I'm Looking for "Patriot Act" Success Stories

[PureSolace]

All week long I've been talking with other students at the school I go to about the pros and cons of the Patriot Act, and I was wondering if any freepers had any information to contribute. Does anyone have a list of success stories or embarrassments because of the Patriot Act? From the searches that I've done it seems most of the websites on the net are anti Patriot Act because they say it can be abused and target regular everyday citizens, and even peaceful protesters? (That one baffled me) Anyway, Any information or insight you guys can give would be wonderful. Thanks :)

[E=MC²]

The much hated John Ashcroft (hated by liberals and liberal-tarians) said that over 350 dangerous individuals have been deported as a result of the Patriot Act. And, please name ONE law that can't be abused...all laws require vigilance.

[PureSolace]

good point Publius6961 :)

[VaBthang4]

Well....





...err...



...uhm...


...none of that matters if one (1) person cant sell weed out of the back of their minimarket.

[Stone Mountain]

You put a fence up around your backyard in order to keep elephants out?

It works, doesn't it?

[Jim Cane]

Let me understand this...

Is it your position that neither the Iranians or North Koreans have any nuclear capability and that even if they do...the federal government [which you seemingly loath] knows exactly where 'all' of their radioactive materials are at 'all' times?

The answer to your question is no, your words are not my position. And to clarify. Just as we are called to hate the sin, but not the sinner, I hate the sheer SIZE and SCOPE of the federal government, not the fedgov itself.

[JohnGalt]

That does not make any sense; if they violated a law in the Patriot Act they would be tried and if convicted sent to prison, not deported.

Where did you get that information?

[VaBthang4]

Therefore you agree we face the legitimate threat of Nuclear, Chemical or Biological terrorism from more than just China...


...dont you?

~grin~

[Steel Wolf]

How do we explain that there were zero terrorist attacks in the United States for the two years prior to September 11, 2001. Was that the Patriot Act?

There is no way to explain why attacks don't happen. (See Reply #11). Terrorists and other aggressors don't go to the U.N., pass resolutions, and wait 12 years for us to get into compliance before they launch a highly publicized attack. They do it when they can, and when they feel like it.

Occasionally, we do have some successes. (Try a search on Oplan Bojinka, for instance). Thwarting plans just doesn't grab people's attention in the same way 3,000 fatalities does, though. They sometimes they aren't even publicized, more often they are completely ignored by the media.

[freeeee]

name ONE law that can't be abused...all laws require vigilance.

The people who started this country knew from the hard lessons of history that government itself is prone to abuse. Realizing that government is a necessary evil, they invented a system with limited powers, some enumerated rights and a strong system of checks and balances. Ensuring that those necessary limits are kept on our government so that it does not become oppressive is the vigilance you speak of. Giving away the store and hoping nothing bad happens is not vigilance, it is naivity and ignorance of the hard lessons of history and the nature of power.

Along comes 9/11 and apparently these checks on our government are considered too restrictive in a "war". So we get the PA act, which among other things eliminates some checks and balances, and violates enumerated rights. The PA is supposed to be an extraordinary tool, temporary and to be used only for terrorism.

So what happens? A wish list that has long sat on the Justice Departments shelf (some of which the Clinton administration tried to pass) is passed - and you guessed it, it's already being used in cases that have nothing to do with terrorism. In fact, the Justice Department is giving seminars to LEA's on how to do exactly that.

This is a classic abuse of the public's trust, and a textbook case of mission creep. It's also exactly what many warned would happen. It was predicable as the sun rising in the morning.

[reformedliberal]

Words cannot convey how much I am enjoying your responses on this thread.

KUDOS!!!

[sit-rep]

By the time I got to post 14, I saw the barrage you received for quoting Franklin...

I would say we've lost because of the tremendous decay of once America's great culture. There is nothing, nothing except for the clauses of indian/natives, that do not apply today as if it was yesterday in regard to the writings of our fore fathers. These folks are helpless goons who look to our fed to protect them, instead of doing it themselves.

SR

[VaBthang4]

"That does not make any sense"

Oh please...

"if they violated a law in the Patriot Act they would be tried and if convicted sent to prison, not deported."

Not if a portion of the Patriot Act enabled the Justice Department or INS to uncover the fact that those 350 individuals were here illegaly and therefore deported.

[VaBthang4]

You fascist!!!

:o)

[VaBthang4]

???

[VaBthang4]

That's not what I asked you.

[reformedliberal]

Gives new meaning to "My way or die" doesn't it? :)

[JohnGalt]

You are talking about the enforcement of an existing law--wow, praise the Lord.


Were the gubmint employees who let the 350 into the country in the first place arrested and put in prison?

[JohnGalt]

That about covers it.

More Todd Beamers, Fewer Ivy Leaguers.

[Trickyguy]

0 [zero] Terrorists attacks in the United States since September 11th, 2001

I'm sure all the people shot and killed by Muslims in this country would disagree with that.

[VaBthang4]

No, I am talking about new capabilities under the Patriot Act that enable the Justice Department or INS to uncover illegal activity and then enforce the law...new or existing.

~WINK~