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Saint-making Pope is ready to ditch the miracle clause
London Times ^ | 12/20/04 | Richard Owen

Posted on 12/20/2004 5:45:44 PM PST by wagglebee

CANDIDATES for sainthood will be exonerated from the requirement to have performed a miracle under guidelines being considered by the Pope.

Already under fire from some Roman Catholics for running a “saint factory”, the Pope is preparing to overturn a centuries-old rule that candidates for canonisation must have performed “medically inexplicable” posthumous miracles.

The Pope, 84, has created 482 saints in his 26 years as pontiff — more than all his predecessors put together — and has beatified 1,337 people. He believes that “latter-day saints” offer a much-needed example at a time when Christianity is under threat from secularism and rival religions.

Abolishing the need for miracles would speed up the canonisation of some of the Pope’s favourite candidates, including Mother Teresa of Calcutta, who was beatified last year. It could also revive plans to beatify Robert Schuman, the French-born founder of the EU, shelved earlier this year because of lack of evidence that anyone had been cured after praying to him.

The Pope last streamlined the beatification and canonisation process in 1983, when he decreed that martyrs — those killed for their faith — could be beatified without the need for a certifiable miracle.

Yesterday Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, the Archbishop of Genoa, disclosed that Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, the head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith and the Pope’s ideologial “enforcer” for two decades, had presented a formula for the abolition of the “the miracle clause” to the Pope. Cardinal Bertone said that there was a growing feeling in the Vatican that the need for miracles for both beatification and canonisation was “anachronistic”.

At present, candidates for beatification, which confers the title “Blessed” and is the penultimate step before sainthood, must be shown to have performed at least one miracle after death by curing the terminally ill in response to prayers of intercession. For sainthood, evidence of at least two miracles is required. Claims of miraculous cures are examined by a panel of five medical experts at the Congregation for the Causes of Saints, a Vatican body.

The panel, drawn from a pool of a hundred doctors and specialists, must conclude that the cure was “sudden, complete and permanent” and had no scientific explanation. Cardinal Bertone said what mattered was not whether saints had performed miracles but whether they had displayed “heroic virtues” and led an exemplary Christian life.

Il Secolo XIX, the Genoa newspaper, said the proposed “revolution in saintmaking” would upset traditionalists who regarded miracles as “one of the cornerstones of the Catholic faith”.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: allabitnutty; canfitonheadofapin; canonization; catholicism; howmanyangels; icvirgininmyoatmeal; johnpaulii; miracleofindulgences; miracleonice; miracles; sainthood; vatican
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To: wagglebee

God forbid we ever see a St. Bill Clinton.


21 posted on 12/20/2004 7:14:06 PM PST by The Great RJ
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To: Land of the Irish

Ping.

This is the destruction of the doctrine of the communion of saints and of the efficacy of the intercession of the saints in Heaven for the Church on Earth.

The prophecy of Our Lady of La Salette is verified yet again, as if it needed to be.


22 posted on 12/20/2004 7:20:31 PM PST by Loyalist
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To: wagglebee

Catholic theologians through the centuries have held the view that canonization is not invariably an act of papal infallibility and is certainly not a primary exercise thereof. St. Thomas Aquinas (Quodlibet 9.c.16) holds that the pope may err in this, as in other matters where his decision depends on the truth of human testimony. St. Robert Bellarmine holds that it is quite possible for the pope "to err in particular controversies of fact which depend chiefly on human information and testimony."

When and if the heirarchy of the Church returns to its senses, it can undo whatever unworthy "saints" John Paul the Silent elevates.


23 posted on 12/20/2004 7:22:52 PM PST by Luddite Patent Counsel ("No man's life, liberty or property is safe while the Legislature is in session.")
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To: Luddite Patent Counsel

Of course there have been errors with past canonizations. There is basically no historical proof that St. Joan of Arc ever even existed. However, the fact that errors are "allowed" does not give the Pope license to "lower the bar" on what qualifies a person for sainthood.


24 posted on 12/20/2004 7:28:14 PM PST by wagglebee (Memo to sKerry: the only thing Bush F'ed up was your career)
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To: wagglebee

I agree wholeheartedly that it is improper for this Pope to "lower the bar". He already did it once in eliminating the "devil's advocate" function in the beatification and canonization process back in the 1980's. This is just one more step. My point is: a. Catholic teachings do not require us to agree with him; and b. any mistakes he makes in this regard can be undone.


25 posted on 12/20/2004 7:31:54 PM PST by Luddite Patent Counsel ("No man's life, liberty or property is safe while the Legislature is in session.")
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To: Luddite Patent Counsel

Agreed.


26 posted on 12/20/2004 7:33:08 PM PST by wagglebee (Memo to sKerry: the only thing Bush F'ed up was your career)
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To: Mike Fieschko
For example, how could Catholics pray for intercession of someone who is not in heaven?

Something I don't understand: how can Catholics pray for intercession of someone who is not Jesus Christ, the only intercessor (as per Romans 8)? If you'd rather not get into it here, I understand, but your statement just stirred up that thought in my mind.

27 posted on 12/20/2004 8:10:26 PM PST by pcgTheDestroyer
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To: Husker8877
So I'll always be "spiritual but not religious" to quote an oft-used cliche.

That cliche tickles me. Reminds me of a football player on a team, but who never shows up for practices or games because he doesn't like his teammates and some of the coaches. What should management do with that "player"?

I do feel your pain with regards to bureaucracy in "the church", though my experience has been with Protestant denominations. As such I don't belong to any official denomination where churches are forced to give up their control to a large bureaucratic body "out there".

28 posted on 12/20/2004 8:15:09 PM PST by pcgTheDestroyer
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To: pcgTheDestroyer
Something I don't understand: how can Catholics pray for intercession of someone who is not Jesus Christ, the only intercessor (as per Romans 8)?

I suppose on the same grounds that Paul asked the Ephesians to intercede for him (Eph 6:18-19 KJV).
18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints; 19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,
There are other reasons, but that's the first New Testament reference I thought of.
29 posted on 12/20/2004 8:27:52 PM PST by Mike Fieschko
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To: wagglebee
What I found most appalling is the Pope's desire to make the "father" of the European Union a saint.

Who?

30 posted on 12/20/2004 8:28:50 PM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: Malcolm
This is not the purview of anyone on this earth, least of all the Church of the Inquisition and the Crusades.

Oh, God forbid us from defending Europe from the Muslims and freeing the Holy Land! If you can think of a war where atrocities didn't occur, I have a certain bridge in New York to sell you.

31 posted on 12/20/2004 8:31:22 PM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: Mike Fieschko

I think the question has not been authoritatively answered. The weight of opinion seems to be that the answer is 'yes, the papal act of canonization is infallible.'

How about saint Christopher? didn't they just recently say that he never really existed?


32 posted on 12/20/2004 8:36:25 PM PST by oldbrowser (You lost the election.....................Get over it.)
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To: oldbrowser
How about saint Christopher? didn't they just recently say that he never really existed?

No (IIRC). His feast day was taken off the calendar in 1969.

The joke back then was that Pope Paul released him and the Mets picked him up on waivers.
33 posted on 12/20/2004 8:42:33 PM PST by Mike Fieschko
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To: Siobhan; Canticle_of_Deborah; broadsword; NYer; Salvation; sandyeggo; american colleen; ...
Catholic ping!

CANDIDATES for sainthood will be exonerated from the requirement to have performed a miracle under guidelines being considered by the Pope.

Pray that the Holy Father doesn't do this!!!!

He believes that “latter-day saints” offer a much-needed example at a time when Christianity is under threat from secularism and rival religions.

We have PLENTY of examples to look to. One only needs to look not even a hundred years to look for holy people who resisted secular and demonic forces.

Our Lady of Perpetual Help, pray for us!
St. Joseph, protector of the Universal Church, pray for us!
St. Catherine of Siena, converter of countless souls, pray for us!
St. John Fisher, holy example to bishops, pray for us!
Pope St. Pius V, defender of the Church, pray for us!
St. Gemma Galgani, slave to the Most Sacred Heart of Jesus, pray for us!
St. Maximilian Kolbe, missionary of the Immaculata, pray for us!

34 posted on 12/20/2004 8:46:54 PM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: Malcolm
If you've accepted Jesus Christ as savior, you are a saint.

No intent at offense, but that rather sounds like the sin of presumption.

35 posted on 12/20/2004 8:48:23 PM PST by The Iguana
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To: Pyro7480
The article says

Robert Schuman, the French-born founder of the EU

Of course, Schuman didn't found the EU. He was instrumental in the founding of the European Coal and Steel Community, the precursor of the European Economic Community.

He died in 1963, before the EC or the EU.

The ECSC and its treaty took the Ruhr out of international politics after WWII, among other things.

google 'Mouvement Republicain Populaire' for other information about Schuman and his political views.
36 posted on 12/20/2004 8:53:58 PM PST by Mike Fieschko
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Comment #37 Removed by Moderator

To: wagglebee

38 posted on 12/20/2004 9:11:33 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: Land of the Irish

LOL! This isn't the first time I've seen this. It's funny because it's largely true.


39 posted on 12/20/2004 9:16:29 PM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: Mike Fieschko
how could Catholics pray for intercession of someone who is not in heaven?

That doesn't go to papal infallibility. That literally goes to the sham presently proposed. Think about it. They made the list, the real list - not the present list - because of . . . miracles! The real deal. That's how you know. That how people traditionally knew.

40 posted on 12/20/2004 9:18:44 PM PST by sevry
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