Creationism dismissed as 'a kind of paganism' by Vatican's astronomer

The Scotsman ^ | May 5, 2006 | IAN JOHNSTON

[Right Wing Professor]

BELIEVING that God created the universe in six days is a form of superstitious paganism, the Vatican astronomer Guy Consolmagno claimed yesterday.

Brother Consolmagno, who works in a Vatican observatory in Arizona and as curator of the Vatican meteorite collection in Italy, said a "destructive myth" had developed in modern society that religion and science were competing ideologies.

He described creationism, whose supporters want it taught in schools alongside evolution, as a "kind of paganism" because it harked back to the days of "nature gods" who were responsible for natural events.

Brother Consolmagno argued that the Christian God was a supernatural one, a belief that had led the clergy in the past to become involved in science to seek natural reasons for phenomena such as thunder and lightning, which had been previously attributed to vengeful gods. "Knowledge is dangerous, but so is ignorance. That's why science and religion need to talk to each other," he said.

"Religion needs science to keep it away from superstition and keep it close to reality, to protect it from creationism, which at the end of the day is a kind of paganism - it's turning God into a nature god. And science needs religion in order to have a conscience, to know that, just because something is possible, it may not be a good thing to do."

Brother Consolmagno, who was due to give a speech at the Glasgow Science Centre last night, entitled "Why the Pope has an Astronomer", said the idea of papal infallibility had been a "PR disaster". What it actually meant was that, on matters of faith, followers should accept "somebody has got to be the boss, the final authority".

"It's not like he has a magic power, that God whispers the truth in his ear," he said.

[Dimensio]

The evolutionary process really appears to be true* But ever since Darwin's day, unfortunately, it has been used like a crowbar to "prove" - or rather to assert - wildly unscientific claims that Mankind is simply another beast, ot that we have no free will, or There Is No God.

Curious that you say this. The only individuals whom I have observed making such claims regarding the implications of the theory of evolution are creationists.

[balrog666]

Whacked-out whackos placemarker.

[js1138]

Evolution itself embodies a kind of free will. Life as string puppet would not.

Evolution shares a characteristic of human existence, in that phenomena are shaped by consequenses.

[VadeRetro]

I wouldn't post on this thread if you paid me.

I'm not even going to read this one.

[trashcanbred]

Actually I sort of disagree with what he said (well what little I skimmed). Does anyone know the Time dilation factor?

[Constantine XIII]

We know that time passes differently for observers in different reference frames within the universe. What can we say about how time passes for the omnipotent creator of the universe, who is not bound by it, nor is contained within it? :)

[Dimensio]

I do not understand how Antony Flew's acceptance of a "prime mover" deity last year relates to the current discussion. Antony Flew did not convert to Catholicism, nor does he reject the theory of evolution.

[PatrickHenry]

Does anyone know the Time dilation factor?

Does anyone not? Lorentz factor. Also: Time dilation.

[RadioAstronomer]

Me too. You couldn't drag me to post on this thread.

Nor me! :-)

[TXnMA]

this insignificant ball of mud

"jeez. You don't think much of creation do you?"

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Quite the contrary. I am aware, though, that when the Creator gave the creation account in Genesis to Moses, mankind was capable of seeing only two galaxies:

1. a luminous "cloud" of stars across the sky (part of our own "milky Way" galaxy)

2. a very faint, fuzzy spot near the constellation of Cassiopeia (M31, the "great Andromeda Galaxy")

This, OTOH, is a peek at a tiny area of Creation as we are now able to see it:

FYI, only a handful of objects in that "Hubble Deep Field" frame are (nearby, individual) stars. The vast majority are galaxies -- many of them far larger than our own.

By comparison, "this insignificant ball of mud" is of vanishingly-small consequence.

Contrary to your assessment of me, my understanding and vision of Creation (and of the Creator) is far, far more vast and awesome than the (human) recorder of Genesis could have possibly imagined.

FYI, I also think far too highly of my Saviour to ever use a (lower-case) bastardization of His Name as a leading expletive... :-(

[RadioAstronomer]

the atomic clocks on GPS satellites have to run at a different rates than those on the ground in order to stay in synch.

Actually we have clocks so precise that they "see" a difference between the floors of a building. :-)

[GSlob]

"One time a preacher got up in front of the congregation and stated that a person who has an artificial heart could not go to Heaven because God dwells in the heart."
Well, he simply did not finish his postulation, or maybe it's you who truncated the quote: obviously, such a person could go to artificial Heaven, for an artificial God was dwelling in his artificial heart. See, how easy!

[RadioAstronomer]

I'm not even going to read this one.

I'm not reading it either. LOL!

[PatrickHenry]

Actually we have clocks so precise that they "see" a difference between the floors of a building.

Yes. It's an outrage! I hate it when different floors are out of sync. You'd think by now we could construct time-proof buildings. And if not, then we should have only one-story buildings so we're all together, time-wise.

[King Prout]

oh, my... we might need some beer and popcorn.

[AnnaZ]

I'm sorry, I can't disagree with any of this. :-)

And thus, again, you are aptly named.

= )

[trashcanbred]

I mean does anyone know the time dilation factor for God? I would imagine God's clock doesn't run at the same rate as ours right? Not trying to give the CRID'ers any backing but time dilation is a real observable phenomena right? This is one example I think they can argue their point with a modicum of success.

[King Prout]

soma?

[SoothingDave]

Thank you for the pleasant exchange and have a wonderful weekend.

SD

[VadeRetro]

I'm not even thinking about it.