Say goodnight, Dick.
"Goodnight, Dick!"
Posted on 02/23/2008 10:56:29 AM PST by Bob J
Ever since Super Tuesday a super debate has been raging on FR concerning John McCain. I was never a McCain supporter, in fact I penned the post Super Tuesday post "Official FR Drinking Thread" so we could together drown our common disappointments into oblivion.
FReepers seem to be moving into three distinct groups. The first are those that have always supported McCain, a lot or partially. There are those that don't like McCain but are willing to support him because they believe they will get some of what they want or to defeat what the see as the more critical danger, Obama or Clinton. The there's the third group, those that viscerally dislike McCain and vow never to vote for him for any reason.
The actions and motivation for support from the first two groups seem obvious...they would rather see McCain in the White House than a dem. But for the life of me I cannot understand some of the actions of the third.
Allow me to explain.
I understand you dislike McCain and the reasons why. He is far too liberal on many issues, he has stabbed conservatives in the back several times and he is too cozy with the dems. These are all defensible reasons to not vote for him or to vote third party and you have every right to vote as you see fit and for whatever reasons you hold. What I don't understand is why some here are making such concerted efforts to dissuade others from voting for or supporting him.
As flawed as McCain is there is no way a logical case can be made that we would be better off under Obama or Hillary (O&H). Even on most issues where McCain is closer to the left than to us, O&H are much farther to the left than he is and would do much more damage than McCain. On the issues where he is not, the WOT, taxes, abortion, etc., the differences are stark and this does not even take into count extended issues like judicial appointments.
So why are you working so hard, so viscerlly, so nasty, to turn votes against McCain? If you truly feel as you do than go sit out November or cast your vote for your 3rd party candidate. That makes sense. What doesn't make sense is why you push for a McCain and GOP loss.
It may be as simple as "misery loves company". It may be that you validate your own position by getting others to believe as you do. It may be that there are some dem propaganda plants on FR. I don't know but I sure would like to and I know others do as well.
Sign me up.
What I don't understand is why some here are making such concerted efforts to dissuade others from voting for or supporting him.
I haven't seen that on FR. Quite the opposite. I am seeing what I saw in 2004. Party uber alles.
I'd rather be waterboarded than vote for Juan McCain.
He's done so DARN much stoopid stuff siding with the 'RATS,
who can keep up with it all?!?!
And it's ONE thing to reach across the aisle, but McRINO
goes over there and CAMPS OUT!
I know there have been LOTS of times I wanted to
reach across the aisle MYSELF ... and SLAP some sense
into those fools! But McRINO?? He goes over there and
gets into bed with 'em and stays !!!
LOL! :^D
This is an academic discussion, because I think Obama loses huge in the general election. I think moderate democrats are scared witless by this empty suit, and will vote for McCain - twice if they could.
I wouldn’t have believed that, but my family has voted D all their life and will not vote for Obama for any reason. Amazing to witness them saying all of this but true.
For all of the reasons why I won’t vote for them, my liberal democrat family will. In the words of my brother, “He’s a true democrat, he just feels more like a democrat to me than a republican. It used to be that democrats were for strong national defense, and McCain is.”
As such, I think Conservatives can stay home and polish their silverware on the General and it won’t make a difference. Chances may very well be that he doesn’t carry one state.
Another interesting comment by my family: “Did you know that his middle name is Hussein? Did you know this guy is Muslim?” - Um, yeah - I did. When did you find out? . . .
Surreal, but true.
I think a Republican in the WH that is actually a liberal - he’s to the left of Kennedy, Moynihan, Zell Miller, and Scoop Jackson, can/will do more permanent damage to the US than having a democrat in office.
The R will do the damage, the left will cheer him on, and when the hangover hits the left will blame McCain for buying the booze in the first place.
So, instead of getting four, maybe eight years of a ‘truth-in-advertised’ democrat, we get four years of McCain, plus another eight years of a democrat - for a grand total of 12 years of liberalism in the WH.
I don’t have anything against McCain, but I think the party’s got to go at this point. Limbaugh made a good point last week - Look at what the NYT did to McCain about 30 seconds after McCain had the nomination.
Liberals are liberals. Moderates are simply liberals - they aren’t governing by platform or principle, but by coalition, which is what the liberal party is, the coalition party.
By nominating a liberal this time around, we are conceding the party, and replacing it with a coalition party just a little to the right of the other coalition party.
The natural result of that is a factioning on the right, placing conservatives in their own group.
What do you think the Gang of Fourteen was? It’s european style coaltion factional politics right here in the US.
The folks backing McCain are still clinging to the notion that we have two parties. We don’t. There’s a reason why this Congress got zero done this time around. They have their own conservative faction to deal with, not to mention the diametrically opposed special interests lobbying to a standstill on various bills.
What the party leadership hasn’t come out and said yet is that they do not think there are enough ‘principled’ conservatives left in the country to continue to have a Reaganite, principled platform by which to win elections.
What they ACTUALLY mean is that there aren’t enough CANDIDATES willing to govern by those principles once elected. They so hosed the party’s credibility in the last eight years that everything we once stood for is now up for the coalition most dedicated to represent it.
Face it, we aren’t the ‘small government, pro-life, pro-sovereignty, strict constructionalist, strong national defense, low tax’ party any more.
We, or at least I, am not angry at McCain, and am not voting for him because my panties are in a twist over it. I’m not voting for him because I’m part of the conservative coalition, and I think his election in November will give us 12 to 16 years of that agenda. If his opponent wins, we get 4, maybe eight years tops.
McCain supporters counter with, “What about the Supreme Court?!” What about it? Does a vote for McCain insure a conservative takes those seats that are projected to become vacant? I’m not sure any McCain supporter will sign that particular check and believe it won’t bounce.
I especially believe that if McCain wins without the support of conservatives, then he won’t feel as if he’s under any obligation at all to find an Alito or a Scalia. He’ll find O’Connors or probably someone inscrutable like Souter, who will tack one way or the other after being seated (Souter tacked hard left - seated by a Republican).
Look, good luck to you moderates, and I hope you get your candidate in November. I’m going to write in Thompson.
Say goodnight, Dick.
"Goodnight, Dick!"
Your original post to me was mostly incoherent gibberish, but you somehow managed to get across a cheap shot that “Barrack” [sic] is somehow my “hero.” If that’s not an insult, then I guess I’m free to tell people that I saw you making out with Ted Kennedy under the bleachers at a football game. With all due respect.
That is my Uncle Dan and Uncle Dick, btw.
:)
Maybe this will help!
lolol!
And all this time......I thought they were MY uncles!! : )
I used to LOVE that show!
thats an insult? No its a Fact... If you refuse to vote for McCain or if you vote third party or write in then you are an OBAMA enabler...
Good luck squaring your conscious away with that...
anyway like I said this forum will serve as history for those that enable the Rats... When you get Obama I can continue to complain you my friend cannot.
thats an insult? No its a Fact... If you refuse to vote for McCain or if you vote third party or write in then you are an OBAMA enabler...
Good luck squaring your conscious away with that...
anyway like I said this forum will serve as history for those that enable the Rats... When you get Obama I can continue to complain you my friend cannot.
Stop it, yer killing me...
lol......not my fault, it's Meek's. hehehe
Exactly right, meek!
No, it's a lie. Or do I need to capitalize that? It's a Lie. There, that's better, apparently. Anyway I do not support Obama; he would be a disaster. But so would McCain.
If you refuse to vote for McCain or if you vote third party or write in then you are an OBAMA enabler...
Putting his name in all capital letters doesn't make it true. I just don't think a McCain presidency is necessarily any better for the country or for conservatism then an Obama presidency, in the long run.
Good luck squaring your conscious away with that...
The word is "conscience," and mine is fine.
anyway like I said this forum will serve as history for those that enable the Rats... When you get Obama I can continue to complain you my friend cannot.
Actually you called it a blog for some reason. Anyway you seem to share your McCain's views on free speech; you make a good couple.
You and I are simpatico my friend.
You even talk like McCain. Maybe you can explain to me why he incessantly uses the phrase "my friends" every time he opens his mouth.
Your post was well worth the time.
Thank you.
>>If you refuse to vote for McCain or if you vote third party or write in then you are an OBAMA enabler...<<
You are not helping your cause by telling me how to vote. In fact, I voted against McCain yesterday in the Texas Primary (no, I didn’t vote for Paul or Huck either).
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