TERRI IS NOW BEING RE-HYDRATED. WE DID IT! BUT PLEASE CONTINUE TO PRAY, E-MAIL

Live report from Hospice

[Ragtime Cowgirl]

UPDATE FROM TERRI'S VIGIL SITE ON LOCATION... by floriduh voter and drk4the1: TERRI IS NOT BEING RE-HYDRATED AT MORTON PLANT HOSPITAL IN CLEARWATER, FL. The Governor's Office is under the impression and reporting that the procedure started at 7:07 pm. While it's being reported to the family attorney that she is not going to receive anything. A telephonic hearing is scheduled to begin at 8:30 pm est with Judge Douglas Baird re: Michael Schiavo's suit against Gov. Bush and his executive order of today. Additionally, Michael S. is disputing his removal as Terri's legal guardian. Anything helpful appreciated. Contact floriduh voter or the drk screen name. We are outside fighting the mosquitoes. H E L P !!!!!

293 posted on 10/21/2003 8:51 PM EDT by floriduh voter (Please keep following Terri Threads. We aren't done yet... updates also at terrisfight.org)

[NebraskaTrailrider]

I know about Shetlands, we 'rescued' ours from the neighbors goat farm lol. He thought he was a goat for a while. Anyway when we put him in with our Belgian giant, the shetland kicked his *ss. We had to separate that lil *hit from the other 2 and plan on taking him to auction if he doesn't nice up. Don't count on that though. He was acting so studdy toward Moon our filly. It is a strange thing to see a lil shetland pony kick a draft horse's butt.

[cyn]

I share your concern & join in that prayer. May angels, seen and unseen, continue to minister to Terri. May any hand that plans evil be found out and prevented. May she really get that milkshake Republic mentioned above, and hugs from her precious family. May there be a time of rest coming soon for her, her loved ones, and us all.

It is clear from all of Michael's decisions that he is evil and wishes to hurt Terri's family as much as possible.

This is NOT just that Terri 'didn't want to be alive like this.' I concluded after meeting the Schindlers that any normal person would be glad to be part of their family. This is that Michael is jealous of them, their closeness, (esp. Terri w/her brother Bobby), and wants to hurt them.

Not only was he going to cremate Terri's body, but planned to spread her ashes over an out-of-state Schiavo place to add insult to injury.

[Graymatter]

>>Any facility...if they and the doctors are worth their salt, they will tell the husband that he is not her guardian to the point of not allowing any treatment at all.

Even if his lawyer's there telling them it's been court-approved?

>>Hospitals and doctors take people to court all the time to intervene on behalf of the patient.

But it's been to court. It's been up to the Supreme Court and back down. It's OK to kill her.

What has NOT been to the Supreme Court yet is Bush's executive order, which is of questionable constitutionality. Felos has already challenged it in the press.

If you're familiar with hospitals you know that "First do no harm" now refers to a doctor's insurance premiums and his license.

[atruelady]

You didn't read what I wrote, only selective sentences. If you read what I wrote in it's entirety, you would get my meaning.

[Tucson_AZ]

"If you're familiar with hospitals you know that "First do no harm" now refers to a doctor's insurance premiums and his license."

Too true. You MUST have a patient advocate (trusted family member or close friend) with you at all times to make sure you are taken care of while in a hospital.

[cyn]

EXCELLENT -- thanks for posting that. There are so many jewels buried in these threads...hard to keep up.

AAPS [Association of American Physicians and Surgeons] Doctors: Schindler-Schiavo is Not a 'Death with Dignity' Issue -- 10/22/03 1:58:00 PM --
http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=125-10222003

[scriblett]

I'm in Canada, CNN reported that she had been in a persistent vegetative state for 13 years. Any reports I read say the same thing. If she is not, and has never been in this state, then how is it being reported as such.

Has she been on the feeding tube for 13 years?

If she had been given rehab. would she be walking and eating normally by now, was there a prognosis? There seems to be some information missing from all accounts.

Something isn't right here, if she is NOT in a vegetative state then why isn't the media showing pictures of her?

[Graymatter]

I did too read everything you wrote. And you're right I did select certain points that I wished to address. I think that's how it's done around here.

Your first paragraph discusses what should happen, assuming good intentions and honor among medical personnel. I don't assume that. You say the doctors will tell a guardian he has limitations---for example he isn't allowed to give orders that cause her death, but that isn't the case here. He IS legally permitted to do that, per Greer's ruling.

I agree with your statement in the 2nd paragraph, it is amazing that no one will intervene on Terri's behalf. I was supporting your assertion by explaining why.



Look at what would happen in my child was in dire need of medical help and I refused it based on the fact that I am her legal guardian. Hospitals and doctors take people to court all the time to intervene on behalf of the patient. It is amazing that no one will do this for Terri even before tubes were ordered removed, etc.

I agree with your 3rd and final paragraph. I just omitted "You go girl" or "Hear hear!" or "Amen" none of which is my style.

I got your meaning, ma'am. You didn't get mine.

[Theodore R.]

Though he says he would not and has not discussed abortion, I thought that several years ago Boortz had done so and endorsed access to abortion but not taxpayer-funded abortions. That is the position of most Libertarians though Rep. Ron Paul, R-TX, is prolife.

[syriacus]

Anyone notice how silent the ACLU has been on this? Its like they went out of business!

The ACLU would not want to draw attention to themselves or their plan to legalize *****physician assisted death,***** unless absolutely necessary

Their Florida branch of the ACLU gave an award to the former Chief Justice of the FL Sup Ct Gerald Kogan, because he supports physician assisted death. They said he was courageous to dissent from other FSSC judges.

Annual ACLU banquet honors Justice Kogan

     "Always the courageous judge, Justice Kogan used his years on the bench to defend a wide range of individual rights," the ACLU of Florida proclaimed. As examples, the organization cited his dissent from the majority decision in Kirscher v. McIver,

Few find clear-cut answers in assisted suicide debate

By TAL ABBADY, Associated Press

[snip]

Hemlock insists that patients must be able-bodied enough to obtain and ingest the lethal drug dose — usually morphine — on their own.

"You have to have the means to stir it, drink it, push the liquids in yourself," said Mary Hudson, president of the Florida Hemlock Society.

Hudson bristles at the word suicide to describe Hemlock-aided deaths.

"Assisted death is untraumatic, not violent," said Hudson. "In our cases, family is always a part of the planning. That's hardly what we think of as suicide." [snip]

Like many Hemlock advocates, Robert Rivas sees no distinction between physician-assisted death and a doctor's legal right to cut off a dying patient's life support upon the family's consent.

"It's a totally phony distinction," said Rivas. "The Court just didn't have the courage to apply the law. They were afraid of being discredited and attacked."

Retired Supreme Court Justice Gerald Kogan, who wrote the only dissenting opinion in the 1997 ruling, agrees [that there is no difference between physician assisted death and removing life support].

"The court should have been bolder," said Kogan. "We allow doctors to disconnect feeding tubes and respirators. It makes no sense to say there's a difference. In both cases, the doctor is assisting in the patient's death." [snip]

Another link on Kogan: Kogan Took Unethical Swipe at [Sanders] Sauls

[syriacus]

if she is NOT in a vegetative state then why isn't the media showing pictures of her?

Ironically, they have been showing pictures of Terri responding to her mother at the very same time that the newsfolks talk about her being vegetative. It's really odd.

Most people who see the videos of her at Terrisfight.org think she is not vegetative.

Doctors and therapists have said she could respond to therapy. The judge has conveniently ignored that testimony. Mike and his lawyer George Felos want it ignored.

[restornu]

It makes you wonder about others

The British theoretical physicist Stephen Hawking (1942-) has devoted much of his life to probing the space-time described by general relativity and the singularities where it breaks down. And he’s done most of this work while confined to a wheelchair, brought on by the progressive neurological disease amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, or Lou Gehrig’s Disease. Hawking is the Lucasian Professor of Mathematics at Cambridge, a post once held by Isaac Newton.

He has brain damage and uses some kind of a computer to speak and think his thought on the monitor.

Why hasn't this type of technology be tried on others at least to communicate!

[Ragtime Cowgirl]

Terri's case opened a few eyes. Americans are fed up with 'leaders' undermining God, family and country to pursue personal power.

Existing laws were supposedly followed over these 13 years of the Michael Schiavo / Felos-Greer 'guardianship'.

Slavery was once law. Roe v. Wade is today.

Perhaps, if Christian churches refused the tax-free status, Pastors would speak about issues of the day in public, to the press, at townhall meetings - without fear of losing that status. When ACLU threats / 'revocation of tax-status notices' arrive in church mailboxes during election years, Pastors could then toss them in the trash, and carry on without bowing to domestic, anti-Christian 'enemies'.

[syriacus]

I'm in Canada, CNN reported that she had been in a persistent vegetative state for 13 years.

People who are brain injured vary, from time to time, in how well they can carry out commands. Just like we have good days and bad days and we are less clumsy in one part of the day than in another.

A patient does NOT need to respond consistently in order to be considered non-vegetative. All they need to do is prove they can follow some commands some of the time.

However the folks in charge of Terri's life have been monkeying around with the definition of Persistent Vegetative State. They are saying that since she can not consistently perform well she is in a Persistent Vegetative State. They are talking to her too quickly and not allowing her time to process their requests. Even ordinary teachers know that special ed students need to be given extra time to perform a task and need to have the task carefully explained to them.

Mike's doctors and lawyers are playing word games. She not in a coma. Mike's doctors say she is in a Persistent Vegetative State. Other doctors say she is not.

One of Mike's doctors, Ronald Cranford, has misdiagnosed at least one patient as PVS, who went on to recover.

I wouldn't want Cranford examining me or a member of my family.

[Aracelis]

"Terri Schindler-Schiavo has won a temporary stay from execution by a method too cruel to be used for convicted criminals. And yet her husband's attorney is trying to spin it into a 'death with dignity issue' with his comments on Tuesday./i>

Wow! More voices being heard now. This is great!

[Pan_Yans Wife]

Judge Napolitano on Gibson's FOX program, next.

[Ragtime Cowgirl]

Thanks for the ping. We discussed this weeks ago and I don't remember the details.

Pinging experts.

Julie, MM, cp, do you know whether it's legal for hospices in Fla. to care for non-terminal patients?

[First_Salute]

Bump.

[Aracelis]

Any idea what is happening with Terri now? Are her parents being allowed to see her? What is her condition? Just finished a big exam and need to dash to work, don't have time to read the thread. Thanks in advance!

[syriacus]

He's also EXTREMELY wary of giving the government the right to interfere in personal medical decisions.

You'd think he would also be EXTREMELY wary about Governments encouraging doctors to kill disabled patients.