Florida: Complaints over restaurants not complying with smoking ban

First Coast News ^

[SheLion]

DUVAL COUNTY, FL -- Florida's smoking ban was officially put into place on July 1st but not everyone is abiding. The state has had close to 800 complaints on restaurants that are not complying with the rules.

In Duval County, there have been 19 complaints with the majority coming from customers of RP McMurphy's located in Jacksonville Beach. The restaurant has received a warning and has 30 days to comply.

[Steely Glint]

"You omitted Gamma Radiation from your most informative list. You also failed to mention that tobacco smoke is responsible for global warming and extinction of the dinosaurs.

When you wish to perpetrate a myth include it all."

All those items are actually found in cigarette smoke. Lok it up.

Cigarette smoking is a very real health hazard. That's a fact, not a myth.

[E Rocc]

They ticket the bar that is "allowing" smoking. This proves its all about money, the bar has a fixed address and a liquor license and is more likely to pay the mordida. Meanwhile, it's the people allegedly being "protected", the bar employees, left holding onto the clintony end of the law enforcement stick.

That's good, Eric. You seem to know what your talking about. And yes, it's all about the money. I just wonder how long they think the money will hold out? It's getting mighty thin.

Oh, I don't doubt it's about the busybodyism too. Some people think their own personal opinions should be codified into law and strictly enforced. This is an example.

Drunks are fun enough to deal with late at night without having to tell them they can't smoke (or can't take their drink outside while they step outside to smoke).

-Eric

[VRWC_minion]

Yep, we should be consistent and raise taxes every year to cover the additional spending required to run our government

Banning smoking will lower my restaurant bill. Lower labor, maintenance and cleaning will save me money.

[VRWC_minion]

This is a free country, and if people who want to be waiters/waitresses feel that some secondhand smoke might make them reconsider the occupation, then so be it.

But they have no choice if smoking is allowed.

[VRWC_minion]

You just don't like the smell, anymore, and have admitted such on other threads

I do care that these poor workers have to smell the stench of your tobacco just to eek out a living or to pursue their chosen profession. These people are of no concern to the selfish and rude smokers.

[E Rocc]

Why should ETS be any different on health issues?

The smoke nannies want ETS to be the only workplace chemical not controlled using PELs (Permissible Exposure Levels). Originally they wanted OSHA to issue a PEL of zero. OSHA declined, realizing that:

1) There is no such thing as "zero" in chemical analysis. There is only "below detection limit".

2) They would be declaring ETS to be more toxic than cyanide, which has a finite PEL.

Since OSHA's demurral, the SNs have simply pushed for a ban ignoring the basic principle of industrial hygiene.

-Eric

[kegler4]

"THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A CASE OF A WAITER WHO HAS DIED FROM SECOND HAND SMOKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Proof? How do you know this?

Can somebody post their research showing second-hand smoke never causes health problems for anybody? I'd like to read it.

[Conspiracy Guy]

Do you eat meat? Do you eat commercially grown produce? Do you drink water? Do you breath air?

Why don't you build a little bubble to live in?

[pageonetoo]

try using your backbone, and prying... I quit 24 years ago, and just quit... no tapering, no patch, no pills, no bs...just quit... and you can too, if you really want to do it!
there is no reason you cannot quit, except your desire NOT TO QUIT!
get a spine, and don't let some inner self weaknesses defeat your real desire to quit, (if you do want to quit)
just say no! is a real answer... but only YOU can do it!
(and I still want one!)

[VRWC_minion]

Do employees have a right to work "peanut free"?

If we protected 90% of all other employees from having to work in and around some hazard or perceived hazard then why should we not give the same courtesy to waitstaff ? Are they second class citizens just because you want to smoke in a bar ?

[CSM]

"Banning smoking will lower my restaurant bill. Lower labor, maintenance and cleaning will save me money."

Wrong again. Do you ever use that organ contained in your skull? The reality is that the cost of capitol will now be spread over fewer customers, therefore driving the cost of each individual product (meal) up. In addition, the residue from cooking and the toxins contained there in will also require the same amount of cleaning and maintenance, these costs will not decline.

You are right about one aspect of this, the labor cost as a whole for the rest. will go down. They won't have as many patrons to serve, so the number of servers will go down. However, that is a variable cost and it will be break even in your meals cost.

[E Rocc]

Banning smoking will lower my restaurant bill. Lower labor, maintenance and cleaning will save me money.

Then many bars would already ban smoking. The problem is that overhead (rent or mortgage/taxes, lights, heat, licensing) is not affected by the number of patrons. Less patrons means that each one either absorbs a greater share, or the owner does.

-Eric

[metesky]

Do you always try to win your arguments by calling the opposition dumb?

And yes, I'm just mean enough to put you whiners who apparently can't take life on it's own terms on an ice floe and push you out to sea, thus saving all of us thousands of dollars in heartburn medication.

[CSM]

"Proof? How do you know this?

Can somebody post their research showing second-hand smoke never causes health problems for anybody? I'd like to read it."

It is not possible to prove a negative. To refute the above statements you must prove that ETS has killed someone. You can not prove that activity A does not cause B! You can only prove what activity A does cause.

[Steely Glint]

The arguments from the addicts here come in two forms:

1. Some version of "Smoking isn't harmful!"

That's not just wrong, it's stupid. Every reputable scientist, every reputable medical staffer, every government agency, every reputable university, every reputable research agency knows better than that. There is no argument in the scientific community about smoking being a health hazard. None.

2. Some version of "The government has no right to reguaate bars and restaurants! That's socialism! Waah!"

This is - again - not just wrong but stupid. Regulation of inns and pubs for the public good dates back to medieval England, centuries before anyone ever heard of Karl Marx. Every restaurant and bar in America is ALREADY under government regulation.

You addicts need to find a real argument somewhere. Arguing that cigarette smoke isn't harmful or that public health codes are somehow socialist is just too dumb for words.

[SheLion]

Ofcourse, then we will see more whiney non-smokers rushing up to the door "demanding" smoke-free service.

Unfortunately, this has been tried by Diners and Restaurants and even bars trying to get around this asinine law. However, the Health Department has ways to disallow this. They say it's for the "level playing field" you know.

[metesky]

Only 800 complaints ?

Only because you couldn't carry more than $80 worth of dimes.

[Steely Glint]

"Do you always try to win your arguments by calling the opposition dumb?"

When the opposition has only stupid and invalid arguments, why not? And the pro-smoking arguments in this thread are, frankly, stupid and invalid.

[VRWC_minion]

Labor is the largest cost and having a restaurant split into two sections requires having extra staff. Running a restaurant that isn't separate increases efficiency. In addition, turnover is the name of the game in restuarants. Smoking slows down turnover.

As for the maintenance costs, the smoke from the kitchen isn't affecting the windows and walls in the serving area.

Your argument about fewer customers is valid if true but so far these bans have only had temporary affects on this. The last restaurant I went to yesterday still had a 45 minute wait to get seated. They are at capacity. Their costs are down now and I will enjoy a decrease in my cost due to competive forces.

[VRWC_minion]

Then many bars would already ban smoking

The costs might be lower but as another poster pointed out the customers will drop off. That is why a state wide ban is needed so all restaurants are smoke free. That way the smokers will still eat at the same restaurants.