Big Rifle A Terrorist Tool? [See BS's 60 minutes on the Barrett 50 caliber]

CBS ^ | May 29, 2005 | CBS Worldwide Inc

[endthematrix]

Re: Waco and .50 cal

See #39

[Dr.Hilarious]

"The radiation-enhanced Ultimate Computer sat impassively in front of me. "DATA INDICATES AND LOGIC DEMANDS THAT YOU MUST BE TERMINATED," it intoned. Adjusting my solar-protection shield on the space-helmet I was wearing,"

LOL Now I think I understand why you can't understand simple concepts. Have fun in orbit! LOL!

[Spktyr]

Yup, lots of very odd "discrepancies". The Feds were especially upset when the Texas Rangers and state troopers, who the Feds had left cleanup to when it all fell apart and they left in a hurry, came back with carefully catalogued and preserved evidence (what the Feds had left behind, that is). Seems the Feds didn't get *all* of the evidence they were trying to hide to cover up their mistakes and ineptitude.

Koresh said repeatedly that if someone wished to seach the premises, all they had to do was show up peacably with a warrant and they would be allowed in to do what they wanted. ATF/FBI decided to do things fast and violent, and it didn't work out for them. Koresh was wholly insane, but he made a special particular point about not breaking the law.

Yeah, backing off and simply waiting (which most sensible people would do) wouldn't send the message of "if you resist, even if we're breaking the law and violating your rights, too bad, we're the Feds and you should obey us, peon."

[Lazamataz]

And when did I claim anything about the Second Amendment saying any such thing?

Implication.

Your quote: "The purpose of having a deadly weapon is so the police can use deadly force when they have to; this weapon does that job."

No, the purpose of having a deadly weapon is so that the common man might defend himself against either a government gone tyrannical, or a thug gone homicidal, violent, or even larcenous.

This issue isn't about what weapons the police may have, and you know it. They will always have access to nearly any shoulder-fired non-explosive ordnance they want.

[Wilhelm Tell]

A year ago, at Attorney General John AshcroftÕs initiative, Congress reduced the period of record keeping from 90 days to 24 hours. ThatÕs the policy thatÕs in effect today.

Now we see what the craze to ban .50 caliber rifles is about. Even if the guns are not banned, they will try to register all guns -- and not just for 24 hours or 90 days. They will use it as an excuse to make the gun registry permanent. It is obvious who will be on the list and who won't. This is just a move against law-abiding citizens.

[Avenger]

"Nuclear weapons are a special case. Besides, do you know anyone who's got $10 BILLION (with a B) to buy one?"

I'd imagine Bill Gates could swing $10 Billion and Hollywood could probably put together a tight group of like-minded limousine liberals to buy one. Ok, so in any case, lets say nukes are a special case. What about conventional ICBMs and cruise missiles? Do you think people should be allowed to have SAM batteries in their backyard? What impact do you think that might have on the airline industry?

[Spktyr]

"Conventional" ICBMs are also known as ROCKETS and are available on the open market to anyone. So are cruise missiles, also known as UAVs. If you have money, they're both legal and available.

[Crim]

"shall not be infringed"

machine guns...Morters..cannon...tanks...aircraft carriers...ICBM's

I dont see any of that listed as excluded...do you?

(BTW...I allready know it is perfectly legal for private citizens to own fighter aircraft of any age...while it is not legal to arm them....look it up..many of them are still in service as racers and stunt planes...same goes for tanks, APC's, and just about any other type of military vehicle...including the hummer)

[Lazamataz]

I'd imagine Bill Gates could swing $10 Billion and Hollywood could probably put together a tight group of like-minded limousine liberals to buy one. Ok, so in any case, lets say nukes are a special case. What about conventional ICBMs and cruise missiles? Do you think people should be allowed to have SAM batteries in their backyard? What impact do you think that might have on the airline industry?

Please read my thesis on this topic.

[endthematrix]

"The purpose of having a deadly weapon is so the police can use deadly force "

And the role of the armed citizen?

[Dr.Hilarious]

No implication nothing--I didn't say it, didn't mean it, you simply invented it because you're a weirdo who looks for "trolls".

Did you actually, ah, READ the piece atop this thread? You should try that sometime--the police are referenced in it twice--THAT is what I was talking about.

You look like a fool when you shoot your mouth off and then simply claim I "implied" anything when I was directly referencing material in the original post.

You seem to have a problem with comprehension so I will type this slowly: In the original article, there are references to the police; I was addressing those specifically as to why I believe the police have every right to this rifle.

If you weren't so rude and weird I'd invite you to ASK me about my opinion of the Second Amendment, but paranoid folks like yourself "just know" what people mean and don't need to ask.

Now go away, trollboy, and invent more lies about other people. You'll get no more sympathy for your obvious problems from me.

[Lazamataz]

Referring you to my post above yours.

[Spktyr]

Actually, you can arm the ground vehicles (provided you have completed the appropriate paperwork and requirements for a class III weapon or weapons) if you're putting a .50 on top or back in the turret. You are not allowed to arm the airplane without special dispensation from the Feds.

[Dr.Hilarious]

I was refering to the police having access to this rifle. You and another poster seem to have missed specific references to the police.

[Lazamataz]

ASK me about my opinion of the Second Amendment

So let's have it.

[Dr.Hilarious]

You didn't read my post--you don't get to ask me after your rudeness, so go away.

[Myrddin]

The effective range of the rifle is about 1800 yards with a good scope and a well trained marksman. That is just about the limit to hit a specifically designated man-sized target. If you are firing into a huge crowd of people where the exact point of aim isn't critical, then the "effective" range is much greater.

[neverdem]

The only thing heavier is main battle tanks, and I don't recall seeing any M60s or M1s at the Waco standoff, do you?

I wasn't a tanker, but I worked around them. The lead vehicle appears to be a M60 variant. IIRC, the one on film at Waco had a boom as it started to bash the walls of the burning compound. My guess is that it was an engineer variant or armored recovery vehicle. The first two tracked armored vehicles appear to have pronounced turrets from the rear in this picture.

[Lazamataz]

You didn't read my post--you don't get to ask me after your rudeness, so go away.

Ha.

endthematrix, this individual won't answer my question about what his views are about the Second Amendment. Perhaps he will answer you?

Or perhaps he doesn't want to be committed to a conservative position?

[Spktyr]

I don't think they actually had their main guns mounted, which makes them an odd variant of their own. Put it to you this way - I didn't see any intact MBTs in footage or pictures of the Krispy Kritters incident. I did see the M88 and the engineer variant of the M60, though (can't remember the designation offhand).