized citizen' came up and the professor wondered openly to the class why the founders put that in there....

While I am not a professor of Constitutional law, I am pretty sure that the term 'naturalized citizen' is not in the Constitution.

I would be quite dubious if your professor's open wonderings.

[Non-Sequitur]

See post #6.

So there is no law that states that. Why not say so to begin with?

[Non-Sequitur]

While I am not a professor of Constitutional law, I am pretty sure that the term 'naturalized citizen' is not in the Constitution.

Indirectly. The Constitution says that Congress will establish a unified rule of naturalization. Naturalized and natural-born are the only two forms of citizenship identified.

[2ndDivisionVet]

The United States Constitution is above any other law, it is the founding document. He is not, just as Chester Arthur was not, a natural born citizen. What part of that is so hard for so many people to grasp? Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. was not, and never, ever became a U.S. citizen, ipso facto, his son by Miss Dunham is not "natural born" although he might be a citizen. We won't go into the Indonesia and Pakistan situations, because they are moot at this point.

[smokingfrog]

Attack on ALL fronts. NEVER LET UP, on ANY front.

I agree with you. 0bama could make the whole 'birther' controversy go away anytime he wants, but refuses to release his original BC. You have to ask why.

[freekitty]

I am sure you could find one if you did your own search.

[freekitty]

How can you tell? I could barely get through all of the insults hurled by the author which seems to be more to his point.

[Non-Sequitur]

The United States Constitution is above any other law, it is the founding document.

Indeed it is. And it doesn't define natural-born citizen.

Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. was not, and never, ever became a U.S. citizen, ipso facto, his son by Miss Dunham is not "natural born" although he might be a citizen.

That's the part that's hard to grasp. Nothing in the law or the Constitution supports your claim.

We won't go into the Indonesia and Pakistan situations, because they are moot at this point.

Darn.

[2ndDivisionVet]

Tell you what, let’s wait for the first news conference with President Joe Biden [shudder] thread to discuss this further. You obviously have your mind made up that you’re right and I’m wrong. So be it. Let’s just see what happens...