Posted on 09/30/2007 6:50:03 PM PDT by blam
New Zealand in flap over plans for new flag
By Nick Squires in Sydney
Last Updated: 1:56am BST 01/10/2007
Union flag or rugby ponga?
New Zealand's prime minister, Helen Clark, has suggested removing the Union flag from her country's national flag.
Ms Clark said that removing the British emblem would "New Zealandise" the flag, leaving it as a stylised Southern Cross on a blue background.
New Zealanders have agonised for years over whether to change their national emblem, with some recoiling at the inclusion of the Union flag and wanting it replaced with a Maori-influenced design.
The most favoured alternative design is a silver fern, in Maori a ponga, on a black background — the emblem of the All Blacks national rugby team since 1893.
Others argue that the flag needs to be changed because it is all but identical to the Australian flag — only the colour and number of the Southern Cross stars are different.
Monarchists fear the removal of the Union flag could be the first step in a drive towards declaring New Zealand a republic.
An editorial in the New Zealand Herald said Ms Clark's suggestion should be opposed.
"The Southern Cross in a sea of blue locates us in the South Pacific and the Union flag in the corner represents our many positive British traditions," it said. "In a world racked by conflict, corruption, intolerance and bad governance, these traditions should be protected and encouraged."
But Ms Clark said New Zealand could ditch the Union flag, just as Canada adopted its maple leaf flag in 1964, without having to become a republic or change its constitutional relationship with Britain.
The two issues should be kept separate, she said. "I think people could debate the flag the way Canada did when it transitioned to the maple leaf without it calling into question the basic constitutional status. Canada, of course, still recognises the Queen as its head of state as well," she said.
Her suggestion sparked an intense debate in online newspaper forums, with some contributors in favour of the change.
"Our flag does not fill me with pride and has no real meaning for most. It is far too similar to the Australian flag," one New Zealand Herald reader wrote.
But others said the flag represented New Zealand's British heritage and should be retained.
"One thing that many people seem to have forgotten is that we have inherited the British political and justice systems. The Union flag represents this and I believe is something that is under valued," wrote another reader.
An Auckland man said New Zealand forces had fought under the flag in two world wars. "It's part of our history, it's who we are and it allies us with friends," he said.
Two years ago a lobby group, NZFlag.com, attempted to collect 270,000 signatures — 10 per cent of eligible voters — to force a referendum on changing the flag.
The campaign was abandoned when the petition did not attract enough supporters.
I agree, Mr Clark wants to denigrate all of those that served under the Union Jack and probably won more VC’s per capita, plus a few bars, than any.
looks like a tea-towel...that’s aussie for a cloth one dries plates, knives and forks with...
And I’ve always thought it appropriate that the Kiwi flag stars are red.
Damn, UKian, that is good. As an ex UKian of 381 years distance I think we did pretty good. We introduced the idea of Representative government and the rule of law, we are not slaves, for now. I kinda like to think that we and the limies to a certain extent had a positive effect on the world stage.
1775
1777
General Washington wants to denigrate all Americans of those that served under the Union Jack! Bastards! God save good King George III!
The old flag looks good to us, but what do we yanks know ?
Does my heart good when someone just recounts simple facts.
I shouldn't ordinarily think that doing so would be that difficult, but I suppose I continually underestimate the historical revisionist morons.
Well said, and FReegards!
What nonsense. Austrailia’s flag has more stars to start.
Last time any of my ancestors did the Union Jack was the Frog and Indian war. Because of some poofs and Nancy boys in the Parlement who tried to bugger us with Taxes with out consent, we said shagg off.
Other than that we might still have a Union Jack in the corner.
how we remain upright I don't know...
LOL.
That is funny!
Not quite.
The Australian rendition of the constellation Crux (the Southern Cross) is more accurate, and includes five stars instead of the four shown on the New Zealand flag. (Epsilon Crucis is omitted from the New Zealand flag).
Australia's flag also contains the Commonwealth Star under the Union Flag, to symbolise the union of the Australian colonies into a single nation in 1901. New Zealand, incidentally, could have chosen to be part of that Federation, and the Australian Constitution includes language to reflect that.
They are similar flags, and that is partly a reflection of the fact that both the Australian, and New Zealand flag (as well as that of the Colony, later State, of Victoria - the first Victorian flag was almost identical to the current Australian flag) were based on an earlier design for the Anti-Transportation League Flag used througout the Australasian colonies in the early to mid 19th century).
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