.45-70 at Two Miles: The Sandy Hook Tests of 1879

Rifle Magazine ^ | November 1977 | W. John Farquharson

[tall_tex]

Thanks for the informative post.

As a heads up, I went to the Academy store here in Austin, got 1000 rounds of 9MM autos for $5.98 per 50, full metal jacket. 45 autos were 14.95.

BTW, I have had passed down through my family an 1832 SUHL 50 Cal, percussion rifle. It has lots of brass and a lot of notches on the stock.

Are you familiar with it, or know how I might research it on the internet?

Thankful for your help. Tom

[LibKill]

That is one heck of a good simulation. I have bookmarked it for future practice.

[Inyo-Mono]

...the .22 rimfire (short) was the first modern cartridge, dating to the 1850's and the Smith and Wesson revolver.

You are correct. The .22 rimfire was introduced by Smith & Wesson in 1857 for their No. 1 revolver under the Rollin White patent. By 1861 they began production of the .32 rimfire for the Model 2 revolver. Many were carried by soldiers during the War Between the States.

Until 1869, when the patent ran out, Smith & Wesson was the only gun company legally producing cartridge revolvers with bored through cylinders.

[Old Professer]

"'Scuse me, while I kiss the sky..."

[Inyo-Mono]

BTW, I have had passed down through my family an 1832 SUHL 50 Cal, percussion rifle. It has lots of brass and a lot of notches on the stock.

Are you familiar with it, or know how I might research it on the internet?

Contact the National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association (NMLRA). They can tell you what it is.

[Blue Screen of Death]

21 seconds. All objects fall at the rate of 32 feet/sec². That means the guy arched this thing how high in the air to hit the target.

[nightdriver]

"The Hornady 500 grain RN bullet can be driven to a MV of 1700 fps by 50.1 grains of IMR 3031, and 1800 fps by 53.1 grains of IMR 3031."

I was wondering if IMR3031 wouldn't be a good propellant for the old warhorse. I found it about the best (though very slightly on the hot side) for 150 grain jacketed loads in a 30-06. I use about 50 grains there also.

[Myrddin]

Magnum Research also puts out a revolver in 45-70 as well.

I have the .45-70 BFR with the 10" barrel. It will shoot 300 to 500 grain bullets. Very comfortable and accurate. The gunsmith at Magnum Research says to hold the max pressures to under 31,000 PSI. That makes it stronger than a typical trapdoor at around 24,000 CUP and not as strong as the Marlin 1895G lever action at 40,000 CUP. The falling block Ruger #1 rifles can sustain 50,000 CUP. Magnum Research just announced availability of "the other cylinder" for the BFR in .45-70. You can get the 450 Marlin cylinder for your .45-70 BFR. You have to send the revolver back to the factory to have the 450 Marlin cylinder fitted. That gives you the ability to fire either .45-70 Govt or 450 Marlin from the same revolver frame by just swapping cylinders. The cost for the other cylinder is $150. The 450 Marlin brass is belted at the case head so you don't accidentally stuff it into a .45-70 rifle or revolver that can't handle the higher pressures.

I reload all my own ammo in .45-70. I build the cartridges with around 29,000 CUP as a target pressure so they can go in either the Marlin 1895G or BFR .45-70. The brass case is so big that you have to add a small cotton batting wad on top of the powder to keep it near the primer. That is especially true with the small 300 gr bullets. The 405 and 500 consume enough case volume to keep the powder back where it belongs.

[Myrddin]

21 seconds. All objects fall at the rate of 32 feet/sec2. That means the guy arched this thing how high in the air to hit the target.

Assuming the target was exactly 2 miles down range, a muzzle velocity of 607 fps with a barrel elevation around 33 degrees would produce that kind of trajectory. The vertical element of velocity would be initially 336 fps. At the top of the flight, the bullet would be 1741 feet above the starting point. Again, this assumes the firing line and target are at the same elevation and 2 miles apart. The calculation is also assuming a vacuum with no wind resistance. A real trajectory in air would likely come with a higher initial muzzle velocity and a slightly higher muzzle elevation to compensate for wind drag.

[Shooter 2.5]

Bump

[harpseal]

The .22cal rimfire round was produced in the 1850's. See the Volcanic pistol for examples of it being used then.

[JRandomFreeper]

I know about the Volcanic. I was speaking about what was in the British inventory during the Boer war. The Martini had a reputation with the British soldier as being a "cross-eyed old #itch."

I need to do some more research on the Martini.

/john

[harpseal]

John

What I was reffering to was the comment that Kipling was probaly unfamiliar with the .22cal rimfire. I feel certain that Kipling was familiar with most common firearms of the world as is evidenced by his many stories of India's wars.

Certainly the only use by the British army of a .22 cal rimfire in those days would have been as an aid for marksmanship training or as a first gun for their youngsters accompanying a colonial officer to his posting

[45Auto]

Here's a place to start: Ohio Gun Collectors Association

[45Auto]

This thing chambered in the .45-70 and loaded to spec is a real handfull!

The T/C Contender in the 12" or 14" Hunter model with muzzle brake

[45Auto]

Here's something interesting: The Gibbs Rifle Co. converted .45-70 Enfield Carbine

[45Auto]

This is what I shoot .45-70 in:

Ruger No.1 medium sporter, 22" barrel, 7.5 pounds, .45-70.

[Squantos]

This is a great thread. I have to wonder if the term I missed by a "hair" was not originally a ......."Hare".........

Outstanding read. Please add me to yer ping list if ya have one for such gem's as this 45Auto.....Stay Safe !!

[Inyo-Mono]

This is what I shoot .45-70 in: Ruger No.1 medium sporter, 22" barrel, 7.5 pounds, .45-70.

Verrrrrry nice! I shoot a cheap Cabela's rolling block. Like to get a Marlin Guide gun in 45-70.

[Myrddin]

Like to get a Marlin Guide gun in 45-70.

I have the 1895G to match the BFR in .45-70. One note: the version I purchased was one of the last out of the factory with the muzzle break installed. Marlin is going to discontinue that in future production runs. You might still find a few on the shelf that have this feature.