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Soldiers fighting for right to smoke?
Townhall ^ | 04/20/2005 | John Stossel

Posted on 04/20/2005 7:49:38 AM PDT by VRWCmember

It's nice to hear Americans talk about privacy and fighting for their rights. But sometimes I have to say: Do you know what you're talking about?

In Okemos, Mich., a 71-year-old health nut named Howard Weyers runs a health-care benefits company called Weyco. Weyers thinks his employees should be healthy, too, so years ago, he hired an in-house private trainer. Any employee who works with her and then meets certain exercise goals earns a $110 bonus per month.

So far, so good. But then, in November 2003, Weyers made an announcement that shocked his staff: "I'm introducing a smoking policy," he said.

"You're not going to smoke if you work here. Period."

No smoking at work. No smoking at home. No nicotine patch or nicotine gum. The company would do random tests and fire anyone with nicotine in his system.

"Two hundred people in a room," Weyers recalls, "and they went at me."

"I yelled out," said Anita Epolito, "'You can't do that to me, it's against the law.'"

That's not true. In Michigan and 19 other states, employers have the legal right to fire anyone, as long as they don't violate discrimination laws (for age, gender, race, religion, disabilities, etc.).

Weyers gave his employees 15 months to quit smoking, and he offered assistance to help.

Today, he calls the policy a success. Twenty Weyco employees who smoked, stopped. Some of their spouses even quit.

But the four workers who didn't quit were fired, and they are furious.

"I'm just thrown out because this person decided, one day, this is what he wanted to do," said Epolito.

Virg Bernero, a Michigan state senator, wants to make such firings illegal. He helped publicize the fired Weyco workers' complaint -- in the process publicizing himself; he's expected to run for mayor of Lansing this year -- and now he's introduced a bill to prohibit employers from firing anyone for anything legal they do at home.

"What's it going to be tomorrow? That you['ve] got to lose a certain number of pounds . . . in order to keep your job?" Just as the law restricts discrimination on the basis of race or sex, he said, "we'll have an amendment for legal activities, for privacy outside the workplace. Because this goes too far."

Bernero's thinking is muddled. I think whether you smoke, get fat or go skydiving should be your choice. I say "Give Me a Break" to busybody politicians in New York and California who've banned smoking in every bar and restaurant. But there's a big difference between government banning things . . . and Howard Weyers doing it. We have only one government. When government bans something, it bans it for everybody in its jurisdiction. That's why the Bill of Rights limits government power. But Weyco is just one company. Its employees have other choices. There are other jobs available in Michigan.

Cara Stiffler has already found a "better" job but still told me it should have been illegal for Weyers to fire her. "I want my children to see that I stood up for my rights as an American. That's what . . . the men are over fighting in Iraq for, is my freedom."

Give Me a Break. Freedom includes the right to quit your job, but freedom also includes the right not to employ someone you don't want to employ. No one forced Stiffler and Epolito to work for Weyco. But now, they want to force Howard Weyers to employ smokers. He built the company. He owns the company. What about his freedom?

I asked Epolito if she "owned her job." No, she said, but "there's a relationship there."

There was a relationship, that's true. To put it simply, the relationship was that Weyers thought employing Epolito was a good thing and Epolito thought working for Weyco was a good thing. Weyers doesn't own Epolito; she's entitled to pursue her happiness, not his, and if that means smoking, that's her right. But Epolito doesn't own Weyers; he's entitled to live by his values, not hers, and if that means not employing smokers, that's his right. Government smoking bans take away our freedom. But all Weyers did was exercise his.

John Stossel is co-anchor of ABC News' "20/20" and the author of "Give Me a Break," just released in paperback.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: businessrights; employmentatwill; freedomofcontract; nannystate; privateproperty; pufflist; smokingbans
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To: VRWCmember
"There are some intesting points of debate here, such as whether or not the government should have the power to force an employer to employ smokers"

I agree with all of Stossels points. Employers should have the right to hire or fire anyone for any reason, however that is not the case.

There have been many cases where employers have had to pay damages to employees who have been fired. I remember one case when an actress was fired for getting pregnant. Another where flight attendants were fired for gaining too much weight. Why are some employers free to fire for any reason and others not?
21 posted on 04/20/2005 8:27:56 AM PDT by monday
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To: Iron Matron
Our Government is teaching and advocating intolerance of legal activities and the intolerance and demonetization of those who indulge in them.

Yes and no.......much of the government work has come at the behest of private busybodies with big budgets to buy their junk science.

But I do see your point.

22 posted on 04/20/2005 8:28:13 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: VRWCmember

I'm sure a similar policy regarding serial sodomists would have a great deal of success in limiting health costs.


23 posted on 04/20/2005 8:32:04 AM PDT by Meldrim
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To: JoeSixPack1
This thing is just warming up. Break out the popcorn. :-)

It's been going on for YEARS.....but no one was paying attention.

For a long time I fought in favor of laws that would prohibit him from doing this - but I no longer do so, as I can see the pandora's box it can open up.

By instituting a law against this, then I as a smoker I would not be able to refuse employment to someone seeking to ban smoking in my private place of business..

My attitude is to just leave well enough alone - there are already enough protected "classes" as it is.

24 posted on 04/20/2005 8:34:27 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: Gabz

>>> I get hit with ridiculous quantities of those veggies that must be eaten to equal the nicotine content of one cigarette.

Actually, that is comparing the plant fruit to the plant leaves. The fruit doesn't have the same amount as the leaves. BUT, the leaves of the nightshade plants all have high levels of nicotine. You could smoke tomato plant leaves!

If someone was to do a test for alkaloids, whether you had a cigarette of a tomato salad, you would test positive.


25 posted on 04/20/2005 8:35:16 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: Conspiracy Guy
"AS far as I am concerned he is within his rights as a business owner. No one has to work there?"

I would agree, but what if, as an employer, I were to decide that I wanted to employ ONLY smokers? Any non-smokers who worked for me would have a limited amount of time to take up smoking or they would be fired. Would you still support my rights as a business owner?
26 posted on 04/20/2005 8:35:58 AM PDT by monday
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To: Gabz

Yes and no.......much of the government work has come at the behest of private busybodies with big budgets to buy their junk science.<<<

It is for this reason that our governments actions are so detestable!


27 posted on 04/20/2005 8:37:39 AM PDT by Iron Matron
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To: rellimpank

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1387412/posts---


--maybe they should form a church--


28 posted on 04/20/2005 8:39:27 AM PDT by rellimpank (urban dwellers don' t understand the cultural deprivation of not being raised on a farm)
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To: Calpernia

Interesting - I did not realize that. Thanks for the info.


29 posted on 04/20/2005 8:42:59 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: monday
I would agree, but what if, as an employer, I were to decide that I wanted to employ ONLY smokers?

I don't care if you made them watch porn and cross-dress. You own your business. They do not own their job.

30 posted on 04/20/2005 8:44:04 AM PDT by Texas Federalist (If you get in bed with the government, you'll get more than a good night's sleep." R. Reagan)
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To: monday
I would agree, but what if, as an employer, I were to decide that I wanted to employ ONLY smokers? Any non-smokers who worked for me would have a limited amount of time to take up smoking or they would be fired. Would you still support my rights as a business owner?

I know I would. That has basically been my point all along, as long as he can legally only employ non-smokers, I can only employ smokers.

31 posted on 04/20/2005 8:44:53 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: monday

I am a smoker, smoking has risks that I accept. But an employer requiring an employee to take up risky behavior may have trouble finding support. In an ideal world I would support your right to hire who the heck you want. Race, religion, smoking, non smoking, tall, short, fat, skinny, male, female, etc. It is your business and it's success relies on you hiring people you think will help you succeed.


32 posted on 04/20/2005 8:45:06 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (Caution. Contents under pressure.)
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To: Iron Matron
It is for this reason that our governments actions are so detestable!

Of course, and that is why I don't want to see any more government meddling.

33 posted on 04/20/2005 8:45:48 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: Calpernia

::Disclaimer from post 25::

I've never smoked tomato plant leaves!


35 posted on 04/20/2005 8:55:50 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: Texas Federalist
"I don't care if you made them watch porn and cross-dress. You own your business. They do not own their job."

lol... good answer.
36 posted on 04/20/2005 8:56:37 AM PDT by monday
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To: VRWCmember
No employer should be forced to employ a smoker, or an overweight person, or someone who participates in sports. The problem comes in when the employer changes the rules on existing employees.

There is an implied contract when the employee is hired. Changes in rules regarding employee behavior (particularly during non-work hours) are like one party changing the contract without agreement of the other party.

Although employers can get away with it, that is immoral. If an employer wants to do it, they should at least offer job hunting assistance to those employees who do not want to work under the new contract terms.

37 posted on 04/20/2005 8:56:54 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: sierrahome
"I was soooooo hooked and if I could do it ANYBODY could do it."

Not true.

38 posted on 04/20/2005 8:57:51 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody

The employer gave them 15 months in which to quit smoking or seek other employment and he offerred financial assistance for the quit smoking programs if they wished.

Other than that I agree with everything else you said :)


39 posted on 04/20/2005 9:07:18 AM PDT by Gabz (My give-a-damn is busted.)
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To: Conspiracy Guy
Weyers has the right to hire anyone he chooses, as long as he is up front about it from the beginning. I think he could hire only non-smokers. I think he may also have the right to let prospective employees know that if caught smoking, anywhere, they could be terminated.

However, he is totaly out of line when he decides to terminate employees for something that he has always tolerated in the past.

Even if an employee can find another job with similar pay, he still looses important benefits by starting over. Vacation time is often based on experience and length of service with a company. Pension benefits are calculated based on length of service.

Even if the employee in question has a vested pension, the benefit level for those years of service are frozen permanently once he leaves the company. So even if he finishes his working career with another company and actually draws two separate pensions, the total amount he gets at retirement can be substantially less than if he were able to retire with one pension with many years of service.

To suddenly change the rules of employment in such a manor after an employee has invested many years with that company and built up his or her benefits should NOT be allowable. If Weyers had been honest with the employees when he hired them, they would have had the opportunity to seek employment more tolerant of their life style.
40 posted on 04/20/2005 9:11:33 AM PDT by MRadtke (NOT the baseball player)
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