Posted on 02/23/2008 10:56:29 AM PST by Bob J
Ever since Super Tuesday a super debate has been raging on FR concerning John McCain. I was never a McCain supporter, in fact I penned the post Super Tuesday post "Official FR Drinking Thread" so we could together drown our common disappointments into oblivion.
FReepers seem to be moving into three distinct groups. The first are those that have always supported McCain, a lot or partially. There are those that don't like McCain but are willing to support him because they believe they will get some of what they want or to defeat what the see as the more critical danger, Obama or Clinton. The there's the third group, those that viscerally dislike McCain and vow never to vote for him for any reason.
The actions and motivation for support from the first two groups seem obvious...they would rather see McCain in the White House than a dem. But for the life of me I cannot understand some of the actions of the third.
Allow me to explain.
I understand you dislike McCain and the reasons why. He is far too liberal on many issues, he has stabbed conservatives in the back several times and he is too cozy with the dems. These are all defensible reasons to not vote for him or to vote third party and you have every right to vote as you see fit and for whatever reasons you hold. What I don't understand is why some here are making such concerted efforts to dissuade others from voting for or supporting him.
As flawed as McCain is there is no way a logical case can be made that we would be better off under Obama or Hillary (O&H). Even on most issues where McCain is closer to the left than to us, O&H are much farther to the left than he is and would do much more damage than McCain. On the issues where he is not, the WOT, taxes, abortion, etc., the differences are stark and this does not even take into count extended issues like judicial appointments.
So why are you working so hard, so viscerlly, so nasty, to turn votes against McCain? If you truly feel as you do than go sit out November or cast your vote for your 3rd party candidate. That makes sense. What doesn't make sense is why you push for a McCain and GOP loss.
It may be as simple as "misery loves company". It may be that you validate your own position by getting others to believe as you do. It may be that there are some dem propaganda plants on FR. I don't know but I sure would like to and I know others do as well.
I have to agree with you on some points, but I think that we are going to be stuck with the candidates as we see them now. McCain was certainly not my first choice. I will be voting for him in Nov. The two Dem. candidates would have dire and long lasting consequences.. IMHO.
For too long its been assumed that being Republican means we are Conservative, or a member of the ‘vast right wing blah blah blah’ It is far too simplistic to say that those who do not support John McCain are just angry, bitter people who didn’t get their way. While some individuals here act just that way, I assume more are just tired of watching the GOP move to the left and trying to drag Conservatives with it.
G-3?
G-3?
BINGO!
Wanna bet?
McCain will beat either Hillary or Obama. Tougher with them on the same ticket though.
McCain will win Florida, Ohio and maybe even Pennsylvania. Here's a prediction for ya. If McCain wins Pennsylvania the Republicans will regain the House.
I have saved a link to this thread to save your thoughts on McCain for the future. Thank you, good job.
You have been speaking with clarity since the day I joined FR. Don't stop!
The participation in the primary voting process means nothing and hardly ever is it a reflection of the behavior how people vote in the general election. If we use your logic we would have had Presidents Gore and Kerry based upon the primary participation in 2000 and 2004. November is what matters.
“McCain only ‘talked’ about Amensty”
That is a flat out lie.
And since breathing is an autonomic function of the brain, not a cognitive one requiring conscious effort of thought, the unthinking repetitiveness of your postings is explained.
That’s what I’m thinking.
Once McCain's "friends" in the MSM have finished beating him like a rented mule, he'll wax nostalic for the Viet Cong and the Hanoi Hilton. No one so dumb to ever believe that Pinch Sulzberger respected him and would give him a fare shake is even fit to be the assistant manager of a shoe store.
Maybe Mac should change middle name from "Sidney" to "Patsy". Senator John Patsy McCain...it really does have a nice ring, don't you think?
You hit it on the head with that sentence. McCain supporters and conservatives are two different animals. You can't be both.
No one should be near the nuclear foot ball with McCain temper. End of story.
An excellent point. Conservative support for the GOP has been a marriage of convenience. But, as with any marriage of convenience, if the bride they offer is just too ugly, even the most desperate groom will say no.
Exactly right, I think an election with McCain as presidential nominee is going to be a disaster for Repubs...good Repubs will lose in state and congressional races. We are going to be embarrassed. I fear it could be like the Dems loss when Mondale ran. The media has lots of dirt on McCain...it’s going to be awful.
Pretty much sums it up for me, here behind door number 3.
Look, I cannot vote for McQueeg. I firmly maintain that he offers little difference between the other two socialists. My fond hope would be that Pubbies in the House and Senate would suddenly find that they could stand up to a Democratic Party President, in a way that they would not be able to do if the guy in the WH has an 'R' behind his name.
As for people "working so hard, so viscerlly (sic) viscerally, so nasty, to turn votes against McCain?" I really don't see that. Instead, the most nasty posts seem to be coming from those who are pushing hard to convert the third doors to McAmnesty's side.
No thinking person would attempt to advance an argument that the country will be better off under Yobama or Bilary. I'm sorry, but I just don't see the country being any better off with McCain. I think that, provided the Pubbies "grow a set" during the first two years of whichever socialist is elected (and, heaven help us, it will likely be a socialist from the Democratic Party)in November, there is a chance for substantial gains in the House and Senate for those running as Republicans.
You know you are correct. Ten years ago McCain was acceptable to conservatives. Then Bush beat him in the 2000 primaries, he has had an eight year hissy fit since then. He has punished conservatives ruthlessly...is this the kind of man we want in the White House. I say no.
For those in groups 1 & 2, How do you believe McCain would perform as a President compared to his performance as a Senator?
Did 3 times as many Democrats vote in the primaries in 2004 and 2000/
Look McCain has nothing to offer me, he is working against my positions on almost every issue, except the war in Iraq. He claims to be moderating his positions on the WOT, but even that is offensive to me because the only reason he was against the Homeland Security bill, the wiretaps and the waterboarding was to make Bush and the conservatives look bad and build up his image with the MSM.
I am so disgusted with the way this primary was run and the way McCain manipulated it that I am thinking of changing my registration to Independent because the GOP has nothing to offer me.
As in not convinced because Barrack your Hero Obama is gonna pull the troops out of Iraq on day one and make peace with Osama by sitting down with him over a HOOKAH... that convinced?
I’m with you!!
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