Posted on 08/20/2005 10:52:05 PM PDT by joanie-f
And thanks to several fellow FReepers (especially ForGod'sSake, squantos and tet68) for a correction and especially kind comments on the original post. :)
OK, works for me.
You can duplicate ping me anytime. I might miss something good otherwise.
Sounds like a plan. And since it is a workable plan you can rest assured that it'll never be accepted or approved of by the PTB in DC.
Apologies for any duplicate pings. On the suggestion of several fellow FReepers I am posting this as a thread of its own, after having posted it on another thread.
And thanks to several fellow FReepers (especially ForGod'sSake, squantos and tet68) for a correction and especially kind comments on the original post. :)
But that's exactly why our so-called leaders will not build such a simple and effective fence system. It would work, and would run counter to their goal of integrating the USA into the "North American Union," with one common border.
"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government,
1. The act of invading; the act of encroaching upon the rights or possessions of another; encroachment; trespass.
One has to realize that the Bush family is intent on making half-Mexican George P. Bush (W's nephew) the Governor of Texas. The border will stay open through '08...and may be the issue that puts the Hildabeast into the Oval Office.
You all know that I agree with you...
Crosslinked:
For "Thunder on the Border," click the picture:
And thanks to several fellow FReepers (especially ForGod'sSake, squantos and tet68) for a correction and especially kind comments on the original post. :)
The cost of such a fence is what we spend on illegal aliens every month in prisons, education, medical care etc.
It truly does boggle the mind. After 9/11 all immigration from 25 or 26 Muslim countries should have been halted, all non-citizens from those countries returned to their homelands and the borders secured. It's been done in the past. Unfortunately, the fear of being labeled a racist or unfair to a particular group of people by liberal America is stronger than the fear of terrorist bombings by Muslim immigrants legal or illegal. Incredibly, I see more burkas (and I see them often) now then before 9/11 (when I encountered NONE).
Excellent article, joanie, and well written!
BTW, if your facts are correct, your idea sounds perfectly workable to me.
I agree 100%. It is estimated that illegal aliens here in CA cost us 10 billion dollars every year. We must all demand action from our congressional "leaders" who are traitors to America, and if they won't take action, vote them out next year.
I wanted to make sure you didn't miss this post from over on the other thread. He makes some great points:
To: joanie-f
Tremendous! Well said! And I agree fully!
An investment less than the annual cost of the problem which would alleviate the problem makes good sense. Even though I get images of the Berlin Wall, we do need to do something, and in contrast to that series of structures, this is not to keep people in, but to keep them out.
If enogh Mexicans (and others) were to be forced to remain in Mexico (and elsewhere), perhaps they would change the government which oppresses them, instead of coming here illegally and subverting ours.
Unfortunately, as those of us who work in the oil industry get our first real raises in a decade, people wail and gnash their teeth over the cost of fuel.
I am no defeatist, but the outcry over the increase in cost of goods and services in the niches filled by illegals would probably be greater than the outcry over the the current illegal immigrant problem.
By and large, Americans have become a self-centered and short-sighted lot.
Sadly, there are few of Sam Adams' fervor present in our modern society; people are too caught up in the acquisition of immaterial material wealth to pay attention to their own families, much less the dangers to our Liberty.
I would wager that even many of the members of Congress, themselves, in some way benefit, whether it be the gardener, housekeeper, or the guy who cleans the pool, directly or indirectly, by the presence of illegal immigrants in the labor force.
That is bad enough, but the theft of Nethercott's Ranch is being done, not just as a "damage" award to the "victims", but a way of definitively punishing someone who has been an outspoken thorn in the side of official agencies on this issue for some time. If Nethercott's ranch forfieture is intended as an 'object lesson' to those who would "take the law into their own hands", I fear that turf battle has only just begun.
Sadly, the man has been roundly demonized in the media, deservedly or not, and will garner little sympathy from those who refuse to see the greater issue at hand. DOubtless, that is no accident.
For starters, we need protection against the award of damages to someone who is injured in the commission of a criminal act by someone seeking to halt or hinder that act, not just to protect landowners in the border areas, but any and every citizen who choses to defend themselves, their property, or their family against criminals.
The ramifications of this would be broad indeed, as it would ensure that the average citizen can uphold the law using reasonable (including lethal) force without fear of civil recrimination by those allegedly injured doing their particular criminal act.
(In this instance, the lesson is that Nethercott would have been better off taking his chances and burying these people, rather than giving them water and a blanket.)
I can not understand why such liability protection is so freely tendered to those who act in an official capacity, but generally withheld from the average person. There is no 'equal protection' under these laws eliminating liability for officials only, which may be a Constitutional issue in and of itself.
As for securing the border, this is one of the Constitutional empowerments of the Federal Government, unfortunately abdicated by the Congress in the aim of securing votes from the numerically increasing and increasingly anti-American groups which espouse thwarting that objective.
Even in the face of the threat (and in some instances, the reality--MS 13 comes to mind) of terrorists infiltrating our nation through the highly permeable arrangement on our borders, these legislators lack the intestinal fortitude to uphold this mandate from the very document they are sworn to protect and defend, the very essence of our government.
For now, the battle is primarily within the system. There are credible attempts to sieze the property of judges who voted for Kelo, which I hope succeed, or at least come close enough to cause the Court to reconsider and overturn the decision. There is an outcry over the City of New London attempting to charge back rent to those whose property they have siezed, a real abombination, and again, a punitive measure, undertaken through the courts, with no doubt the objective of establishing precedent which is intended to intimidate any who would resist such property siezures.
These acts are not only in violation of the spirit of the Constitution, they are arguably criminal racketeering.
I cannot be convinced that those who have pushed these actions to sieze property and redistribute it to other private entities "for the purpose of increasing tax revenues" do not stand to receive some personal gain, whether through increasing the funding for their tenure in their present position through "contributions" or more directly.
Were this 1773, they would likely be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail.
153 posted on 08/21/2005 2:32:45 AM EDT by Smokin' Joe (God save us from the fury of the do-gooders!)
Several options could lessen the cost--a double-fenced barrier and landmines, or windmills to produce enough juice to electrify the fence...
I guess you don't realize how quixotic and out of step with 2005 America that line of thinking is. Hence your frustration.
Maybe I can help...
Are we more tolerant of the tyranny of government than Sam Adams and his fellow patriots were? Are we more of a mindset that we will not take action until the abuse occurs in our own backyard? Are we more willing to wear the chains to which Adams referred, because we love the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom?
In three words, yes, yes, and yes. Blame it on affluence. Which in turn breeds decadence. 18th century Americans led short, brutal lives for the most part. They simply couldn't afford to be generous with any trespassers.
But there's more to it than that. The original post is eloquent but doesn't cut to the chase.
Were this 1773, they would likely be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail.
But it's not 1773. Let's connect the dots:
America's elites are now de-racinated, de-culturalized and de-nationalized...which is largely in line with the public's state of mind. In this climate the main border concern is economic. And the only reason to "secure" a border is to deter crime. Yet we know that democracies are reactive and not proactive when it comes to crime. Therefore the border will only be secured after a great crime is committed that can be traced back to an unsecured border: Detonation of a nuke etc. The felonies committed by individual illegals on U.S. soil obviously don't count. They have been occurring for decades. We are affluent enough to be able to afford such nuisances.
The frustration seems authentic, but I wonder if most here aren't in line with modern American attitudes about immigration and borders at the end of the day. There are tons of "conservatives" out there who desire secure borders, but at the same time they reflexively embrace foreign peoples and cultures as exotic equals. You can't have it both ways.
Ask yourself: Who among our political elite - of any persuasion - is willing to stand up and say that Mexican culture is a backward culture? That it is inferior to our own? Let alone the other barbarous locales around the world. Think about it. Who will compare and contrast?
The reason even a non-violent Mexican invasion was never tolerated in the past was psychological - and not the result of police work or border vigilance. The American public was until circa 1965 unafraid of asserting its superiority as a people, a culture, a nation.
Let me say that again loudly:
The American public was unafraid of asserting its superiority.
There. Did I make you wince? To all the "conservatives" on this website: If you winced that means you're not a conservative but a multicultural drone i.e. a marxist.
The fact is a nation's borders are as much a psychological border as physical. Any body politic that has adopted tolerance of the "other" and pursuit of the almight dollar as greater virtues than preserving one's own way of life is destined to stop enforcing their own borders.
So, OK, let's all wait patiently for the nationalist revolution. But it didn't ever happen in California, did it?
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