Pope Again Reaches Out to Orthodox Church

Herald Tribune ^ | June 30, 2003

[NYer]

VATICAN CITY Pope John Paul II again reached out to the Orthodox Church on Sunday, saying his efforts at reconciliation weren't just "ecclesiastic courtesy" but a sign of his profound desire to unite the Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches.

John Paul made the comments during his regular appearance to pilgrims and tourists in St. Peter's Square. Later Sunday, he welcomed a delegation from the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople at a traditional Mass marking the feast day of St. Peter and St. Paul.

"The exchange of delegations between Rome and Constantinople, for the respective patron feasts, goes beyond just an act of ecclesiastic courtesy," the pontiff said. "It reflects the profound and rooted intention to re-establish the full communion between East and West."

John Paul has made improving relations with the Orthodox Church a hallmark of his nearly 25-year papacy, visiting several mostly Orthodox countries and expressing regret for the wrongs committed by the Catholic Church against Orthodox Christians.

Despite his efforts at healing the 1,000-year-old schism, he hasn't yet visited Russia because of objections from the Russian Orthodox Church.

During the Mass on Sunday, 42 new archbishops received the pallium, a band of white wool decorated with black crosses that symbolizes their bond with the Vatican. Two of the archbishops received the pallium in their home parishes; the rest took part in the Mass in St. Peter's Basilica.

[TexConfederate1861]

The Orthodox do not read from Revelations in church, nor do we attempt to interpret it....St. John had the keys to that, and he is long gone.

[drstevej]

thanks...

[Hermann the Cherusker]

1) I don't take documents filed by Communist liars like Tito & Co. seriously. That isn't credible historical evidence. Its simply a tissue of lies spewed forth from the worshipers of the Devil. It would be far more credible if you could begin by discussing pre-war Yugoslav population figures, post-war explusions, war mortality, and post-war population figures. Have you ever bothered to do anything but consult the Serbian and Communist side on this matter?

2) The fact that some sinful priests did evil things with the Ustashe (and under what sort of duress?) does not implicate Rome. Many hundreds of Priests in Poland (again, under what duress?) participated in the documented pogrom against the Germans before and during the Nazi invasion (which is in part how so many Polish Priests ended up in Dachau). Does that mean the Catholic Church was both pro-German and anti-German at the same time? I'm so confused! The Nazi Army and SS was full of Calvinists and Lutherans. Does that implicate those faiths in complicity with Hitler? The Russian Army was full of Orthodox. Does that implicate Orthodoxy in Stalin's crimes against Poland, the Baltic States, and Rumania? Why is it otherwise intelligent people such as yourself only put forth such tissues of lies against Catholicism?

3) You should withdraw your slurs against Bl. Archbishop Stepanic if you can't actually document anything he did.

4) Far more Catholic Croatians were involved in the armed resistance against Pavelic and Hitler than were Orthodox Serbs. What are we to make of that truth of history documented in "Serbia's Secret War" among other places?

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Having been a victim of crime numerous times, I have absolutely no problem with the death penalty.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

One other thought - with the Church there is always the hope for reform of the sinner and mercy; so we pray that prisoners might be released. But the State has the duty to protect us form the misfits of society.

[George W. Bush]

2) The fact that some sinful priests did evil things with the Ustashe (and under what sort of duress?) does not implicate Rome. Many hundreds of Priests in Poland (again, under what duress?) participated in the documented pogrom against the Germans before and during the Nazi invasion (which is in part how so many Polish Priests ended up in Dachau). Does that mean the Catholic Church was both pro-German and anti-German at the same time? I'm so confused!

Yes, you are confused. By Rome. But you're content to let them keep the wool pulled down over your eyes. This gross ignorance is unworthy of correction.

The Nazi Army and SS was full of Calvinists and Lutherans. Does that implicate those faiths in complicity with Hitler?

The German army was over half Roman Catholic at all times during this period. The real appeal to the general German population by the Nazis was by far the strongest in southern German, the Roman section of Germany that is. This are well-known historical facts except to Rome's ignorant flock who are officially forbidden to accept any historical account not approved by Rome. Calvinists were notably absent from the list of those who accommodated or were complicit with the Nazi regime.

[George W. Bush]

Having been a victim of crime numerous times, I have absolutely no problem with the death penalty.

Yeah... murder, rape, theft, disobedience to the pope. Just burn 'em all.

Only Rome burns people for exercising their religious conscience.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

You're welcome. Hopefully, sometime, you'll come to recognize that the Roman Pontiffs 1) did not institute an anti-semitism that existed before the Church was founded and 2) were the greatest protectors of the Jews in Europe throughout the period from AD 500 to today.

Because of this, it is extremely difficult to believe the constant attacks and lies regarding the Church persecuting the Jews, especially the outright fabrications of the World War II era and the monstrous attacks on Pope Pius XII.

Forgive me if my views offend you, but I think that this is the truth.

[ET(end tyranny)]

The Ustashe are rising again. They hold fascist rallies, they celebrate the Ustashe genocide of WW II, they tear down the monuments to the Serbian freedom-fighters. I think the stage is set for a repeat of the massacres during WW II. Rome is playing her same treacherous role.

Unfortunately. I think you are right. Didn't Rome cry peace before the St. Batholomew's Day massacre?

[ET(end tyranny)]

I had the same feelings about the surgery and deaths of those Siamese twins recently. I think what God ordains is perhaps more important than what man thinks should be done.

Yeah. I was hoping that the surgery would go well. I prayed for them, and their surgeons at that time. But, it seems that it wasn't meant to be. I sometimes wonder if events like these are to see 'who we are'. Can we cross racial or national barriers? Can we emphathize with those we don't know? Can we pray with heart felt sincerity for those we do not know? Can we have compassion and love for human beings that we have not ever met? Do we have loving souls within bodies or are we the upper echelon of the animal world?

[ET(end tyranny)]

One other thought - with the Church there is always the hope for reform of the sinner and mercy; so we pray that prisoners might be released. But the State has the duty to protect us form the misfits of society.

What if the State IS the misfit?

[George W. Bush]

Unfortunately. I think you are right. Didn't Rome cry peace before the St. Batholomew's Day massacre?

Wise Protestants have avoided invitations to Roman weddings ever since.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Who are you to judge it?

[malakhi]

2) were the greatest protectors of the Jews in Europe throughout the period from AD 500 to today.

That is laughable. I am familiar with the canons of the Fourth Lateran Council, as well as the other official anti-Jewish proclamations of the church.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Only Rome burns people for exercising their religious conscience.

Michael Servetus, Thomas More, John Fisher, Johan van Olden Barneveldt, and many others, plus Protestantism's With Obsession.

Plus 400 years of persecution, starvation, murder, and rape in Ireland.

Come back and be sanctimonious to me about Protestant Purity another day. Hypocrite.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Whereas the Jews are made to the image of God, and a remnant of them will one day be saved, and whereas they have sought our protection: following in the footsteps of our predecessors We command that they be not molested in their synagogues; that their laws, rights and customs be not assailed; that they be not baptized by force, constrained to observe Christian festivals, nor to wear new badges, and that they be not hindered in their business relations with Christians. (Pope Martin V, Declaration on the Protection of the Jews, 1419)

Just one short example that could be greatly multiplied.

[ET(end tyranny)]

Wise Protestants have avoided invitations to Roman weddings ever since.

I hope they stay wise.

The papacy has been 'reaching' out to a lot of others. Kissing the Koran? I'm not real sure why he did this. Was he trying to appease the muslims? Does he really think that the God of Judaism and Christianity is the same of Islam? Why would the God of Judaism call for the killing of Jews by Islam? Just doesn't make sense to me.

I'm not sure of all the reasons for the reformation, but what if the pope (present or future) were to gradually ease some of the differences out of the way, to entice protestants back into the fold, under a guise of unity. The ol' we all pray to the same God routine.

Think any of the protestant churches could be enticed?

[MarMema]

Having been a victim of crime numerous times, I have absolutely no problem with the death penalty...

Gee Hermann, I am just stunned! LOL.

[Aliska]

My response in two parts. The first concerns a possible flashpoint in the Balkans to be reignited by some future, unforeseeable event. I am referring the the apparitions at Medjugorje which have resulted in a whole industry. The enthusiasm, crossing into fanaticism at times, is nothing short of amazing, particularly in light of the fact that the church has never officially approved them. Neither has the church loudly condemned them for reasons known only to the church. Apparitions, even false apparitions, are good for the church.

One of the most negative spinoffs from these apparitions is all the money which has been funnelled into Medjugorje, some which may have been diverted to purchase weapons for the Croatian National movement. At one point, the legitimate bishop was kidnapped and held for several hours until he was released relatively unharmed. Who in America can imagine kidnapping a bishop? The bishop had condemned the apparitions and was having difficulty in getting obedience from the Franciscans in the area.

In conjunction with Medjugorje, at one point there was a symbol of the Croatian movement placed on the altar at St. James church, and there are souvenir shops that sell that sort of memorabilia. It was probably ordered removed, and I don't know if it is still there. Most of what I learned is contained in books and articles written by E. Michael Jones. There does indeed appear to be a resurgence of the spirit which animated the terrible perscutions during WWII, as noted by MarMema.

An article of possible interest, The Ghosts of Surmanci.

In my heart of hearts, I believe the local bishops who have condemned Medjugorje and am totally dismayed that people can so energetically and enthusiastically embrace a lie or hoax. Given what has transpired, it is not too far outside the realm of possibility that such energy could be diverted in a destructive manner against those who attempt to uphold the truth, or perceived enemies in other quarters, although for now they are held in check by various political and church powers.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Something about being on the wrong end of a 9mm hole in nice neighborhoods a few times will do that to you. LOL!