I'm Looking for "Patriot Act" Success Stories

[PureSolace]

All week long I've been talking with other students at the school I go to about the pros and cons of the Patriot Act, and I was wondering if any freepers had any information to contribute. Does anyone have a list of success stories or embarrassments because of the Patriot Act? From the searches that I've done it seems most of the websites on the net are anti Patriot Act because they say it can be abused and target regular everyday citizens, and even peaceful protesters? (That one baffled me) Anyway, Any information or insight you guys can give would be wonderful. Thanks :)

[VaBthang4]

Haha...I dont care.

[Porterville]

Oh please, using cliches to defend a position is as weak as anything; it is using the ridiculous to counter hyperbole.

[Porterville]

I meant to say, I am using the ridiculous to counter hyperbole

[OutSpot]

"The M1A1 Abrams MBT in the photo [second from the bottom] was photoshopped in."

That is pure horse $hit

"My job is graphics so save the whining."

What are you a Marine or a graphic artist. Make up your mind?!?!

[GingisK]

...Constitution is not a solid foundation...

You are misinformed. You are baseless if you cannot respond with content. You are not and will never be part of the solution.

You do not represent "your generation". Most of them can have a discussion without immediately breaking down into diatribe and attack on characters about whom you know nothing.

You are one of the "jackbooted thugs": you would lay waste to any who do not share your unfounded and undereducated opinions.

[VaBthang4]

Haha...okay.

You tell us then...what kind of armored vehicle is it? If you could, please provide an image of the armored vehicle you claim it to be.

[VaBthang4]

Yawn

[VaBthang4]

???

[VaBthang4]

???

[OutSpot]

"You tell us then...what kind of armored vehicle is it? If you could, please provide an image of the armored vehicle you claim it to be.

I think I can do better, how about I source my results for you.

The Free Market (reprinted in Mises.org) 3/94 Ron Paul "…For example, most people probably believe that the government attacked the Waco Christians because they were "stockpiling" weapons. Were they? Texans own 60 million firearms, about 3.5 per person. At Mt. Carmel there were two firearms per person, most of them locked away. The rest of their protection consisted of hay bales and plywood. The stockpiling accusation was an act of projection, for the real stockpiler was the government. In the attack on Waco, agents used M113 personnel carriers, M2AO Bradley fighting vehicles, Sikorsky Blackhawks, Apache and UH-1 Bell helicopters, Abrams MI tanks, 7.62nim machine guns, FBI SWAT snipers, two varieties of hand grenades, and the FBI's psychological warfare experts. The government even fired canisters of CS gas, banned in warfare by international treaty, through windows and walls...."

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Public Action, Inc. 12/30/99 Carol Valentine "…. Lee Hancock is a reporter for the Dallas Morning News. From March 1, 1993 onward, her by-line appeared on many FBI disinformation pieces on Waco that masqueraded as "news stories." Of particular interest is her article of April 15, 1993, "No easy answers, law authorities puzzle over methods to end Branch Davidian siege." In the body of the article, Hancock casually mentions FBI plans to assassinate David Koresh: Note the fourth paragraph, which has been capitalized for emphasis. "WACO--For the armchair tactician, forcing an end to the 46-day Branch Davidian standoff might sound easy enough.

"Lob tear gas or other chemical agents in until the Branch Davidians are too incapacitated to fight and have no choice but to stagger out to waiting agents.

"Expose and limit their hiding places by crushing outer walls of the cult's sprawling Mount Carmel compound with . Bradley fighting vehicles and 37-ton Abrams M-1 tanks.

Now please tell me of one source other than you that has ever mentioned that this photo has been manipulated. Otherwise I must assume that you are the sole person on earth whith this "theory". I await your response...

[OutSpot]

Here is one more source to refute your "theory" that M1A1 Abrams tanks were NOT used at WACO.

WorldNetDaily.com Thursday, October 16, 2003

".....West Point graduate Joseph Mehrten Jr. tells Insight, "Clark had to have knowledge about the plan because there is no way anyone could have gotten combat vehicles off that base without his OK. The M1A1 Abrams armor is classified 'Secret,' and maybe even 'Top Secret,' and if it was deployed as muscle for something like Waco there would have been National Firearms Act weapons issues. Each of these M1A1 Abrams vehicles is armed with a 125-millimeter cannon, a 50-caliber machine gun and two 30-caliber machine guns, which are all very heavily controlled items, requiring controls much like a chain of legal custody. It is of critical importance that such vehicles could not have been moved for use at Waco without Clark's knowledge....."

[handk]

When I read your post (#151) calling VaBthang4 on the carpet, I knew straight off he'd come back with a non-sequitur response and completely ignore your well stated points. He's incapable of staying "on point."

And after reading more than half of this thread, it's clear that VaBthang4 is pure statist, tyrannist fodder. What a tool -- useful idiot.

From his profile page...

VaBthang4 is the arrogant looking "fellow" on the left. Put him in a brown shirt and he'd resemble Goebbels, or that NAZI guy in Raiders of the Lost Ark (you know, the guy who picked up the hot metal artifact and burned its design into the palm of his hand?)

[OutSpot]

From the article above

"...Between August 1992 and April 1994, Clark was commander of the 1st Cavalry Division of the Army's III Corps at Fort Hood, Texas. !!!According to a report by the U.S. Department of the Treasury, the list of military personnel and equipment used at Waco included: 15 active-duty military personnel, 13 Texas National Guard personnel, nine Bradley fighting vehicles, five combat-engineer vehicles, one tank-retrieval vehicle and two M1A1 Abrams tanks.!!!Additionally, Fort Hood reportedly was used for much of the training for the bloody attack on the Davidians and their children...."

[Michael121]

Yes, let's. Publish and go on record and give full details about any and all planned attacks against US.

If we give out enough info maybe the terrorists can adjust.

If there are preventions let them be kept in the dark.

Where it may fail we will all know.

Let the CIA, FBI, NSA work where they do the best. Undercover and behind the scenes. I happen to have faith in individuals in America.

[OutSpot]

Ohhh Thee have suddenly become very silent VaBthang4.

Nothing like Freepers calling the kettle black.

[Jim Cane]

Are you prepared to acknowledge that capabilities the Justice Department and INS now have as a result of the Patriot Act enable them to find individuals who are here from other countries and acting in ways that are illegal?

Did they seal the border with Mexico? When did that happen? The myopia of the INS will prove to be as fatal to our Republic as the headlong rush to instill the domestic sharia law you so favour.

[VaBthang4]

ROTFLOL!!!

You're kidding right?

Ugh...

Look your Black Helicopter world aside...if you could please...find me a single [1] 'image' from a legitimate source [anything dopian is not legitimate] showing a single M1A1 Abrams tank anywhere in Waco, Texas much less the Mt. Carmel compound.

[VaBthang4]

Again...I did not ask you that.

[GingisK]

Thanks for your post. I needed a good chuckle after all of that! He does indeed look just like the sort of fellow that would be comfortable in the Gestapo. It would serve him if he got rid of that picture. His "angle on America" is precisely what is needed to get this country way deep into tyranny. Sad thing is, these blokes haven't even read the Founding documents they find so outdated.

The education of our young has been sorely neglected in those sorry government reeducation centers.

[GingisK]

Again...I did not ask you that.

Now look at who insists upon answers. You are in desperate need of consistency, among other things.