Health groups critical of new smoking age

Daily Breeze ^ | Tuesday, June 25, 2002 | James P. Sweeney

[Just another Joe]

Health groups critical of new smoking age

By James P. Sweeney
COPLEY NEWS SERVICE

SACRAMENTO - When a West Hollywood legislator and a powerful doctor's lobby launched a drive earlier this month to raise the state's legal smoking age to 21, some prominent allies in the war on tobacco were conspicuously absent.

The proposal, which could make California the first state to outlaw cigarette sales to 18-, 19- and 20-year-olds, immediately drew national attention, including a poll that showed broad support for the idea.

Amid the applause, however, representatives of the state's heart, lung and cancer associations were sitting on their hands, or openly critical.

"It's silly," said Stan Glantz, a professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco and a leading anti-tobacco voice. "There is no good evidence that laws restricting sales of cigarettes to kids actually affect smoking by kids."

While it "sounds like a good idea," Glantz said, "it's just a waste of time."

Even worse, some public health advocates fear the measure may divert attention from a critical fight to preserve funding for a broad range of tobacco-control programs that have a proven track record in California.

With a state budget deficit approaching $24 billion, Gov. Gray Davis has asked for deep cuts in funding for the anti-tobacco campaign, a model that has pushed smoking rates to near national lows.

Long-term funding at issue

Long-term base funding for the tobacco-control program is at stake this year. One administration proposal would dedicate most of the state's $500 million a year from the national tobacco settlement to help balance the budget. That move alone could soak up some 80 percent of those funds for the next 22 years.

"In another year," said Lisa Rea of the American Heart Association, "maybe we would have gotten excited about" raising the legal smoking age to 21. "But it's not something that we can say is high on our priority list. It just isn't. The budget is everything this year."

Likewise, a spokeswoman said the American Cancer Society is taking no position on the legislation by Assemblyman Paul Koretz. The American Lung Association was initially ambivalent, but has since expressed support for the bill.

Only three other states have smoking ages higher than 18. In Alabama, Alaska and Utah the legal age is 19. Koretz's measure would be phased in so that it would not affect those 18 and older who now smoke.

The first-term Democrat is carrying the legislation for the California Medical Association, an organization of 35,000 physicians that has long been one of the state's most formidable political forces.

"Everybody accepts the idea that the drinking age should be 21 to reduce the number of traffic fatalities and other kinds of incidents," said Dr. Jack Lewin, the CMA's chief executive officer.

"The window of danger with alcohol is four to six hours after a teen-ager has been drinking. As physicians we know that the window of danger with tobacco is four to six decades."

Dr. Leonard Klay, a Santa Rosa obstetrician and gynecologist, persuaded the CMA's house of delegates to endorse the concept in February.

In the intervening months, the CMA and the public health groups discussed the timing of the legislation as the state's fiscal situation continued to deteriorate. The CMA declined to wait.

"It's very disheartening that we're not all together on this," said Ron Lopp, a CMA spokesman.

While many teen-agers are introduced to tobacco products long before they turn 18, Koretz and the CMA said most do not become addicted until they have easy access and can legally purchase cigarettes.

"It's easier to prevent smoking than it is to get people to quit," Dr. Klay said.

California's anti-tobacco campaign has pushed the adult smoking rate down to 17.4 percent, second only to Utah. But state data show that young adults have proven to be the toughest group to reach.

Smoking increases in group

Eighteen- to 24-year-olds are the only age group that has not shown a marked decline since 1989, when California initiated its aggressive anti-tobacco efforts. During that span, the number of 18- to 24-year-olds who smoke actually increased from 18.9 percent to 23.6 percent.

"By raising it to 21," Koretz said, "we dramatically reduce the number of people who are getting cigarettes at 16 and 17 by going into stores and looking close enough."

But Glantz, the UCSF professor, said age restrictions on tobacco sales are widely ignored and poorly enforced.

"We know that the way to reduce youth smoking is not by supply side controls, it's by demand reduction," Glantz said. "The state's anti-smoking program has achieved the lowest youth smoking rates in the country if not the world . . . and that's exactly what the governor is dismantling."

[Just another Joe]

Putting the smoking (or drinking) age to 30 should certainly cut down on the number of young people who smoke/drink.

Ahhh, you MUST have missed this part.

"It's silly," said Stan Glantz, a professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco and a leading anti-tobacco voice. "There is no good evidence that laws restricting sales of cigarettes to kids actually affect smoking by kids."

[walden]

True.

I am tremendously opposed to infantilizing older teens-- it just creates resentment at the idiocy of adult society. And, when we push them out of adult culture, they just go create their own culture. I have two high school aged daughters, and it is MUCH easier for them to buy Ecstasy & other club drugs, marijuana and lsd, than it is to get cigarettes and beer. So far, thank God, my daughters have stayed away from that, but I make my views strongly known to them.

In fact, when we sit down together and have a beer and a smoke, I tell them exactly how I feel.

[Just another Joe]

Why not 16 or 17?

I don't know?
I was buying cigarettes for my Dad when I was 12 or 13.

[Just another Joe]

In fact, when we sit down together and have a beer and a smoke, I tell them exactly how I feel.

BWahahaha. So, you BRIBE them, huh?

[walden]

Bribery WORKS. :)

[Just another Joe]

Bribery WORKS. :)

I'll remember that.
I've got two teenagers myself.

[Drew68]

Is 18 years considered adult or not?

To fight in combat? Yes.

To drink a beer? No.

To have sex in a XXX-rated movie? Yes.

To smoke a cigarette? Not of the "let's extend adolescence" nannies have their way.

...Funny, out of the four things I listed, which would you rather your son/daughter engaged in at age 18?

[mamelukesabre]

Sounds like you and I have similar ideas.

I have posted before that I thought the rise in rave partys and the drugs that go with them are a direct result of teens not being able to party like they used to when I was a teen. They take beer away from them, and this is what happens. When I was a youngster, you could stand in front of a grocery store and ask people at random to buy beer for you. I never had to ask more than 3 people before finding someone that would do it. It was a tradition of sorts. They did it for you simply because someone did it for them when they were young. But nowdays, I never see any young people asking me to do it for them. I think the tradition has been broken somewhere along the way, and rave parties have filled the void.

[Askel5]

"In another year," said Lisa Rea of the American Heart Association, "maybe we would have gotten excited about" raising the legal smoking age to 21. "But it's not something that we can say is high on our priority list. It just isn't. The budget is everything this year."

Whoa ... heartless.

[biblewonk]

To fight in combat? Yes. To drink a beer? No. To have sex in a XXX-rated movie? Yes. To smoke a cigarette? Not of the "let's extend adolescence" nannies have their way. ...Funny, out of the four things I listed, which would you rather your son/daughter engaged in at age 18?

After I posted I made a mental list of my own a little like this. Be president:no
Be a senator: no
Be a college professor: ?
Rent a car: no buy a beer:No unless you are in the army
Fight in a war:yes
vote: yes
get married: yes
be in a porn movie: yes
drink a beer: no
have a college degree: yes What a strange age 18 is.

I have 8 kids, 3 girls and 5 boys and your final question is very easy as a German WASP, even as a bible thumping fundy. Have an Icehouse on me. :-D

[mamelukesabre]

You left out:

purchase a handgun-NO

co-sign a loan-NO

Operate hazardous machinery-NO



Don't you have to be 21 to purchase porn, or nudie mags? tHat seems to make no sense considering the models and actors/actresses only need to be 18 to be in the porn.

[SheLion]

It's awfully hard to get an 18 year-old to sign up and go fight for our Country, yet isn't old enough to smoke.

18 is the legal age for marriage, military, 3.5 beer, and they already have a driver's license by the time they are 16. Plus, at 18, they can go to a quick school for 18-wheelers and if they pass that test, they can be driving an 18-wheeler across the country. But not old enough to smoke? I don't think so. This is asinine.

[.30Carbine]

Every pound of domestically-grown tobacco generates nearly $100 in state/federal taxes.
New additional State tax on cartons of cigarettes in VT takes effect July 1st. Up $4.00 per carton, from $36 to $40. Don't buy your cigarettes here.

Anybody want to forward this to the WOD people?
[discostu and] Joe, you already pinged the best FReeper against the Wo[S]D...my Tiger! Hope he pounces on this one!

[discostu]

Nope 18 to get porno, though to avoid legal hassles some businesses impose their own rules. Which can lead to some wierd stuff. Here in Tucson nudie clubs aren't allowed to serve booze, but titty bars (latex and thongs as opposed to nothing but shoes... maybe) can and all do. Meanwhile AZ serve laws say you have to be 19 to work someplace that serves booze. Subsequently 18 year olds can become all nude strippers but can't do the "half measure" for another year, and "fans" have to wait 3 years to step down a level of smut.

[humblegunner]

"As physicians we know that the window of danger with tobacco is four to six decades."

If even that.. but, hey, it's for the chilll-dern.

[walden]

My great-grandmother was married at 16 and helping her 18 year-old husband run a large ranch, with numerous hired hands and several hired house & garden helpers. But today, lots of affluent, well-educated people have their (chronologically) adult children coming home to live with them, expressing no apparent desire to start their own true adult lives. Why? Stupid laws like this-- treat them like babies, and they'll act like babies. Some older teens hit 20 never having held a job, or had any responsibility to speak of.

My older daughter started working a summer job at age 16, my younger at 15. Most of the money is theirs, but I do require that they pay me for their car insurance (everyone should experience young the concept of monthly bills.) From that money, they pay for their own entertainment and clothes, and I encourage, but do not require them to save some of it. They get decent grades in school and participate in school activities, and they have a fair amount of freedom with the family car. My younger daughter smokes, my older doesn't. They are welcome to have a beer or glass of wine in the evening, but they don't get into a car afterwards. They know that they will not get in trouble for drinking, but only for DRIVING afterwards, or getting into a car where the driver has been drinking. I push home the point by refusing, myself, to drive after I have had more than 1 drink.

I don't think I'm doing a perfect job here, but I want them to join adult society, and I think the best way is a graduated introduction to the responsibilities and pleasures that being an adult entails. I just wish the laws weren't against me in this regard. In my opinion, the most successful kids are going to be the ones who go off to college and do not experience a huge disconnect between their old life and their new life. My girls know they can count on me for tuition, books, room & board, and they'll be very accustomed to handling their other expenses, a job, and the kind of freedom they'll have away from home.

It's the best thing I can think of. I just hope it works.

[TigersEye]

Anybody want to forward this to the WOD people?

That's an idea but would they probably wouldn't know it if a tiger bit them on the a$$?

[Madame Dufarge]

As physicians we know that the window of danger with tobacco is four to six decades."

Will you, please?

Life has a window of danger from birth to whenever.

But hey - no health neurotics, no ceaseless trips to the physician.

[TigersEye]

Every pound of domestically-grown tobacco generates nearly $100 in state/federal taxes. The hypocrites aren't about to close a valve on their cash pipeline.

The profits in black market cigarettes will soon exceed the profits in other black market drugs with the added benefit (to the dealers) that the drug itself isn't illegal. The government will then of course deem it necessary to allocate more tax dollars to fighting the rampant and violent black market trade in tobacco.

I also wish these leeches a long and fiery retirement.

[mamelukesabre]

How bout black market spirits? Anyone know where I can pick up a used still?