Funny, he doesn't look Jewish.
Ping to Swordmaker. IIRC, you are a student of the shroud?
Ping
Bump...
of course carbon-dating is more conclusive then actual documentation...
Knights Templar PING!
The King of France trumped up charges against the Knights Templar, to get out of his debts.
That some “sins” were discovered among the Knights? Really? Who would NOT “admit” to sinful behavior during torture?
The Pope was NOT in charge of arresting the Templar Knights, and the Pope, at the time, did not find that the Knights were guilty of heresy.
Still, they way they were treated was just wrong, and the Church, at the time, should have done more.
“Friday the 13th” is the day the Templars were first arrested, by the King of France.
It was my understanding that the Knights Templar were the keepers of the Holy Grail.
Demolet does it again.
ping
Funny, he doesn't look Jewish.
Where was the shroud from 1-1204?
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Discovery Channel or History Channel did a special a few years back on the Shroud of Turin. Apparently, for political reasons and fear of power of the Knights Templar brought their downfall by the King & the Pope. And yes, the carbon dating of the Shroud indicated that it was of later date, and therefore a fake. The sample taken was just a few threads from a corner. I seriously doubt that any samples will ever be taken again. And the story will grow.
Like everything else worth saving in this world, it’ll wind up in the filthy hands of the islamists, eventually.
It is well established that a cloth with a purported image of Jesus existed in Edessa (now Urfa, Turkey) prior to 5th century CE. This was documented by Eusebius of Caesarea in the early 4th century. According to Eusebius (and this part of the record should be treated as legend for it has many such qualities) the cloth was brought to Edessa by the apostle Thomas or the disciple Thadeus (of the biblical 70).
What is reliable history is that in 544, a cloth with an image thought to be of Jesus was found concealed above a gate in the city walls of Edessa. That cloth was transferred to Constantinople on August 14, 944. At that time, it was described by Gregory Referendarius as a full-length burial cloth with an image of Jesus (purportedly) and bloodstains in the vicinity of a side wound.
Following the sacking of Constantinople in 1204, that cloth became the property of Othon de la Roche, the French Lord of Athens and Thebes (Athens was in French hands). He sent it to his castle home in the town of Besançon, France, likely in 1207. At Eastertide, it was removed from castle and displayed in the Besançon Cathedral. We don’t know when that practice started but it ended when the cathedral was destroyed by fire in March of 1349.
Any records that might have existed may have been burned in that fire as all church records were destroyed. In that same year, Geoffroy de Charny, a French knight married Jeanne de Vergy, a grand-niece of Othon de la Roche, and delivered the shroud (or a shroud) to the canons of Lirey, thereby creating the earliest extant record in Western Europe.
More support for the Shroud = the Mandylion. It will take more positive evidence overturning the carbon dating, beyond the plausible theories proposed to explain that to quiet many of the skeptics.. However, it will never be 100% proven by the dictates of science; God wants this belief to be by faith and that requires it to be beyond scientific proof.
