Posted on 04/22/2009 7:12:17 AM PDT by AmericanHunter
When Texas Gov. Rick Perry floated the idea of secession if the federal government continues to pursue an aggressive tax-and-spend policy, the mainstream media, as well as the political establishment, cringed.
MSNBC’s Chris Matthews called talk of secession “whack-job stuff,” calling Mr. Perry a “bozo” and telling the Texas governor, “You don’t have a choice buddy.” Mr. Matthews’ colleague, Rachael Maddow, said Mr. Perry was “flirting to the point of adultery” by talking about secession, while commentator Thomas Frank reinforced the disconnect between the media and many Americans.
“What you’re seeing … what is one of the surprising things about these tea parties … surprising to people like you and me, is how mainstream extremism is in the Republican Party and the conservative movement,” Mr. Frank, author of Wrecking Crew: How Conservatives Rule, told Ms. Maddow.
But is the idea of secession a foreign concept to the American experience? Is talk of secession automatically treasonous? Is any secessionist movement doomed to be defined by the Civil War and exiled to the political wilderness?
“I think the biggest surprise to me was the outrage expressed by an individual who even thinks ... along these lines,” U.S. Rep. Ron Paul, R-Texas, said yesterday on CNN’s American Morning.
“Because I heard people say, well, ‘this was treason,’ they say, and ‘this was un-American.’ But don’t they remember how we came in to our being? We used secession. We seceded from England. So it’s a very good principle. It’s a principle of a free society. It’s a shame we don’t have it anymore.”
Dr. Paul, who ran a hard fought grassroots campaign for the Republican nomination in 2008, argued the principle of secession is one that protects the union rather than threatens it.
“I argue that if you have the principle of secession, our federal government wouldn’t be as intrusive into state affairs. And to me, that would be very good,” Dr. Paul said. “We as a nation have endorsed secession all along. I mean, think of all the secession of the countries and the Republicans from the Soviet system. We were delighted. We love it. And yet we get hysterical over this.”
Critics of the coverage of the secession comment argue the media is trying to paint the Republican Party as extreme. They say Mr. Perry was not advocating secession, but rather saying the federal government could cause its resurrection.
“We got a great union. There’s absolutely no reason to dissolve it. But if Washington continues to thumb their nose at the American people, you know, who knows what might come out of that?” Mr. Perry asked.
While the notion of secession was floated by Mr. Perry, he was not expressly advocating Texas leave the Union. Rather, the Texas governor used the idea in a manner Dr. Paul believes is historically accurate — to send a warning shot across the bow of a federal government that is encroaching on state’s rights and individual liberties.
Last week’s tea parties exposed a major rift in the country, and some are concerned the Obama administration does not understand the degree of dissent that is fomenting outside the Beltway. And despite panning by the political establishment, the majority of the nation viewed tea party dissent in a favorable light.
Fifty-one percent of Americans had a favorable view of the nationwide rallies, while 32 percent responded their view was very favorable, according to a poll released by Rasmussen Reports. A third of the nation had an unfavorable view with 15 percent unsure.
But among the nation’s “Political Class,” Rasmussen found just 13 percent held a favorable assessment and zero percent held a very favorable view of the nationwide protest. This disconnect, according to Dr. Paul, is a major part of the problem.
“People are angry. And if we don’t sense that, we don’t know it’s actually what’s going on there,” the Texas congressman said. Dr. Paul said the worst is yet to come because secession will achieve a greater legitimacy as the country struggles.
“When the dollar collapses and the federal government can’t fulfill any of its promises, what if they send you dollars and they don’t work,” Dr. Paul said. “People are just going to — they’re not going to have a violent cessation. They’re just going to ignore the federal government because they will be inept.”
Some day the earth will weep, she will beg for her life, she will cry with tears of blood. You will make a choice, if you will help her or let her die, and when she dies, you too will die.”
— John Hollow Horn, Oglala Lakota
http://www.republicoflakotah.com/?p=1139
do they all want to if so let them..
I think all the tribes should secede, be kicked out, or be annexed into the country.
Absolutely, 100% correct. Whether they will be permitted to exercise that right or forced against their will to submit to superior military force is another question, but the individual states retain the absolute right to secede.
I’m not talking about word, but *actual secession* in which they have distinct borders, their own laws and court systems, which they are *prevented* from having right now, in terms of setting up the Republic of Lakotah (which they want to do).
So, the bottom line is how can Freepers help the Lakotah to set up their own separate country and their own borders, for which they will not be in the United States any more or be bound by any of its laws and have none of its officials within the borders that they have outlined (per the treaty they had, originally).
I would like to see that accomplished and be made a “done deal” for the purposes of *accomplishing* the actual process of secession from the United States...
It only worked against England because all thirteen colonies took up arms and came together, and united as a result. Today, we would see a split up of the nation... a fracturing, that would weeaken us.
Well over 60 million voted against the marxist Obama. The election before, 65 million voted for Bush.
With Obama, millions of people were fed a lie and bought a pig in a poke. By 2010, a lot of them will be seeing the light and what we need to do is to eudcate others regarding the truth about Obama and then point that truth to the inevitable difficulties Obama's policies are going to cause.
I believe if we will do that (and I have been doing just that on the web, email, in my neighborhood, at work, and with anyone who will listen), then we will see a significant turn around in 2010 that will neuter Obama, and then run him and his ilk out on a rail in 2012.
THE AUDACITY OF TRUTH ABOUT BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA
NOW WE KNOW WHAT A COMMUNITY ORGANIZER DOES
OBAMA, THE STOCK MARKET, AND ENERGY
BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA IN HIS OWN WORDS
THE AUDACITY OF TRUTH ABOUT BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA'S UPBRINGING
Does that correspond to the caldera?
So, how do we go about helping the first one that has been working on it for so long, the Lakotah. How can Freepers help the Lakotah set up their own country, their own borders, their own government and have it be completely separate from the United States and not any part of the United States?
How can the FReepers here help *accomplish* this secession for the Lakotah?
I say the more the merrier..Obama should be scared..LOL!
I’m not sure what you’re saying; you’ll have to restate it some other way for me..., sorry... :-)
How can FReepers here help the Lakotah secede from the United States and set up their own free and independent country — and then likewise, have the “groundwork” for us to do so, too (using their precedent)?
I mean, we should all help the Lakotah to the full extent of our abilities to get them their own free country — totally apart from the United States...
Sorry, do the borders of the Lakota Nation correspond to the edges of the yellowstone Calderra? You know, the largest volcano on earth?
i do NOT foresee a day when the USA's intellectual/academic/financial/business/government, SELF-impressed ELITES out of the Northeast & the LEFT coast will ever accept southerners as EQUALS and/or LEAVE US ALONE.
as for our tribal government, we get along FINE with the state government & that of 3 states of the Republic of Mexico. (fwiw, we have enrolled members IN both countries - when "the line" was drawn after TX independence, part of our tribe was resident on the other side of the line. thus we have members of the tribe who are US & Mexican "nationals".)
free dixie,sw
free dixie,sw
In less than two months, an exciting new movement has captured the imagination of freedom-minded Americans all across our nation. This movement, often referred to as the “State Sovereignty Movement,” is more properly referred to as the “Tenth Amendment Movement,” because it is not a movement to affirm the absolute freedom and independence of each state, but instead a movement to restore the balance of power between the states and the federal government within the union in accordance with the Tenth Amendment of the Constitution.
Resolutions to restore the balance of power between the states and the federal government have already been introduced in at least 14 state legislatures. Most of them are almost identical to the resolution already passed in the Oklahoma House. After a series of “whereas” clauses, nearly all of them contain a key section stating:
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED BY THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES AND THE SENATE OF THE __________ LEGISLATURE: THAT the State of __________ hereby claims sovereignty under the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States over all powers not otherwise enumerated and granted to the federal government by the Constitution of the United States.
Besides the 14 states that have already introduced Tenth Amendment resolutions, many more are currently considering introducing such resolutions. The very rapid growth of this Tenth Amendment Movement is being propelled by the very widespread dismay and disgust over the multiple trillion-dollar bailouts, the nationalization of banks and other corporations, the accelerated creation of money out of thin air by the Federal Reserve, and the continued buildup of power within the federal government at the expense of the states and the people.
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/829
Well, the reason why I figure that FReepers should be working very diligently to helping the Lakotah to get their total independence, that they want, from the United States, is that they are the “forerunners” for the secession movement.
And, as such, they will be “setting the precedents” for what a nation or state can do, and what the U.S. Government will do.
Thus, we, as FReepers, should be doing all that we can to support and facilitate *everything possible* that the Lakotah can do, in order to fully and completely secede from the United States...
That’s my thinking on the matter...
—
And I’m familiar with Stand Watie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_Watie
As he’s a familiar name in these parts (Oklahoma)... I live within mere miles of the Cherokee, Osage and Creek Indian Nations...
I disagree. My feelings toward our violations of treaties range from disappointment to disgust, but they are not relevant to the current discussion. The Constitution of the United States is the supreme law of the land, higher than a treaty. The Tenth Amendment to that Constitution gives each state the right to secede. Texas and the other states thus have the right to secede under the supreme law of the land. Nice try though.
I don't claim that secession is the correct choice for one or more of the states to make, but it is absolutely a choice that is open to each of the states. Natural law gives the people of those states that right, as does the Constitution.
Anyone who refuses to recognize that secession (and the armed insurrection it would undoubtedly engender) is the last refuge of the patriot is a simpleton. You have traded your freedom for stability - in perpetuity - if you cannot admit that the permanent political class, coupled with unconstitutional government support of nearly (soon to be more than) half of the population of this country, has polluted the well of liberty.
It is arguable as to whether the well can be cleaned up, short of digging a new well.
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