Posted on 04/03/2006 10:02:15 AM PDT by Abathar
INDIANAPOLIS -- A school principal in Indianapolis suspended an eighth-grader for 10 days and recommended he be expelled for carrying a pocket knife, even though the boy said he had forgotten the weapon was in his coat pocket and turned it over to school officials as soon as he entered the building.
An expulsion hearing has been scheduled for April 10.
Elliot Voge, 14, told Stoneybrook Middle School principal Jimmy Meadows he forgot that he had left the Swiss Army knife in his pocket after using it to whittle wood last month. The next day, just after he was dropped off at school by a classmate's mother, he said he discovered the knife in his coat and immediately went to the office.
Nevertheless, Meadows suspended him and recommended expulsion. The action stunned the boy's parents, who hired a lawyer to represent him at the hearing next week.
No doubt. Its like a Jewish girl turning her Jewish parents over to the Nazis and expecting them to do nothing harmful to her.
Fairly sure the kid won't trust "officials" ever again.
In the 80s an outdoor survival class was required for moving beyond middle school where I grew up. Part of it consisted of gun safety, and we had to carry BB guns around a lot (with the teacher watching for unsafe acts). We also had to bring knives to do various survival lessons.
I wonder if that school still teaches that class. And if they do, do the kids bring knives and walk around with guns?
Adults make stupid decisions every day, too. Should knives be universally banned?
My dad and then my husband, carried a pocket knife every day of their life. I think my father in law did too. I always assumed that it was something a man had in his pocket, like his billfold and sometimes a pocket hanky. My sons had to obtain the cub scout certification (yes, cub scout, not boy scout) and then each was allowed to own a knife. I remember going with my second son to puchase a small Swiss Army Knife. Oh my goodness. He was so proud.
"Zero tolerance" has come to mean "zero brains for administrators" (sometimes not that much of a step down, come to think of it...). Was it not Solzenitsyn that lamented that the West had gone from a society of Law to a society of [mere] Rules?
They are in some situations aren't they?
Honesty is not the best policy when dealing with corrupt and/or stupid people in positions of authority:
"...when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice - you may know that your society is doomed." -- Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
I'd be interested to see any rational defense of your position than you might possibly be able to give.
Seriously.
It utterly flies in the face of my experience from childhood, to raising children, to teaching in middle school and high school.
But, in all that time, maybe I've missed something.
Our teen carries his Swiss army knife to school every day and uses it regularly -- oh wait a minute, never mind, he's homeschooled.
Serioiusly, this is a multipled sourced story. The story posted is a short story that mostly detailed one said, but the story I linked to provided every detail to the questions you asked and included many excerpts from the prinicples expulsion letter that did nothing but verify everything this kid and his parents have said. You first objection had some rationality to it, but you have fallen off that wagon.
I suppose I'd say that if this is all there is to the story, the principal is completely wrong. But many times, lawyers will advise their client to say nothing, so you really don't get the full story until the actual trial/hearing.
From the principal's comments, he really appears to be saying that its a zero tolerance policy, and that's the end of the matter. I think he's pretty clearly wrong on that, but we'll have to see how it comes out.
The principal may be reluctant to create an "I forgot" precedent that will let students who bring weapons to school intentionally claim they just forgot about it later if it's discovered. I still think that's crummy rationale, because there's no harm in letting a student turn in a knife or something before it is discovered rather than after.
Anyway, I don't blame you for your skepticism. We've all been burned too many times by one-sided stories that turn out not to be completely true.
Zero-Intelligence policies. Same punishment he'd get if he left it in his pocket and got caught.
And less than he'd get if he harrassed a teacher.
If he had simply walked back out of school and gone down to a local illegal immigrant rally he'd probably not even get punished.
I will totally acknowledge that it probably comes from raising 2 girls, and not boys. Although my younger daughter owns several Swiss army knives, 2 rifles and a shotgun. But she doesn't take them to school. Is there a need for her to take any of those things to school?
spam them to death.they deserve it
In your dreams!
It would seem that you don't have experience with private schools.
The power brokers are the big donors; what they say goes.
I've been on staff at a private Christian school. They had drug, sex, and all the same other problems, just more successfully hidden.
Also, private schools are magnets for misfits that can't handle public schools.
Oh yes, even pointy objects like pens and pencils can be weapons. The only writing instruments that should be allowed in publik skrewls are jumbo crayons. And never mind Ritalin, the kids should all be kept in line with Thorazine.
When I was in middle school, some of the students would spend some of their free time fly-tying - as in fishing flies. Get done with some studying, and the tool kits would emerge. Small vises, scissors, tweezers, exacto knives. All probably banned these days under zero tolerance policies. Same kids would these days get expelled for talking about shotgun chokes, dressing a deer, setting traps for ground hogs, etc. The publik skrewls are out to create a generation of nancy-boys.
Funny thing is, I don't think the schools are safer now than they were back then.
Zero tolerance. What a wonderful policy. They have just taught this kid to be dishonest. He will remember this lesson forever.
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