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To: Titanites
You do know that all the tasteless charges noted above were accusations made by an enemy of his, King Philip IV of France, who was putting illegal levies on the Churches clergy, don't you? He made these charges while Boniface VIII was still alive to dethrone him, and after he was dead to ruin his reputation. However, if you read any reputable historical accounts (at least the ones I could find) you'll discover they are false.

Let's use a few quotes from another source:

Pope Boniface VIII

. . .

On the 13th of December, 1294, the saintly but wholly incompetent hermit-pope Celestine V, who five months previously, as Pietro di Murrhone, had been taken from his obscure mountain cave in the wilds of the Abruzzi and raised to the highest dignity in Christendom, resigned the intolerable burden of the papacy. The act was unprecedented and has been frequently ascribed to the undue influence and pressure of the designing Cardinal Gaetani. . .

The unusual step taken by Celestine V had aroused much opposition, especially among the religious parties in Italy. In the hands of the Spirituals, or Fraticelli, and the Celestines--many of whom were not as guileless as their saintly founder--the former pontiff, if allowed to go free, might prove to be a dangerous instrument for the promotion of a schism in the Church. Boniface VIII, therefore, before leaving Naples, ordered Celestine V to be taken to Rome in the custody of the Abbot of Monte Cassino . On the way thither the saint escaped and returned to his hermitage near Sulmona. Apprehended again, he fled a second time, and after weary weeks of roaming through the woods of Apulia reached the sea and embarked on board a vessel about to sail for Dalmatia. But a storm cast the luckless fugitive ashore at Vieste in the Capitanata, where the authorities recognized and detained him. He was brought before Boniface in his palace at Anagni, kept in custody there for some time, and finally transferred to the strong Castle of Fumone at Ferentino. Here he remained until his death ten months later, 19 May, 1296. The detention of Celestine was a simple measure of prudence for which Boniface VIII deserves no censure; but the rigorous treatment to which the old man of over eighty years was subjected--whoever may have been . . .

Few popes have aroused more diverse and contradictory appreciations. Protestant historians, generally, and even modern Catholic writers, wrote Cardinal Wiseman in 1844, class him among the wicked popes, as an ambitious, haughty, and unrelenting man, deceitful also and treacherous, his whole pontificate one record of evil. To dissipate this grossly exaggerated and even calumnious view, it is well to distinguish his utterances and deeds as pope from his personal character, that even in his lifetime seemed to many unsympathetic. . . .

(Rather lengthy article) Link below:

Source: CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA - POPE BONIFACE VIII

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Have you read the short and glorious reign of his predecessor Pope Clement V?

Another in the glorious history of the Popes.
4,079 posted on 10/30/2001 5:15:27 AM PST by OLD REGGIE
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To: OLD REGGIE
Have you read the short and glorious reign of his predecessor Pope Clement V?

Another in the glorious history of the Popes.

Clement V was his successor to the papacy, not predecessor. I do not want to debate the merits and failings of every Pope. The Popes were and are sinners like the rest of us.

However, if you go back to my post #4056, you'll see that I think some claims have been made against Boniface VIII which may be false. Namely that he practiced sorcery, called Christ a hypocrite, professed atheism, denied life after death, was a murderer and sex pervert, was officially recorded as saying: "To enjoy oneself and lie carnally with woman or with boys is no more a sin than rubbing one's hands together."

There have been bad popes, but that doesn't give anyone the right to make false claims against them (especially from Christians on this thread). All I am looking for is the truth in the matter. If you have a reputable source for the above claims against Boniface VIII, I'd like to see it because everything I can find does not support those claims. Maybe he did these things, I don't know, but anytime someone takes the liberty to soil anothers character, they better be able to back it up.

4,123 posted on 10/30/2001 6:28:15 AM PST by Titanites
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