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The CIA 'old guard' goes to war with Bush
Telegraph ^ | 10-10-04 | Phillip Sherwell

Posted on 10/09/2004 11:40:34 PM PDT by hippy hate me

Edited on 10/09/2004 11:48:58 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]

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To: Cacique

Sorry - I just buy that think leftists have ever worked at the CIA. Disgruntled bureaucrats, sure. The occasional Aldrich Ames, sure. But liberals just don't join the CIA, nor are they wanted at Langley.


21 posted on 10/10/2004 12:28:36 AM PDT by sourdoughAK
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To: sourdoughAK
The organization itself has all kinds of bureaucratic problems - but you just can't blame everyone working there for the fact that the agency itself may be in bad need of an overhaul.

It's been my experience that all large organizations, whether governmental or in the private sector, can easily have all kinds of bureaucratic problems. That the CIA is more secretive than most may, however, make it a better candidate for organizational entropy than most.

22 posted on 10/10/2004 12:31:07 AM PDT by pt17
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To: sourdoughAK

YES! This whole story smells.....sorta like some crap spun up by dimmies for some reason I can't yet fathom.....but I can smell something rotten ... Just like the sabotage of the election process


23 posted on 10/10/2004 12:41:47 AM PDT by dasboot (<img src="XXX">)
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To: sam_whiskey
Hi Sam!

I throughly enjoyed the Unnngh

I mean it!
24 posted on 10/10/2004 12:49:56 AM PDT by Jet Jaguar (Who would the terrorists vote for?)
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To: Cacique
You're right about purging departments that have been loaded with knotheads from the previous administration, but the Bush admin hadn't really had the time (from 1/20/01-9/11/01) and had to make do with personnel on hand.

When Clinton took office, he fired all federal prosecuting attorneys, paving the way for the HillBilly shenanigans during the '90s.

I have little info on what the Clintons did to the intelligence community but history shows they were isolated and ignored. The State Dept. was policy and the policy was Clinton's (whatever that was) and from Jan-Sept 2001, little had changed there. Remember the summer of 2001; Bush appointments were delayed, harangued and left hanging. The Senate was in the control of the Democrats. Summer break was a political tool.

After 9/11/01, Bush had to work with the crew he had and their loyalties are suspect and confused.

Hope for reelection and a Spring cleaning.

And GO YANKEES

25 posted on 10/10/2004 1:01:21 AM PDT by BIGLOOK (I once opposed keelhauling but have recently come to my senses.)
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To: hippy hate me

Yeah sure right...The guys who blew so much fopr sooo very long and at such a great cost to the US are now bitching because they have been found out? How many more moles and useless lackies have to surface before someone calls the CIA and the FBI out for what they are...useless pieces of deadwood run by longterm political hacks


26 posted on 10/10/2004 1:03:29 AM PDT by jnarcus
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To: txroadkill

I should mention they Fxxxed the first Twin Tower bombing too. They can't tie their tennis shoes and chew bubble gum at different times.


27 posted on 10/10/2004 1:29:32 AM PDT by prometheus
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To: hippy hate me
A powerful "old guard" faction in the Central Intelligence Agency has launched an unprecedented campaign to undermine the Bush administration with a battery of damaging leaks and briefings about Iraq.

I'd say it's time to order some polygraphs. Based on those results, can their traitorous asses.

28 posted on 10/10/2004 1:52:12 AM PDT by Prime Choice (It is dangerous to be right when wicked is called 'good.')
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To: prometheus

Ditto. Thanks for saving me the time. ;-)


29 posted on 10/10/2004 2:04:36 AM PDT by Tunehead54 (OK Swifties - Its October! Let'm have it!)
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To: hippy hate me

Seems fairly obvious to me. The CIA serves to provide the President with intelligence and to carry out covert actions at his disgression, with the advice and consent of the congress. People in the CIA are at liberty to disagree with whomever they like, they just don't have the right to leak, sabotage, or publicly disagree with the President, PERIOD. Those that have should be fired.


30 posted on 10/10/2004 2:11:12 AM PDT by Casloy
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To: peyton randolph
I'll never forget the "pep talk" Bush gave at the CIA following the 9/11 attacks. He should have gone up there and cleaned the whole damn place out...fired everybody.

Elected officials are fighting bureaucracy throughout the federal government. They have created a monster that has a life of its own and bureaucrats can't stand the well-deserved criticism of their wasteful spending and incompetence.

America has a federal government chock full of buildings loaded with people who shuffle paper, play solitaire games on the computer and scratch their butts in a nearly infinite number of cubicles. The CIA is no exception. The CIA is like those giant high-rise public housing projects that become so rat-infested and uninhabitable, they have to be torn down.

31 posted on 10/10/2004 3:31:46 AM PDT by NoControllingLegalAuthority
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To: hippy hate me
I wonder of some of this is getting even with the Father, GHW Bush. The CIA gave out some very bad intelligence at Grenada, and at the first Gulf War and GHW Bush apparantly tore off a very big piece of their behinds about it.

Some of those people in the "house of mirrors" have long memories.

Regards,

32 posted on 10/10/2004 4:43:04 AM PDT by Jimmy Valentine (DemocRATS - when they speak, they lie; when they are silent, they are stealing the American Dream)
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To: Jimmy Valentine
A "central" intelligence agency can NEVER work. "Intelligence" is meaningless except when directly applied to some goal, some objective. Being "central" the CIA can never commit, nor has any charter to commit to such goals.

Instead it -- like any other such "central" independent agency -- creates a new goal: self-aggrandissment.

Particular goals become counter-productive to that main goal -- why? Because they restrict its operation, they limit its turf. Especially when they are goals within turf the collossus has already claim staked.

What does "central" mean" anyway? Only that any particular goal is less than central, any particular goal is always off-center.

That is, its ONLY mission becomes to battle for turf from anyone or anything. Until it becomes the true "center" of everything.

33 posted on 10/10/2004 4:55:32 AM PDT by bvw
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To: NoControllingLegalAuthority
America has a federal government chock full of buildings loaded with people who shuffle paper, play solitaire games on the computer and scratch their butts in a nearly infinite number of cubicles.

Back in '94, I was rushing to get paperwork signed by these bureaucrats so that the merger of two companies could occur. There was an anti-trust issue and these bureaucrats needed to sign off on the paperwork before I could submit it to the U.S. Justice Dept. The deadline was that day. It was hell.

The highlight was at the U.S. Dep't of Transportation where I had to wait while the gatekeeper to a bureaucrat sat and played a video game at his desk for about 15 minutes while I stood there waiting for him to take the paperwork to his boss. It was only when the game was over that he decided to acknowledge me and take another half hour to get the signature. There was no doubt that this was his way of getting back at The Man.

34 posted on 10/10/2004 4:57:00 AM PDT by peyton randolph (That smell isn't roadkill...it is the typical cheese-eating surrender monkey)
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To: hippy hate me
Yes, I think Mark Steyn was right when he made the point that many senior managers at the CIA have become comfortable in staying behind their desks in Washington and spending their time in analyzing satellite photo's rather than getting their hands dirty on the ground in messy "human intelligence" operations. Now, the Administration wants more and better, up close and personal spy on the ground reports and these managers are feeling the heat. These leaks from the Agency are going to continue slowly over time unless they purge all the known incompetents overnight in one big sudden blood letting.
35 posted on 10/10/2004 5:47:23 AM PDT by finnigan2
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To: Steel Wolf
That's a house that's long overdue a good cleaning. I think it's time to clear out some of the dead wood that's been rotting back there.

The White House, that is.

Bush pressured the CIA into providing false info on WMD. Shame on the CIA for caving -- but Bush has to go!

I'm voting for Badnarik, but even Kerry would be better at this point.

36 posted on 10/10/2004 6:18:15 AM PDT by Commie Basher
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To: peyton randolph
Amazing how the article omits that the CIA has a duty to serve the President.

The "president" is not a dictator whose every whim must be "served." The CIA's first loyalty should be to the Constitution and the nation. In short, it should not provide false intel on WMD simply because the "president" wants it.

Really, it's the president, and the CIA, who are servants of the people. And as one of the people, I'm not at all pleased with Servant Bush's performance. I hope we fire him in November.

37 posted on 10/10/2004 6:21:07 AM PDT by Commie Basher
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To: Cacique
In our system we replace the guys on top and leave the bureaucracy in place regardless of whether it's effective or not.

I believe that's also the way in Britain and France.

38 posted on 10/10/2004 6:23:16 AM PDT by Commie Basher
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To: Prime Choice
I'd say it's time to order some polygraphs.

Polygraphs prove nothing. That's why they're inadmisable in court.

39 posted on 10/10/2004 6:24:50 AM PDT by Commie Basher
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To: sourdoughAK
When I was in graduate school I used to get recruiting letters from the CIA on a monthly basis. I am sure everyone else did as well. They were always looking for analysts, linguists etc. Most of the guys in my dept (poli sci) were leftists, including me at that time. I know quite a few guys who took jobs in DC upon graduation cause they didn't want to go into academia and teach. Same thing in the State Department, and this was under Reagan. All they had to do was keep their mouths shut about their politics and they got hired. I don't even think that was a consideration during background checks at all.


FREEPER (PARodrig) PAUL RODRIGUEZ FOR CONGRESS

40 posted on 10/10/2004 7:09:35 AM PDT by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat)
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