Posted on 09/10/2004 3:18:38 PM PDT by Howlin
Edited on 09/10/2004 4:53:58 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
A bold liar he was. If I was Tony Snow, at the end of the seg I would have called security and had him escorted out. Why? The man's a thief. He's stolen from millions.
Believe me...I knew that! I knew you were right and am savvy in the way of lib strategy.
Glad I didn't switch from MSNBC too soon...just got to see that Buick Century slip into the earth when (driver escaped) he ignored signs about a water main break and the car got sucked underground.
Killian's son noted in either the AP story or his FOX interview that his father never signed anything just "J Killian," but always wrote his full name.
Do you have this discrepancy? -- According to Killian's widow, the late Col. didn't type.
Let the CBS HQ know you think they were forged, and won't be watching them anymore, unless you hear a retraction has occurred. (212) 975-4321 Or, just tell them they are liars.
Hugh Hewitt.Read the whole thing! Excerpt:
...You are tilting at windmills with the IBM Selectric Composer theory.
Go to Selectric Manual which is a user's manual showing some sample typed text using this typewriter.
The typed text in the "Killian memos" is kerned (check out letter combinations like "fo" and "fe"), but the Composer text is clearly not. Kerning is a computationally complex task beyond the capacity of any mechanical typewriter--even one as expensive and elaborate as the IBM Selectric Composer. Moreover, the proportional spacing in the sample text is rather crude (look at the typesetting of "11" for example) which is the best that a mechanical typewriter--even one as complex as the Composer--can do.
Consult someone who understands the typography behind modern word processing. The "Killian memos" are word processed documents.
Robert "Corky" Cartwright
Professor of Computer Science
Rice University
ACM Fellow
"The pompous ex CBS exec, praising 60 minutes track record .."
Mr. Slick?
and also said they checked the veracity of such sources. But it doesn't seen to affect Barnes' veracity that he said the exact opposite under oath 4 years ago or that he is angling for a position in a Kerry Cabinet..
>>>Not to say there's any doubt in my mind that Soros and his little army of 527s are part of a larger co-ordination with the DNC and MSM.
Maybe that is it then?
You an archivist? LIS type? All round smart person? 'Provenance' is an interesting choice of words for your average joe.
I'm in info sci, that's why I ask.
bttt
But the beautiful thing about this story is that the media no longer counts! Not like they used to; not like they'd like to. As of yesterday, from now on, they need to "satisfy" the bloggers and other internet investigators.
They are cracking up!!! They are actually admitting they see liberalism as the natural reality! Wow!!
Bernie should rent a bullhorn and trumpet he has been proven right!
Got it.
Some have already been clarified, but here are the running discrepancies:
1. proportional spacing not generally available (no confirmation this type of technology was available at TANG)
2. superscripts not generally available
3. Small "th" single element not generally available (not common, but available. Highly unlikely the machines were available at TANG)
4. 4's produced on a typewriter are open at the top. 4's on a word processor are closed. Compare the genuine Bush ANG documents, where the 4's are open at the top, to Rather's forgeries, where the 4's are closed at the top
5. Smart quotes. Curved apostrophes and quotation marks were not available only vertical hash marks.
6. The blurriness of the copy indicates it was recopied dozens of times, common tactic of forgers (confirmed by CBS).
7. Signature block. Typical authentic military signature block has name, then rank, then on the next line the person's position. This just has rank beneath the name.
8. Margins. These look like a computer's unjustified default, not the way a person typing would have done it. Typewriters had fixed margins that rang and froze the carriage when typist either hit mar rel or manually returned carriage.
9. Date inconsistent with military style type. Date with three letters, or in form as 110471.
10. Words run over consistent with word processor.
11. Times Roman has been available since 1931, but only in linotype printshops...until released with Apple MacIntosh in 1984 and Windows 3.1 in 1991.
12. Signature looks faked, and it cut at the very end of the last letter rather than a fade when pressure would have been released.
13. No errors and whiteout (CBS used copies)
14. No letterhead
15. Exact match for Microsoft Word Processor, version disputed, but converted to pdf matches exactly.
16. Paper size problem, Air Force and Guard did not use 8 1/2 x 11 inch paper until the 1980s.
17. Overlap analysis is an exact match (see #15).
18. Absence of hyphens to split words between lines, c/w 1970's typewriter. (see #8)
19. 5000 Longmont #8 in Houston Tx. does not exist (actually does exist, but Mr. Bush had already moved TWICE from this address at the time the memo was written).
20. Box 34567 is suspicious, at best. This would not be used on correspondence, but rather forms. The current use of the po box 34567 is Ashland Chemical Company, A Division of Ashland Oil, Incorporated P. O. Box 34567 Houston (this has been confirmed by the Pentagon, per James Rosen on Fox News)
21. It would have been nearly impossible to center a letterhead with proportional spacing without a computer (not impossible, but for Killiam, who did not type, improbable).
22. Bush's grade would be abbreviated "1/Lt" not "1st Lt"
23. Subject matter bizarre
24. Air Force did not use street addresses for their offices, rather HQ AFLC/CC, Wright-Patterson AFB, OH 45433.
25. Kerning was not available
26. In the August 18, 1973 memo, Jerry Killian purportedly writes: "Staudt has obviously pressured Hodges more about Bush. I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job." but General Staudt, who thought very highly of Lt. Bush, retired in 1972.
27. Language not generally used by military personnel.
28. Not signed or initialed by author, typist, or clerk.
29. Not in any format that a military person would use, e.g. orders not given by Memo.
30. Is the document original or a copy of an original? Why all the background noise such as black marks and a series of repeated dots (as if run through a Xerox).(Rather explained his document was a photocopy-brings up additional questions of how redacted black address was visible from a several generation copy)
31. The Killiam family rejected these documents as forgeries. Then where did the personal files come from if not the family?
32. Why no three hole punches evident at the top of the page?
33. Mr. Bush would have had automatic physical scheduled for his Birthday in July! He would not have received correspondence.
34. Why is the redacted address of Longmont #8 visible beneath the black mark? This would have been impossible after one copy, but it would be visible if the document was scanned.
35. Why were these exact same documents available for sale on the Internet y Marty Heldt, of leftist web site Tom Paine, as early as January 2004? Is this where CBS obtained their copies?
36. Acronym should be ORT, not ORET.
37. Last line of document 4 "Austin will not be pleased with this" is not in the same font and has been added!
38. Handwriting experts are not document experts apples and oranges.
39. Lt Col Killian didn't type
40. The forged documents had no initials from a clerk
41. There was no CC list (needed for orders)
42. Subject line in memos was normally CAPITALIZED in the military
43. The forged documents used incorrect terminology ("physical examination" instead of "medical")
44. There was no "receipt confirmation box" (required for orders)
45. The superscript "th" in the forged documents was raised half-way above the typed line (consistent with MS Word, but inconsistent with military typewriters which kept everything in-line to avoid writing outside the pre-printed boxes of standard forms)
46. CBS admits that it does *not* have the originals, but only original documents can be proven to be real; copies can *never* be authenticated positively...repeat: only original documents can be proven real. CBS never had the originals, so CBS knew that it was publishing something that couldn't be assured of authenticity.
47. Regarding superscript - typewriter example had it underlined in the keystroke but the forged document doesn't.
48. May 4, 1972 "order" memo and the May 19, 1972 "commitment" memo typeface doesn't match the official evaluation signed 26 May 1972. Or does the TxANG have a new typewriter just for Col. Killian's memorandum
:^D
Macs used Times, Helvetica, and Courier. PCs used Times Roman, Arial, and Courier. The first two of each were proportional fonts, the last a fixed font, retained for use in column layout of data.
"SOME ANALYSTS OUTSIDE CBS SAY THEY BELIEVE THE TYPEFACE ON THESE MEMOS IS NEW TIMES ROMAN.... WHICH THEY CLAIM WAS NOT AVAILABLE IN THE 1970S. BUT THE OWNER OF THE COMPANY THAT DISTRIBUTES THIS TYPING STYLE.... SAYS IT HAS BEEN AVAILABE SINCE 1931.DOCUMENT AND HANDWRITING EXAMINER MARCEL MATLEY ANALYZED THE DOCUMENTS FOR CBS NEWS."
I just got on line and clearly haven't been able to read all the posts on this thread. However I would point out:
Times New Roman was not available since 1931. Prior to sometime in the early 1940's, it was a printing typeface in England. The New York Times had it "reworked" and the new typeface was named "Times New Roman". It was used solely in the printing business and was available for Linotype machines- Not typewriters.
As far as I know or can discover, it wasn't generally available for typewriters.
CBS's "expert" has repeatedly been de-bunked in the past, the last time involved Kurt Colbain's suicide.
The guy has a rather poor record when it comes to handwriting analysis, and further, he IS NOT a questioned document expert.
I apologize if this info has already been posted.
"OMG! The DU is saying Rather hit a homerun. God, they're retarded."
I consider them voluntarily retarded, they have decided at some point to live in their own fantasyland and refuse to deal with any fact which threatens the security of their worldview, this produces the same effect as if they were actually retarded from birth.
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