PHONY IRAQI ABUSE OUTRAGE SYNDROME

Regularguys.com ^ | 05/05/04 | Larry Wachs

[slim mackerel]

WHEN GOOD NEWS COMES OUT BAD

Happy Cinco de Drinko everybody!

There's is so much good news in the paper lately. Only problem is it's presented as bad.

The latest trick of the left, which proved incredibly effective last decade in helping Rodney King become a WMD, is to work up a lot of phony outrage at Iraqi prisoners being tortured and abused by our military.

"Iraqi Prisoner Urinated On!" And the problem is..? It's the least we can do, really. OK, you're in the Twin Towers on 9/11/01. What would you choose? Someone flying a packed airliner into your head or getting peed upon in the lobby? Thought so. To the anti-US news reporters the only American allowed to pee on others is R Kelly. The only outrageous thing to me is that the soldiers did not shout, "That's for Tillman and Pearl" while they were emptying their bladders on the kindly shepherds.

Yes, I know. Even Rumsfeld and Bush are outraged. What do you expect them to say? "Well, the White House believes that pissing on a guy has it's merits?" Don't they already have their hands full trying to explain to the mentally disabled of the print media the basic concepts of right vs. wrong and self-defense?

It's sad that the news media treats Michael Jackson better than our military. And it's sad that some people are eager to prosecute any of our military as war criminals before Saddam Hussein answers to his evil.

Abuse is necessary for the survival of a free state. These "prisoners" have another name. Enemy combatants. We are fighting dirty people who see Geneva Conventional warfare as old school. "Yo my sand nigga. That's a bunch of Babylonia. Knowwhatitisthatiamsayingtoyoumyfriend?"

As I said last year on the air to much hootery and derision, the eggshells upon which President Bush must walk to fight this war will continue to cause needless death. Lob a nuke and see what happens. It worked for the Japs. They sure as hell calmed down and concentrated on electronics and sushi.

Everytime we conquer a land everyone wins.When we fought Germany did anyone think it would yield some of the kinkiest porn America has ever seen? Tons of Jews driving Mercedes?

We whipped Russia's ass, everybody loves vodka now...more so than Raymond. It's even flavored for the 'tweens.

Britain and Canada...America's twin sons. We steal all their comedians and TV shows and make them better..Tom Green being the exception.

The South is in much better shape than the North these days. NASCAR is huge everywhere. We even succeed when we kick our own ass! That's how great this country is.

So before we weaken ourselves even further in the eyes of the Arab world by holding congressional hearings on the wedgie, let's make examples of the soldiers who have bravely farted in the face of evil by giving them medals that they can bring back home so John Kerry can toss them over a fence.

TOMORROW: MORE GOOD NEWS DISGUISED AS BAD

[IMG]http://wwwimage.cbsnews.com/images/2004/04/30/image614954x.jpg[/IMG] "I'm gonna win that immunity idol, dammit."

[Long Cut]

"After I read the report, I felt ill. I want these clowns to get, at a minimum, 20 years confinement at hard labor."

As did/does anyone who served with honor, it seems.

The report details abuses which jump right over the line into sexual abuse, rape, and physical torture, all for the jollies of some extremely twisted individuals. I shudder to think of them walking around in society with their fantasies.

[independentmind]

Bump for a great post.

[Poohbah]

Like I said...wanna bet that lawyers are trolling the Virginia prison system, looking for anyone who was alone with that a$$hat who's got a day job as a corrections officer?

[editor-surveyor]

"Iraqi Prisoner Urinated On!"
And the problem is..? It's the least we can do, really.

We are in full agreement (as usual, choir).

I have plenty of outrage, and it is all directed toward the 'news' media.

Go W !! - Go Rummy !!

[MEG33]

#126

[Van Jenerette]

I agree with you...I'm always amazed how the REMFs play 'tough-guys'along with the non-combatants here and in the media. When you think that someone like Ranger (Cpl)Pat Tillman was wearing an American uniform and you then see pictures of these pukes in the same uniform your realize the term 'a disgrace to the uniform' is warranted.

There is no honor and no glory in any of this...

As a 23+ year Army veteran; Enlisted 6-years, Comissioned Infantry, etc. I'm disgusted by these sorry sacks of crap pretending to be soldiers...

Van Jenerette - www.jenerette.com

[MACVSOG68]

Thank you Van, and well said. I could not add more.

[philman_36]

Until you do that, I would ask you to please hold your opinions in check. You do not have all the facts.
And what the hell makes you think that I've NOT read the report? That's awful damned presumptuous of you.
FR isn't the only place on the net. Yeah, I've got their cookie, but I've got more than one computer to get on the net. Nobody follows me completely.

If you still think "it was no big deal", then we have nothing further to discuss.
I've got plenty to discuss if you're going around saying that "everyone shares the shame". You carry all the shame you want, but don't include me in your little pity party.

And what the hell are you doing flagging poohbah to this for? Can't you address me without somebody holding your hand?

[philman_36]

...go to this thread, and read the Pentagon's official report.
What you've recommended isn't possible. The thread doesn't have the report so it can't be read there. It does have the link to a .pdf file.
You may want to pass along this nice little link which will help those not wanting to have Acrobat on their system...Adobe PDF Conversion by Simple Form
Just copy the .pdf addie (http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/prisoner_abuse_pentagon.pdf) in and away you go.

[philman_36]

And this is the message you get...Error converting your document http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/prisoner_abuse_pentagon.pdf: input file not available

[TC Rider]

Please explain how these "atrocities" are in any way worse than what is done during that most vicious of rituals, fraternity hell week.

What I find amazing is that there are huge numbers of people in lower Manhatten and San Francisco who would pay for that kind of abuse, and probably equal numbers who would pay to dish it out. Most of whom are good Democrats who will vote for Kerry.

[mudblood]

I appreciate your point of view, and applaud the conviction in which you maintain it. My point of view, though, is that the Geneva Convention is for wealthy nations and armchair generals; for old-style wars where battles were fought, prisoners exchanged and a few drinks had by all around. The reason we're there is not to win and make friends but to kill and destroy the enemy, to demoralize it and grind it into dust. Nope, I'm not talking about civilian (at least, not the ones who appreciate us). I'm talking about anyone who shoots at Americans, plots against us, or even sympathizes with the enemy (the cheering masses). Sadam was a bad man, and his prisons were evil because they were filled with children and political enemies. We should make our military prisons over there so vile and hated that nobody would EVER WANT TO BE PUT IN ONE. They need to get that salad-tosser from HBO over there to show them how to really do it right.

[philman_36]

Here, for instance...ARTICLE 15-6 INVESTIGATION OF THE 800th MILITARY POLICE BRIGADE
...is one place to look for the report. There are many more.

Perhaps you can answer this question I have regarding this, since you're so "all knowing"...
We reviewed numerous photos and videos of actual detainee abuse taken by detention facility personnel, which are now in the custody and control of the US Army Criminal Investigation Command and the CJTF-7 prosecution team.
If those photos and videos were held by CID the CJTF-7 team then how did they get into the public mainstream?
Were they "leaked"?

And how about this little nugget...
I find that contrary to the provision of AR 190-8, and the findings found in MG Ryder’s Report, Military Intelligence (MI) interrogators and Other US Government Agency’s (OGA) interrogators actively requested that MP guards set physical and mental conditions for favorable interrogation of witnesses. Contrary to the findings of MG Ryder’s Report, I find that personnel assigned to the 372ndMP Company, 800th MP Brigade were directed to change facility procedures to “set the conditions” for MI interrogations. I find no direct evidence that MP personnel actually participated in those MI interrogations.

Oh, I've read "the report" of this "one day visit"...
On 2 February 2004, I took my team to Baghdad for a one-day inspection of the Abu Ghraib Prison (BCCF) and the High Value Detainee (HVD) Complex in order to become familiar with those facilities.
My, so much accomplished in just one day.

When asked why the rules in 1A/1B were different than the rest of the wings, SGT Davis stated: “The rest of the wings are regular prisoners and 1A/B are Military Intelligence (MI) holds.”
Real special guys holed up in 1A/B there giving "statements of fact" to this investigating team.

Give me a break, please.

[MEG33]

I propose the perps,headed by their Commander,Kapinski, appear before a gathering of thousands of of our armed forces and publically apologize for dereliction of duty,gross incompetence,the abuse,the pictures and bringing dishonor on the military.

Kapinski has made it worse by appearing on TV,accepting no respnsibility..none,zilch,nada.

[PISANO]

The Best comedy has some truth to it. Some of this was pretty funny.

[philman_36]

Now, do you still want to stand by this...
... all for the jollies of some extremely twisted individuals...
...after reading this...
I find that contrary to the provision of AR 190-8, and the findings found in MG Ryder’s Report, Military Intelligence (MI) interrogators and Other US Government Agency’s (OGA) interrogators actively requested that MP guards set physical and mental conditions for favorable interrogation of witnesses. Contrary to the findings of MG Ryder’s Report, I find that personnel assigned to the 372ndMP Company, 800th MP Brigade were directed to change facility procedures to “set the conditions” for MI interrogations. I find no direct evidence that MP personnel actually participated in those MI interrogations.
Are you implying that MI and OGA interrogators are the extremely twisted individuals?

I pity you knowing that you're walking around. They're MI and you're still active duty? Is Alaskan winter duty awaiting you? /sarcasm

[Long Cut]

In the first place, the entire report was posted to that thread I pinged you to. Merely scrolling down a bit would have shown you the whole thing. Many others managed this nicely; in fact you are the only one I pinged to it that did not.

Second, I pinged Poohbah because he is interested in these things. Do you have heat with him for something?

Third, the report speaks for itself. If you want to try to finesse or "spin" it, then you are taking the EXACT tack that such luminaries as Bill Clinton do. The report details a great deal of evidence of abuse, INCLUDING CONFESSIONS OF THE PERPS. Close your eyes if you want to, but it's still there, and it's still just as ugly.

Fourth, I tried to be polite with you. Your tone is quite the opposite. Since that is the case, and since you apparently wish to be contrarian, we really do have nothing further to discuss. You are denying the truth, have fun.

It might be instructive to note that you are, to my knowledge, the ONLY vet or active duty person around here taking the position you do. Given that, and again, your tone, you give me serious doubts about YOU.

[philman_36]

Oh look, here it is. The link goes like...this, not like this.

[philman_36]

It might be instructive to note that you are, to my knowledge, the ONLY vet or active duty person around here taking the position you do.
They ALL believe, like you, that we should "share the shame"? News to me.

You're right, we've nothing else to talk about. You just go ahead and belive the terrorists and their claims of abuse.
And you know what else? You can "bite me" with your sanctimony! Save it for someone else. I'm not here to be "liked".

[Long Cut]

" pity you knowing that you're walking around. They're MI and you're still active duty? Is Alaskan winter duty awaiting you? /sarcasm"

Actually, I was pitying you there for a second, but you eliminated that.

If MI or anyone was doing these things, then they, too, were disgracing their uniforms and all who wear them. If a prisoner has time-critical information, they are taken to a secure area, interrogated with drugs if need be, and then returned to detention.

In what insane world are they photographed on leashes for pictures and videotapes for the amusement of junior National Guard troopers? In what world are they sexually abused? If that is the military you think we should have, then there are others besides the American one who make that a matter of policy.

We do not...and those who nonetheless do so are guilty of many, many courts-martial offenses. They also lower our standing in our own country and around the world.

I'm sorry indeed that you were one of those "rebels", apparently, who had little regard for the face that we all present to the world and our countrymen. I'm also sorry that you apparently cannot see the very real damage that these activities do to ALL servicemen. EVERY one serving that I now know, after ten years in the Navy, deplores this disgrace, and all feel a bit of shame because of it. Morale has suffered greatly.

But, hey! YOU feel great about it, obviously. Although, maybe not...you ARE, after all, attempting to "spin" the report so it comes under question.

I will not have some idiotic flame war about this with you. Your opinions, frankly, disgust me no end, and your continued rudeness is just all the more reason now for me to ignore you as I would dismiss ANY excuses now being offered by these perps.