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Posted on 05/16/2007 1:25:01 PM PDT by dcwusmc
My response would be to nuke Mecca, destroy their “holy” stone, prevent the new caliphate from ever happening and thus destroy their false and failed religion. Quick and easy. Then they can all convert to Christianity or Judaism and we can all sing Kumbaya and live in peace and harmony forever.
Islam has looked upon us as infidels since the time of Thomas Jefferson, when they were attacking our shipping as ‘The Barbary Pirates’. They can give any excuses they want, the Crusades, our support for Israel, US soldiers in their ‘Holy Places’ but the fact is they look upon us as not worthy to exist because we don’t accept their cult.
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I get a bit annoyed with those who want us to conform to the Islamists twisted view of how things should be just so they might be less inclined to kill us. Notice I said less inclined because I would not bet on bending to their silliness doing much good.
These are the guys that do "pit inspections" to make sure men have shaved properly. Comply with one rule and they will come up with some other bit of nonsense.
Someone once compared it to being in an abusive relationship. They were pretty much dead on.
The main motivation for an abuser is control. They want to control everything around them. If those they want to control don't do exactly as they order then they must be punished or even killed. You can't do anything about this type of person except lock them up or kill them. There is no appeasing them in any lasting fashion.
And no, bombing Mecca will not do it. Because the problem is inside the minds of people who are able to rationalize anything
Turn the rock to dust and they will just claim that it is now spread over the whole world and that means that now the whole planet belongs to them.
Conforming hasn’t done the french much good, has it? We rest our case.
And now I must head off to work. Have a great day!
People actually START their day at this hour?
Good night.
The policy we should’ve had in effect to prevent terrorist attacks on the US like 9/11 would’ve been to seek out Islamic wackos like Osama bin Laden and whack them before they whack us.
By the way, it’s called we win, they lose.
Google reference, for the whipper snappers.
bookmark for later
Amen, Brother Jim, preach on!
It is interesting to me that many continue to look for complex or complicated reasons underlying the mulsims hate for America.
It’s not. They hate us and want to destroy us and do not operate rationally. Therefore, you cannot rationalize your way out of this. Destruction is unacceptable. Therefore, the only possible viability is the destruction of them.
That is the game. Pure and simple. This is not the plot of an X-File episode, where the story is about the twisted, contorted, complicated truth under the conspriacy. It is as simple as it appears.
Accept it or die.
The US has been importing oil from the Middle East for a very long time and by doing so we have maintained decent relationships with the Saudis and their official government.
The problem lies deeper though. Internally in Saudi their social system was considered unjust. It is really hard core class warfare, and quite heavily reliant on socialist ideals. In Saudi though those problems were personified. The rich got really rich and if you were born a sheep herder you stayed a sheep herder. It was almost a caste system by default.
What has happend over time is the roots of revolution took place and the House of Saud is viewed as corrupt and evil by some of those within.
In reality there are in some minds a justification for that thought because social injustice has been extremely prevelant.
Basically the Saudi system isn't pristine. There is torture and pretty much there are many who never have any hope to move up in society.
Hence, bin Laden preaches his version of justice and equity which has a populist ring to it. Then he goes radical. The Saudi government feared/fears him because he wanted to lead an inssurrection.
This group though saw part of the problem in their own country, internally, as being an external influence. AKA The US.
This group saw the US as propping up a regime that they don't like and that they want to overthrow.
The US was trying to have a balancing act. We didn't interfere in Saudi internal affairs, but we also maintained strong relations with them. We sent A LOT of money, and have helped stabilize the country at times.
For the group that views them as a whole rotten apple, they attach the US with their internal struggle and in order to fix whats at home they have to 'fix' the US.
Hence almost all the hijackers were Saudis and the intense hatred of the US by them. With that group bin laden is a popular populist who is fighting for the little man for a more equitable system of justice.
You can see how he can become popular when you are talking about a country with a social system (historically) that has operated like Saudi Arabia.
The real fix?
1. Pressure the Saudis to make a better system in house. Which, that, I know is going on now.
2. Iraq isn't just about Iraq. A lot of those sentiments in Saudi were not exclusive to Saudi. Hence our invasion into Iraq is geared overall at changing the tone.
If we succeed, and a lot of people want it to succeed, then you take away the ideological weapons that these extreme groups use to recruit.
Success being defined as having a relatively stable country where the average joe can go to work get a job and support his family. If he wants to go to college and make more money, give him the chance. That is very basic stuff, but historically its been denied.
If you were the wrong religion, or the wrong family, too bad for you.
Right now, the violence in Iraq is a fight for the survival of extremeism. If we succeed in stablizing a major Middle Eastern country then the extremeist can no longer point to their CORE tools of thought.
If we succeed, they go extinct. Hence they are fighting for their lives.
As for the US contribution, we were viewed as sustaining a corrupt system in their country.
In other words we are damned if we do and damned if we don't. If we did intervene and meddle in every nit picking thing then we are even more condemned. If we operate at arms length (as we did) we are viewed as the core of their social problem.
Looking at what you just wrote, I think it would be more accurate to say that what these "men" fear, MOSTLY, is that their women will have sex with other men. At times it seems as if, oh, 80% of Islam is devoted to preventing this. In other words, its appeal is, in large part, to insecure, jealous men who fear themselves inadequate.
I'm actually being serious here.
Those who want to examine the ‘root causes’ of Bin Laden and Islamist attacks on America and the West look to the attackers’ own words and conclude that US foreign intervention was the precipitating cause (see Ron Paul in the latest Republican debate).
An examination of those same words reveal three things.
ONE that Bin Laden tremendously distorts US actions. This manipulative distortion means that acts that we take will always be used by them to justify violence. Even when we have not acted they invent conspiracies and blame us. For the latest of these concocted justifications which were used to incite violence see the Koran flushing incident and Danish cartoon publication. A free civilization such as ours can not, will not and should not change itself to appease those who are looking for excuses to attack us.
TWO, Bin Laden finds Koranic provocation for attacking us and abdicating treaties and peaceful co-existence even when the life of a single Muslim is affected. [”He (Allah’s Blessings and Salutations be upon him) considered the treaty with Bani Qainuqa’ void because one of their Jews publicly hurt one Muslim woman, one single woman, at the market.”]
THREE, Bin Laden repeatedly and at length cites our weakness, our lack of determination, our fear as his greatest provocation. IOW he knows he can win.
...........................
DECLARATION OF WAR AGAINST THE AMERICANS OCCUPYING THE LAND OF THE TWO HOLY PLACES (1996)
“A few days ago the news agencies had reported that the Defence Secretary of the Crusading Americans had said that the explosions at Riyadh and Al-Khobar had taught him one lesson: that is not to withdraw when attacked by cowardly terrorists.
We say to the Defence Secretary that his talk could induce a grieving mother to laughter! And it shows the fears that have enveloped you all. Where was this courage of yours when the explosion in Beirut took place in 1983 CE (1403 A.H). You were transformed into scattered bits and pieces; 241 soldiers were killed, most of them Marines. And where was this courage of yours when two explosions made you to leave Aden in less than twenty-four hours!
But your most disgraceful case was in Somalia; where, after vigorous propaganda about the power of the USA and its post-cold war leadership of the new world order, you moved tens of thousands of international forces, including twenty-eight thousand American solders, into Somalia. However, when tens of your solders were killed in minor battles and one American Pilot was dragged in the streets of Mogadishu, you left the area in disappointment, humiliation, and defeat, carrying your dead with you. Clinton appeared in front of the whole world threatening and promising revenge , but these threats were merely a preparation for withdrawal. You had been disgraced by Allah and you withdrew; the extent of your impotence and weaknesses became very clear. It was a pleasure for the heart of every Muslim and a remedy to the chests of believing nations to see you defeated in the three Islamic cities of Beirut, Aden, and Mogadishu.
I say to the Secretary of Defence: The sons of the land of the two Holy Places had come out to fight against the Russians in Afghanistan, the Serbs in Bosnia and Herzegovina, and today they are fighting in Chechnya, and by the Permission of Allah, they have been made victorious over your partner, the Russians. By the command of Allah, they are also fighting in Tajikistan.
“Our toughness has, O Amroo, tired the enemies before you, never giving in!”
‘snip’
“Those youths know that the reward in fighting you, the USA, is double than the reward in fighting someone not from the People of the Book. They have no intention except to enter paradise by killing you. An infidel, an enemy of God like you, cannot be in the same heaven with his righteous executioner. “
‘snip’
Those youth are different from your soldiers. Your problem will be how to convince your troops to fight, while our problem will be how to restrain our youth to wait for their turn in fighting and in operations. These youths are commendable and praiseworthy.
http://www.meij.or.jp/new/Osama%20bin%20Laden/jihad1.htm
“when people see a strong horse and a weak horse, by nature, they will like the strong horse.”
http://www.greatdreams.com/osama_tape.htm
The people who believe that we are creating jihadists by fighting in Iraq should listen to Bin Laden who understands the Muslim psyche. The best way to stop the Jihad is to be the strong horse. Muslim public opinion of us was best after we went in to Afghanistan and removed the Taliban quickly and effectively.
We used to know this. It took a Nixon to make peace in China, a Reagan to end the Cold War and a Sharon to end the Intifadah.
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