Can a good Muslim be a good American?

A friend who knows | 8/11/2006 | Agent Smith

[Agent Smith]

I ask my fellow freepers indulgence for this vanity, because I believe it is too important to be buried in the back of the forum.

Can a good Muslim be a good American? I sent that question to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years.

The following is his reply:

Theologically - no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, the moon god of Arabia.

Religiously - no. Because no other religion is accepted by his Allah except Islam (Quran, 2:256)

Scripturally - no. Because his allegiance is to the five pillars of Islam and the Quran (Koran).

Geographically - no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in prayer five times a day.

Socially - no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.

Politically - no. Because he must submit to the mullah (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and Destruction of America, the great Satan.

Domestically - no. Because he is instructed to marry four women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him (Quran 4:34).

Intellectually - no. Because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.

Philosophically - no. Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and expression. Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or autocratic.

Spiritually - no. Because when we declare "one nation under God," the Christian's God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in The Quran's 99 excellent names.

Therefore after much study and deliberation...perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both "good" Muslims and good Americans. Call it what you wish...it's still the truth. The more who understand this, the better it will be for our country and our future. The war is bigger than most Americans know or understand.

[farmer18th]

Can a good Muslim be a good American? Of course they can. And millions are.

"Good", "moderate" muslims in the west (if they exist),have this problem: how do you defend a religion that has not produced one western style representative democracy in its entire history? Christians and Jews can point to free states, with Judeo-Christian majorities, that protect the rights of the minority. Whenever a state has a majority Muslim population, what we know of as civil rights go out the window. A Muslim in the west, living within a Christian majority, is something like a virus under containment. If the virus multiplies...

[Sans-Culotte]

Even worse, they believe that, unless you're a physical member of the Catholic Church, you will end up in hell.

Anybody who believes in their religion or god, should believe such things. I am not a Catholic, but I have absolutely no problem with the Catholic belief that I am damned for not being part of what they determine "the true church". They can believe it all the live-long day as far as I am concerned as long as they do not kill me for not converting.

Anybody who claims to be religious, but accepts other religions as being equal to theirs is not religious at all, IMO. For example, I personally believe Muslims do not worship "the true God", and are likely damned. But, hey, that's their choice. If they want to face Mecca and pray to Satan, that's their problem.

[frogjerk]

I am a Christian before I am an American. The United States will not save my eternal soul. Christianity teaches you to be a good citizen. The United States promotes Christian values so the two should not be in conflict. When they are, Christ needs to be first and Christians should be first to work for a better America in a constructive way.

[isthisnickcool]

Why not ovens and gas chambers?

The NAZIS murdered a lot of folks. The US and other countries killed NAZIS until that stopped. The NAZIS did not just happen to pop up one day and have the power to kill a whole group of people. They worked very hard to obtain that power then use it in the most evil of ways.

America would never do to moslems what the NAZIS did to the JEWS. And "Islamic Facists" will never do to Americans what the NAZIS did to the Jews. Not at the end of the day. Because when it comes down to it was have a lot of friggin guns and ammo. What I have a problem with is that like the NAZIS the moslems sprcifically want to kill all the Jews then get around to the "infidels". They better re-rhink that and they would be well advised to do way with groups like CAIR. But they won't, because behind the closed mosque doors the handlers of islam want the same thing the NAZIS did. And that's a problem.

[kabar]

Its danger lies at its very heart: the Koran's requirements to kill the infidel, take territory by force, and never retreat one inch.

Muslims weren't behind the two most destructive wars in history, i.e., WWI and WWII.

[durasell]

Read up on a guy named sayyid qutb. Lots of material on the net.

[wita]

There is nothing in the Constitution of the United States of America, that is incompatible with Christian principles or commandments.

[Condor51]

Can a good Muslim be a good American? I sent that question to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years. The following is his reply:....

With due respect to your 'friend' and his experience in SA, he can kiss my a$$. The answer to your question is a YES.

I stay off the Arab-Muslim bashing threads because I find them reprehensible. As I know Muslims, I do work for Muslims. And I'll tell you, they the the most decent, honest and HONORABLE people I've dealt with in 36 years in the Construction Industry. Not once, have they lied or misled me - and in construction that's rare. Even your 'friends' want the upper hand regarding contracts.

I've worked with and for; Catholics, Jews, 'Christians' and probably Atheists and have gotten F*CKED by all them - except the Muslims I've been working with and for over the last few years (pre 9-11). And after 9-11 when I was at their office, what did they have hanging - an American Flag and two pictures of President Bush and a Christmas card FROM Bush. One pic was the autographed one JUST LIKE MINE, which you got for contributing a hell of a lot of money!

For fun exchange 'Arab' for Jew, or 'Islam' for Judaism and then take a good look at the comments on the threads. Jezzus, you'd think this was 1933 and this was NAZI Germany, only worse; 'round them up, bomb them, nuke them, kill them all, shoot them, blah, blah, blah'. It's disgusting, pure hate and yes, antisemitism (Arabs ARE Semites too, more so than Jews actually).

So YES Muslims can be good Americans - I know.

Btw, wanna know which religion (or is it a 'race' I get confused) I've been screwed by the most in 36 years, well here's a hint - it has nothing to do with Jesus.

And I wont be responding to any replies so don't bother with the insults as I have to get to work on the project (one of many) I'm doing for Muslims.

[Ace of Spades]

"This proposal is so un-Constitutional as to be ludicrous, and it makes me sad that posters on a site devoted to freedom would advocate it."

Agreed. It's really starting to be depressing coming here. The wingnuts have taken over.

/First cry of "Traitor!!!!" in 3.... 2.... 1....

[DarthVader]

I agree with you but if there are enough terrorist cells are in this country and carry out attacks the temptation to do the same will become overwhelming and the population will put pressure on their leaders to protect them. The imposition of martial law on the general population is not a viable nor practical option.

[Jacquerie]

We just would not be America anyore.

Quite true. Our nation, governed by magnificent federal and state Constitutions which take particular care to protect liberties, has a tough time dealing with liberals and islamists who wish to destroy it. While I am not in favor of broad restrictions on islam, I think any imam or mosque congregation that espouses violence against us should be shut down and the non-citizen congregants deported. As for home grown islamists, we'll just have to live with them as we do with American hating liberals.

[TimesDomain]

Notice the addition of how American Christians see themselves but the blatant GAP of how do muslims in the USA see themselves.

this intentional ommision of data tells me that it is probably 1% want to assimilate into the U.S. and 99% want to assimilate the U.S. into islamic hell

[frogjerk]

A good muslims first allegiance is to islam, which is quite clear in its exhortations to conquer the infidels and convert them to islam.

A good Christian's first allegiance is to God as well but, is quite clear in its exhortations to be a good citizen.

[tacticalogic]

That's truly disturbing ... nearly half of alleged Christians in the United States put their Earthly citizenship ahead of their Heavenly citizenship. They claim to be worshipping the Lord God Almighty ... in fact, they're worshipping the United States Congress. Pathetic. God is First. Always.

What does "rendering unto Ceasar" mean in a self-governing constitutional republic?

[meema]

Islam seeks to conquer the world as surely as the Nazis or Communists. Denial of this fact is suicidal.

Any "good" muslim will be killed by the muslims...as well as all the rest of us. It took me all these years to reach this conclusion.

Trying to help the Iraqis establish something that remotely resembles democracy is hopeless.

[Coldwater Creek]

Why are you defensive of Muslims?

[kabar]

Name another 'religion' that is consistently producing terror, death and horror FROM IT'S PULPITS. With anything dangerous and destructive we look for the source if we want to stop it. ISLAM is producing these 'radicals'. ISLAM IS THE PROBLEM and THE ENEMY.

Historically, Christianity has not exactly been free from spawning persecution, wars, death, and destruction. There are 1.2 billion Muslims in the world. A very, very small percentage of them are producing "terror, death, and horror." They are trying to radicalize the religion and we are playing into their hands by demonizing Islam and all muslims.

[Ace of Spades]

"the only reason that I would not want them all thrown into the gas chambers and ovens."

I'm glad you've finally revealed yourself for who you truly are. I can't imagine what it must be like to walk around with that kind of blinding hate constantly, all the time.