LIVE THREAD: DEMCON -- DAY 4

www.freerepublic.com | July 29, 2004

[Howlin]

Live Convention Video, 7 - 11 p.m. ET
• Sen. John F. Kerry
• Max Cleland
• Kerry's daughters, Alexandra and Vanessa Kerry
• former Green Beret Jim Rassman
• Madeleine Albright
• Sen. Joe Biden (Del.)
• Wesley Clark
• Rep. James Clyburn (S.C.)
• Sen. Joe Lieberman (Conn.)
• Rep. Ed Markey (Mass.)
• Rep. Juanita Millender-McDonald (Calif.)
• Rep. Eleanor Holmes Norton (D.C.)
• House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (Calif.)
• Rep. Louise Slaughter (N.Y.)
• John Sweeney, President of AFL-CIO
• Gov. Mark Warner (Va.)

[pulaskibush]

Interesting, but are there any sources?

[Havoc]

And you "waited" for a $30,000 "dream job" for FOURTEEN YEARS? You could have built an entire career in that time. You set your sights way too low.

No, I set my sites on what I can get by with since I can't drive and have pretty serious ongoing health issues. Chronic Bronchitis, Pneumonia twice in 4 years and a handicap that prevents me from driving a car... I'm a human being with issues beyond my control working them to the best advantage I can get in the hell I've been through over the last 15 years. Forgive me if this isn't a physics experiment on paper in a perfect friction free environment. Human beings have complications in their lives not explained away by formulas.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

I am not gonna punish myself and watch anything they do, its nothing but a Holloywierd production!!!!

[AmericanVictory]

In his administration no platitude will go unmentioned, no broad commitment unfulfilled, no promise will be more than meaningless.

[gigi]

It's been a Hoot! Gnite all!

[VisualizeSmallerGovernment]

What the hell is in the water at MSNBC? The token Republicans, Buchanan and Scarborough, have swallowed the spit.

I was listening to Tony Snow the other day and he was saying that back 15 years ago or so, the cable networks would ask for conservatives, but only if they would act all nutty so the liberals could easily skewer their arguments. Like "You be pro-David Duke, and the hero will be anti-David Duke."

One of the saving graces of Fox News isn't just that they have conservatives, but they allow conservatives to express themselves without being total loons. It seems to me that MSNBC follows the old-school "conservative loon" pattern, where the right wingers aren't there so much to express their heartfelt opinions as to be some sort of circus freak.

This could explain why they're consistently in last place. Their internet news is even worse. Last week, one of the top stories was about post-traumatic stress felt by space alien abductees, without a hint of irony.

[pulaskibush]

The I hate Bush party is whining about mean-spirit.

I'm watching Jurrasic Park and I'm glad the circus is over.

[Havoc]

If you lose your job due to NAFTA, you can get free re-training or even college. Don't give up on yourself or else others will give up on you, too.

Not true. If you do not produce a tangible product, you don't get that benefit. First thing we checked out. IT workers are service industry and any unemployment office will tell you they don't qualify for training, etc. We are pariahs in the system. The papers won't print anything, the unemployment office isn't doing a thing for us. We've been written off for all practical purposes. We - not me. It ain't about me. I can talk about my personal experience here because I know all the things at issue complicating my situation. Others have their own complications. But some here want to make it about me and blame me and all those who have been put out of work for what is being done to them because they don't want anybody to put the blame where it belongs.I'm here to lay the blame where it belongs. That ticks them off. The truth threatens their percentage.

[maro]

Maybe she has a closet full of 'em.

[RasterMaster]

IT'S CALLED PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY! My grandfather was a share-cropper, never owned anything but the clothes on his back, and he was able to feed a family of 10. He was comfortable with that life, but I wanted more, so I got off my a$$ to make it happen. I have lost a job after 9-11, but it wasn't because of Bush. I took care of my mother on her death bed. Clinton's GREAT FMLA program got me fired. I was unemployed for 8 months after that, but still found work to feed my family in the meantime. Sometimes I lived paycheck to paycheck, but I have always done alright with ONLY an associates degree. All I hear from you are EXCUSES for FAILURE.

Problem is, you seem to be the one blaming everyone else for your troubles. If you were THAT VALUABLE, then you would be finding something substantial, but you may have to pick up and move to where the job is. YOU SAID you were making 30K and wanted a 30K job. I say, that is setting your goals a bit low, isn't it? Keep trying...bang on doors, you will find something besides Wal-Mart that pays that much. Crying in your beer won't do much but prolong your situation.

[claudiustg]

---If Democrats won't watch the Democratic convention only a fool would believe they will show up at the polls in November. We are not looking at a 92 or 2000 turnout of 105 million. We are looking at a 1988, 1996 turn out of about 95 million. There will be 8 million fewer Democratic votes than there were in 2000 and 1992---

Agreed. That's why I've been saying Bush by 10 points.

Kerry's speech, for what it's worth, wasn't that bad, but it wasn't memorable either. The one good soundbite line "Help is on the way!" was stolen and thus unusable. Kerry rushed the whole thing; even the faithful couldn't really get on board. It didn't make the necessary connections with those deep seated desires and fears. It just enumerated them in a superficial manner. Most everyone already knew it wouldn't be a barnburner and weren't watching anyway.

[nopardons]

Sally went to boarding school with my daughter.She said this one day,when several girls were sitting around talking.My daughter was SHOCKED,called me and repeated the story.

[daybreakcoming]

**By the way, I consider the attack on the President's faith the lowest of the low.**

That one surprised me.....even for Kerry. I'm certain there is a God and I'm certain he made a note of that.

"And let me say it plainly: in that cause, and in this campaign, we welcome people of faith. America is not us and them. I think of what Ron Reagan said of his father a few weeks ago, and I want to say this to you tonight: I don't wear my own faith on my sleeve."

What is this "us" and "them"?? The way it reads says "them" are the people of faith.

[RasterMaster]

Hell, my wife makes more than that without a degree. She has health issues as well, but makes no excuses for them. My mom worked with a grapefruit-sized tumor in her gut for AT LEAST the last 5 years of her life, and it was more than likely her job that sped up the growth of cancer. REMOVE THE HANDICAP label and replace it in your mind with HANDI-CAN. You will find something but not if your spirits are low.

Have you ever thought of humbling yourself before GOD and asking Him for help? It works!

[Havoc]

I'm not counting on Bush to get me another job. I left Circuit City to come to my current job btw. 2 years and the local store folded up after I left too. It couldn't compete because it's a publicly traded company. As soon as a company sells out to the stock market, employees get the crap end until a business folds up because it can't maintain ever rising kickbacks to the stockholders and won't give raises for fear that the stock price will be affected.. etc. Corporate mentality, make the company money, make the stock maker money, but ever increasing pressure on the employees till you burn them up, get rid of them and bring in new ones to exploit till they've had enough... Business ethics. Welcome to Corporate America.

I had a good job and was doing fine. Bush doesn't control companies. He affects trade policy which in turn sets the standard for what companies can get by with doing - in this case, outsourcing. If you're looking for a way to allow the president to dodge responsibility for his policies and the affects thereof, you'll get no quarter here. It's his policy and his responsibility. Bill Clinton did not set George Bush's trade policy. George Bush did. Companies reacted based on what the Government told them they could get by with via trade policy.

I had a job that didn't lose to local competition. It didn't become obsolete. My job is being handed to Mexican nationals because they are mexicans with mexican cost of living and a different political system that doesn't give a hoot about rights or ethical considerations. My job still exists. American companies just decided that since policy says they can do it, they'll put americans out of work, exploit people in other lands and reimport their services for american dollars.. bypassing most of the rules of our marketplace and legal system, our rights, etc. Freedom loving capitalists who don't like the cost of working in a free country selling us out to exploit our neighbors ain't a good thing.

[bray]

Why is it fine for Heinz Corp to outsource 57 factories but not ok for any other companies? Who says Heinz reasons are not the same as other companies?

Pray for W and Our Troops

[nopardons]

All you do is complain.An IT job that pays $30,000 is a VERY low level one.You may or may not have disabilities,but you have a terrible,ill educated attitude.

Getting on the big board,is they way businesses get capitol.If they don't raise money that way,they don't expand.And yes,the shareholders ARE due money,because they funded the company.

There are now MORE jobs,FOR AMERICANS,in the IT field,than there have been in years.The salaries are also expotentially higher than they used to be.

You really enjoy this "victim" act,but nobody else on FR does.It's become more than tiresome and bandwidth wasting.

[Jaidyn]

Sorry to hear that. And I do understand. Many of the people who lost their jobs with me five years ago are either smiling at Walmart or flipping burgers, or not even qualified for that. Some of them have work-related illnesses but can't get workers comp. Some of them are my age, but can't make it in college because they didn't graduate from high schools. There's all sorts of reasons and I don't like to see people get lumped together, as per is the norm for bureacracies.

I have downsized my life to the bare necessities. I sold my home and paid cash for a mobile home and by the time I get out of college, I will be 58. I'm taking extra courses to get out early. I doubt I will ever retire, though my kids say they will help me. I sure hope it never comes to that.

[pulaskibush]

Some of the outsourcing is Bush's fault, but not all of it. I would have put more emphasis on the CEO of your company for your case.

You must also know that if Kerry gets into the White House, he will make things much worse! Same thing with illegal immigration, and government spending, two issues that I feel much stronger about than outsourcing. Capitalism has its faults, but socialism is always a failure. That's why I'm volunteering and voting for Bush.

[pulaskibush]

That's part of the response that I'm saying Bush needs to make on this outsourcing issue.