Posted on 04/10/2021 7:32:49 AM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal
Nephilim.
DNA programming.
Yes. And your supposed to have a sense of humor, too.
Lighten up, Francis.
Good job, thanks!
“The rapture occurs before the tribulation (1 Thessalonians 5:9; Revelation 3:10).”
Since 1 Thes. 5 is about The Day of The LORD, and His Coming, and of our being gathered to Him, how do you feel you have license to violate that context and teach that the “wrath” referenced in v.9 is the whole of The Great Tribulation period?
Are there Seals of Wrath and Trumpets of Wrath, also? Or is it for no reason that John writes only about the Bowls of Wrath?
Assuredly The Church is spared from wrath; before the Bowls of Wrath are poured out in Rev. 16 — with seven Seals, and seven Trumpets in the rear-view mirror — Christ reaps His harvest of righteousness from the Earth in Rev. 14:14-16.
And, lest you object that living through The Great Tribulation on the Earth would imperil many, answer why 1 Thes. 4 notes TWICE Christians who are “alive and remain”; that is, “we who have survived”?
Or why, in Rev. 7:9-14 is John witness to a great throng “from every nation, tribe, people and tongue” who have “come out of” The Great Tribulation? Hello, martyrdom. Hello, war, famine, pestilence...Seals and Trumpets — all that havoc isn’t gonna claim only unbelievers.
They can’t be new converts killed in the tribulation if there’s already been the one-and-only resurrection of the dead in Christ right before a pre-Trib rapture of the living saints. You can only play the Resurrection of the Righteous card ONCE, so what sort of gandy dancing are you gonna do to get this fresh crop of righteous dead to Heaven without another Resurrection, and what scriptural references support it explicitly?
As for Rev. 3:10...that’s written to the church at Philadelphia. Does the doomsday timeline do a quick “bootleg” 180 from the decadent Laodicean church era and burn rubber back to Philadelphia just long enough to rescue this claim with a deft Bible Heimlich? Our angelic chauffeur wouldn’t happen to be called “Rockford”...?
Yes, I’m trying to keep it on the lighter side, ‘cuz I know we don’t see it the same way. And I’ll keep up my end of this deal: if it plays out your way, steak dinner is on me; ask you can eat. I’ll expect reciprocity. ;-)
We disagree.
I imagine you’ll be pleasantly surprised when The Lord descends with the shout of the Archangel.
All 1.2 billion Christians at the same time over the skies of Israel?
Have you failed to notice the two groups of Christians gathered? The Lord descends from Heaven, the Throne Room Third Heaven with a shout. Then the voice of the Archangel resounds, then the Trumpet of God. Paul used the term The Apostasia in his second letter to the Believers. That word is a noun of description. It is formed from two Greek words, a preposition word 'apos' and the verb 'histemi'. The preposition means 'away from' and the verb is 'to stand'.
Referring back to the passage in the first letter, where Paul revealed the order of the away from standing, the question he was responding to was what about those among the Believers who died? Did they miss the Rapture removal? Aside from the fact that Paul taught such a deep scene to just converted from paganism folks, there is a sequence suggested. The dead in Christ are first to get the glorified bodies as they return with Christ. These newly created glorified bodies will be as invisible to the world as the being who wrote upon the wall in Babylon. Oly the hand of that being was in our visible range, the rest of the body was in a higher coordinate system, in hyperspace if you will.
After His resurrection, Jesus was visible to only those whom God gave the ability to see Him. The unbelievers were not seeing Him, mush the way Saul's conversion is related; Saul saw the Risen Lord but the men with him expereinced only an incomprehensible sound and bright light.
Thus the spirits of those who have died in Christ will get hyper-dimensional bodies for their alive forever more spirits to inhabit, which according to 1John 3:2 will be like the Glorified Body Jesus now inhabits in hyper dimensional coordinate system, for we will see Him as He is in hyper-dimensional spacetime.
When Paul writes 'then we who are alive and remain' he is referring the Believers to the away from standing transformation into hyper0space. The dead in Christ rise first into hyperspace, then we who are alive at His coming in the air shall be transformed (1Cor 15:51-58) from 4dimensional beings into the hyperspce beings to join the dead in Christ resurrected in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air, the first Heaven according to the scriptures.
The Sequence is first the dead in Christ are united with newly created (at the shout of the Lord descending from third Heaven to first Heaven) bodies inhabiting hyperspace / hyper-dimensional reality, THEN we who are alive and remain in this 4D realm are transformed into hyper-dimensional beings, then the trumpet of God for the 'head 'em up and move 'em out' sounds (the 'last trump when moving God's People int he wilderness) and all of the new entrants to the hyper-dimensional reality are caught up to the Lord and return with Him to The Father's House.
You wrote: “Christ reaps His harvest of righteousness from the Earth in Rev. 14:14-16.” That is a harvest of those still alive with all the wrath events. Notice where the angels come from to the harvesting? The Temple, the Jewish temple. The entire seven years of the Tribulation, time of Jacob’s troubles are about bring forth faith in The Christ as Messiah in Israel. The whole earth of unbelievers are effected by the events JESUS in Heaven is causing, is responsible for unleashing as He opens the seven sealed scroll. You need not see the word ‘wrath’ to know it is the wrath of God in incresing severity. Isaiah, Zachariah, Ezekiel, reveal so much if you just do a words stuty of wrath, war, andf famine.
You’re saying this rapture could happen at any time now?
Yes. We do. And I will be ready no matter when. And I think an understanding of both perspectives is important, perhaps even a critical matter of life or death.
So, agree or not, I’d still appreciate knowing how it is you come to call the entire tribulation “wrath” when there are neither Seals of Wrath, not Trumpets of Wrath, but ONLY Bowls of Wrath.
The stark clarity of that unique designation isn’t to be dismissed; it’s been made intentionally, because the Bowls are not merely the culmination of a crescendo of wrath, but something notably different in character and purpose from the Seals and Trumpets.
The Rapture doctrine is basically a fundamentalist belief; none of the mainline denominations believe in it so I guess those Christians wouldn't be taken up.
If you are a Jew, you are HIS chosen People. Those who believe in Jesus as messiah come and coming back soon, you are a member in particular of His Body during this period. That's why I add that I look forward to seeing you in the clouds as we are snatched up in hyperspace to meet The Lord in the First Heaven.
Peter's sermon on The Day of Pentecost was preached to Jews, and the first three thousand members of the Body of Christ were Jews, Jews from all over the place. Christins and Jews are given eternal life by the same means, Belief in Whm God has sent for our redemption.
See you in the clouds, pretty Lady.
How or what would you say to early Christian martyrs when they ask you how you were martyred? It’d be like “Oh, I was in the Walmart parking lot with a bunch of groceries on a really hot day and I had a flat tire on my SUV ....”
Looking back upon History, applying the prophecies from the Old Testament and what the Disciples cum Apostles taught, we can see that there were conditions described for the last days before He rescues His Jewish acknowledging His Messiah-ship in this dimensional realm. The prophesies were for the Jewish people who come to Believe He is Their Messiah. The prophecies were not given for The Body of Christ Church.
There are no events or prophecies to be fulfilled in order to have the arrival of The Departure. I don't know how Israel returned to their Promised Land could have been fulfilled in 200AD, or how the entire world would be able in 200 AD to witness the killing and then three days later brought back to life and raptured away of the two witnesses preaching the imminent arrival of the King to establish His Kingdom, but we have all the conditions (signs of the season, if you will) now a reality, and evil is sauntering across the planet.
The doctrine of imminence for the Church could have had The Body of Christ removed in 200AD and a gap of thousands of yers before the Lord's return to touch foot on the Earth to rescue the Believers in Jesus as Lord and Christ for their individual redemption. It is not a hindrance to the doctrine of imminence for the Ecclesia Birthed on the Day of Pentecost when Peter preached.
Scripture indicates that the Ekklesia will be removed before the wrath arrives, before even the time of the wrath arrives. That could be a few hundred years from the cross or thousands of years. To us now, we realize it is thousands of years, and perhaps now any moment for the departure. Israel is now back in their land and the temple where antichrist commits the abomination of desolation is now a real possibility.
The Restrainer will be taken out of the way of the antrichrist before all those prophecies of the Tribulation years begin, because The Redeemed are in Heaven wearing rewards crowns when The Lamb opens the first seal.
A word searhc in Isaiah, Zachariah, and Ezekiel, to name three, will reaveals how God sent His wrath on Israel. And sometimes the word 'wrath' is used and sometimes not, but war and famine and pestilence are the hallmarks of God's wrath upon the Hebrews.
Non sequitur. Sorry, I didn’t get the anology reference.
I for one don't want to go with this Rapture thing.
WOW, You really know your BIBLE verses.
When you believed in Jesus you were Justified by God for He alone is to whom we must be justified. And when He returns to gather you, you have not a word or deed to say about it. It is only in the middle tense of your salvation that He requires your cooperation so you grow in grace and knowledge.
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