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Hyperinflation will begin in China and destroy the dollar

Posted on 03/15/2009 7:39:49 PM PDT by 4rcane

http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/01/hyperinflation-will-begin-in-china-and.html

The conventional wisdom on China is dead wrong. Specifically, there is a widespread belief, as expressed by Goldman Sachs, that "China will keep the yuan trading within a narrow range in 2009 due concerns about exporters." Worse still, others are even predicting that China will devalue its currency! The sheer wishful thinking is astounding! The idea that "China will keep the dollar peg to help its exporters" ranks all the way up there with "Housing prices always go up" and "You can spend your way to prosperity".


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: china; economy; eminentdomain; hyperinflation; samebsdifferentday; sovereignty; sovereignwealthfund; willbuyuspaper; willdevalueyuan; willpropupexports
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1 posted on 03/15/2009 7:39:50 PM PDT by 4rcane
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To: 4rcane

http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/01/hyperinflation-will-begin-in-china-and.html


2 posted on 03/15/2009 7:41:52 PM PDT by 4rcane
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To: 4rcane

3 posted on 03/15/2009 7:42:53 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: 4rcane; TigerLikesRooster; PAR35; AndyJackson; Thane_Banquo; nicksaunt; MadLibDisease; happygrl; ...
Like, *PING*, folks.

Cheers!

4 posted on 03/15/2009 7:45:03 PM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
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To: 4rcane
I always thought that official Chinese data on economy and growth can not be trusted. I always watch with quite an astonishment when “experts” criticize numbers for inflation here or in the EU as made-up only to take Chinese data at face value.

Having said all of that - could you explain please the inflation in China (yuan dropping in its purchase power) as the cause of dollar collapse. I don't think the there is any link here, to say the least...

5 posted on 03/15/2009 7:47:11 PM PDT by alecqss
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To: 4rcane

Walmart will be the barometer of things to come.
If prices start to rise there, look out.


6 posted on 03/15/2009 7:52:42 PM PDT by Ron in Acreage (Where's our V?)
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To: alecqss

Their argument is that inflation would force the Chinese government to stop printing yuan, which would kill the dollar peg and allow the yuan to rise dramatically against the dollar.

I’m not convinced this would be disasterous for us. It would mean cheap goods from China weren’t so cheap, but it would significantly reduce our trade deficit. Right now we’re enjoying artificially cheap imports from China, but in the end these things tend to balance out.


7 posted on 03/15/2009 7:53:14 PM PDT by Arguendo
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To: 4rcane

I loved this line:

“5) Dropping the dollar peg will make the yuan a major reserve currency. That means lower interests rates in China as foreign central banks build up yuan reserves.”

I mean who wouldn’t want to hold the notes backed by full faith and credit of a repressive fascist regime.


8 posted on 03/15/2009 7:56:45 PM PDT by bluejay
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To: Arguendo
Their argument is that inflation would force the Chinese government to stop printing yuan, which would kill the dollar peg and allow the yuan to rise dramatically against the dollar.

Isn't that inflation would first cause yuan to drop against the dollar, then, with printers stopped (if such thing ever happens anywhere) to rise... making it even, I suppose.
9 posted on 03/15/2009 7:58:10 PM PDT by alecqss
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To: bluejay
Very good point ~ given the choice between holding milled Spanish dollars or German silver (in the early 1800s) the young United States government prayed for the discovery of its own gold supply!

In the meantime banks printed their own bank notes.

10 posted on 03/15/2009 7:59:19 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: 4rcane
I don't get it.

Doesn't China own a boatload of our debt, in dollars? Hyperinflation of the dollar would make those bonds worthless, wouldn't it?

11 posted on 03/15/2009 8:00:46 PM PDT by ZOOKER ( Exploring the fine line between cynicism and outright depression)
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To: 4rcane

Interesting take, but I don’t buy it. For his scenario to affect the US, as the price of Chinese goods increased, US demand for them would have to remain the same.

It wouldn’t.


12 posted on 03/15/2009 8:06:59 PM PDT by A.Hun (Common sense is no longer common.)
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To: alecqss
Quantity theorists are never very specific about issues of backing. The point is trying to be that there are more yuan in existence than in the past, and a naive quantity theorist thinks if there is more of any currency each of them must be worth correspondingly less. Needless to say, this is a complete fallacy. Yuan circulation is increasing yes, but all the new Yuan correspond to new dollar claims held by the Bank of China. If anyone doesn't want more Yuan, the bank can give them dollars instead, or through it, goods from anyone in the world.

The Chinese are not going to revalue the yuan upward when their exports are dropping at 25% annual rates, also needless to say. It is a deflation and not an inflation. Naive quantity theorists can't grok, because more of any currency in existence, to them, always means each piece of currency "just is" worth less. What the demand for that currency is, what assets back it, what claims or ownership it can be traded for - they just pretend all those things are some absolute constant. Which, needless to say, they aren't.

At bottom, a naive quantity theorist is someone who believes the amount of money in the world simple "should" remain completely constant, and also think that if they did then their "real" value would also remain constant. Since total wealth, of mankind as a whole and of individual countries or other economic groups, does not remain constant, nor does the portion of that wealth held as money or near money remain constant, nor does demand for money as against other forms of wealth, this isn't remotely correct. But that is all too complicated, to them. If the denominator increases, the numerator must decrease, because they systematically ignore every other factor affecting said numerator.

13 posted on 03/15/2009 8:08:15 PM PDT by JasonC
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To: ZOOKER
Yes, it would effectively be a default and all the stuff they've ever given us as real goods would have been for free.
14 posted on 03/15/2009 8:09:12 PM PDT by JasonC
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To: alecqss

I’m not sure it would end up even, but there some negative feedback factors which is why I’m not particularly worried.


15 posted on 03/15/2009 8:10:34 PM PDT by Arguendo
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To: A.Hun

It would be nice to have a manufacturing revival in the US.


16 posted on 03/15/2009 8:10:49 PM PDT by Hoosier-Daddy ("It does no good to be a super power if you have to worry what the neighbors think." BuffaloJack)
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To: JasonC

Hyperinflation wouldn’t mean we would default on our debt, but the dollars we pay to service the bonds just wouldn’t be worth as much.


17 posted on 03/15/2009 8:11:37 PM PDT by Arguendo
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To: JasonC

NM, I missed the word “effectively.” I think we’ll see much higher inflation than we’ve seen in the past couple decades, but I don’t really forsee hyperinflation here. Obviously it will still hurt the Chinese though.


18 posted on 03/15/2009 8:13:20 PM PDT by Arguendo
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To: Arguendo

The decline of the dollar would raise the prices on our imports, including oil, which in turn would raise the costs of goods and services to the consumer and more than likely decrease our standard of living.


19 posted on 03/15/2009 8:16:35 PM PDT by kabar
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To: Hoosier-Daddy

For low margin items, we would probably turn to Mexico, Korea, or Japan before that manufacturing would return here.


20 posted on 03/15/2009 8:17:18 PM PDT by A.Hun (Common sense is no longer common.)
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