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To: Just mythoughts

Very true!

Not one Preterist has ever been able to answer the question: How did Nero make Mayans, Chinese, and Eskimos take the mark in 60 AD or so?

Rev 13:11-17:

11 Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon. 12 It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed. 13 And it performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people. 14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed. 16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.

ALL....means ALL... They have to lie to try to prove their point.


10 posted on 09/27/2020 1:20:12 PM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Like Enoch, Noah, & Lot, the True Church will soon be removed & then destruction comes forth.)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal

Calling Nero the ‘big’ bad guy makes their doctrines ‘null and void’ and nothing more than traditions of some big daddy playing ‘king and priest’. NOW, Christ said the whole world, except for the ‘very’ elect would be deceived... Best find out what that deception is.. the time is short.


12 posted on 09/27/2020 1:30:25 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Psalm 2. Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal

See Rome has already built ‘the’ ‘temple’.. big bad boy Nero ... snicker .. look what takes place today.

https://newagora.ca/inside-popes-reptilian-audience-hall-vatican-city/

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=vatican+serpent+temple&docid=608013897356282489&mid=0B44E4B7CB2BF3245B440B44E4B7CB2BF3245B44&view=detail&FORM=VIRE


14 posted on 09/27/2020 1:50:02 PM PDT by Just mythoughts (Psalm 2. Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal

Paul believed and wrote that the Gospel had been spread to the whole world, and the word he and Jesus used was not kosmos signifying the globe but the Greek word denoting the graeco Roman world


38 posted on 09/27/2020 2:52:00 PM PDT by Cronos (19 years on FR)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal; Just mythoughts; metmom
Have you read the book of revelations?
After these things, I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that they should not blow upon the earth, nor upon the sea, nor on any tree.

2 And I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, having the sign of the living God; and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,

3 Saying: Hurt not the earth, nor the sea, nor the trees, till we sign the servants of our God in their foreheads.
You see -- before Revelations 13 you have GOD putting a mark on people who would be saved foreheads

If you are wondering how you get "the sign of God on the forehead" then look at your baptism in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit.

The "sealing of the saints" is taken from Ezekiel 9 4 And the Lord said to him: Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem: and mark Thau upon the foreheads of the men that sigh, and mourn for all the abominations that are committed in the midst thereof.

The word for "mark" in hebrew is simply the Hebrew letter "Thau" which looks like a CROSS.

The early Church saw this THAU as a sign of the cross made on the forehead of the believers.

The Greek word for seal was understood as a baptismal image. The seal, then, is the water: they descend into the water dead, and they arise alive

The image in Revelation 7 depicts God's protection of His people from evil. These people are SEALED BY HIS POWER THROUGH BAPTISM.

NOW look at

God's sign Satan's perversion
Revelations 5:6 11 Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon.
Rev 7:3 Saying: Hurt not the earth, nor the sea, nor the trees, till we sign the servants of our God in their foreheads

NOTE about the signs on the forehead and the lambs - Satan trys to pervert baptism with the sign and the lamb with his "like a lamb". The second beast is a parody of the Lamb. Though it looks "like a lamb" it is another agent of satan - it's two horns are an allusion to the ram-beast seen in daniel 8

You refer to the mark of the beast - the coin of

remember The verses in the book of the Apocalypse says

Apoc 13:11 Then I saw another beast come up out of the earth; it had two horns like a lamb’s but spoke like a dragon.

12 It wielded all the authority of the first beast in its sight and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound had been healed.

13 It performed great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of everyone.

14 It deceived the inhabitants of the earth with the signs it was allowed to perform in the sight of the first beast, telling them to make an image for the beast who had been wounded by the sword and revived.

15 It was then permitted to breathe life into the beast’s image, so that the beast’s image could speak and [could] have anyone who did not worship it put to death.

16 It forced all the people, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to be given a stamped image on their right hands or their foreheads,

17 so that no one could buy or sell except one who had the stamped image of the beast’s name or the number that stood for its name.

18 [b]Wisdom is needed here; one who understands can calculate the number of the beast, for it is a number that stands for a person. His number is six hundred and sixty-six.
This beast with two horns "like a lamb" but which "spoken like a dragon" is Satan's parody of the lamb.

A key note is the difference between where the beasts arise -- the first beast arises out of the sea - the sea indicates gentile nations.

This parody of the Lamb represents corrupt leaders within Jerusalem. This parody is later identified by John as the "false prophet" in Rev 16:13; 19:20; 20:10)

As the "false prophet" this parody sets itself up against God's prophets in the days leading to 69 AD.

The false religious leaders who led the persecution of the Christ-sect of Jews in the days leading up to the destruction of the temple in 69 AD are indicated here

The mark of the beast is again a parody of the SIGN on the believers as we read in the letter to the Philadelphians -- the SIGN or Tau being the Hebrew letter which looks like a cross - so the sign of the cross as the christians did was the sign of God

The mark of the beast is linked to the number of the beast - as "wisdom is needed here... it stands for a person..." -- to reveal the identity of the beast to the Christians while hiding it from outsiders, St john used Gematria, the rabbinic numering system for names. When the Gematrian numbers of Nero's official name in Hebrew are added together (50 + 200 + 6+50 + 100 + 60 + 200) they total 666. The Christians KNew that 666 is the number of Nero

==========================================================

Remember back to the Mark of the Lamb alluded to in the 6th letter to the churches, to the Philadelphians - God's mark is mentioned specifically in the sixth seal of the initial vision (7:3). In Heaven God's faithful "servants shall worship Him; they shall see His face, and His name shall be on their foreheads"..22:4

The mark of the beast is Satan's parody of the sign of the cross. The sign on the forehead talks of loyalty and that on the hand of what we do with the loyalty

We see the same in 14:9 "anyone who worships the beast and its image" is shown as "receiving a mark on his forehead or on his hand"

Nero is the human whose symbol is 666, who demanded worship of himself.

This is the only time in history when the Church was persecuted by both the beast (the Roman empire) and the harlot (Jerusalem authorities)

ST John twice pauses to say "here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints" (13:10, 14:12). The first time, this is following a statement about not being in armed conflict against the beast "if anyone slays with the sword, with the sword must he be slain" (13:10)

The second time is not to have the mark of the beast -- to be clear the admonition agians thte mark of the beast is "do not worship the earthly power of the roman empire - THAT is the mark of the beast

87 posted on 09/28/2020 2:45:26 AM PDT by Cronos (19 years on FR)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal; Just mythoughts; metmom
And a point of note, metmom - the Lamb in revelations 5 has 7 eyes and 7 horns - that Lamb is Jesus, with 7 eyes and horns -- the 7 is the number for completeness. What did I tell you, metmom? That the book of the apocalypse is filled with numbers as a symbol. 7 eyes = complete sight or omniscience. 7 "horns" -- Jesus with horns? The seven horns of the lamb signify power - omnipotence since "horns" were a symbol in the Old Testament for power

88 posted on 09/28/2020 2:45:37 AM PDT by Cronos (19 years on FR)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal; Just mythoughts; metmom
And war criminal -- Apocalypse 13:16-18 is based on Ezekiel 8 and 9. The "mark" symbolized the spiritual condition of the inhabitants of Jerusalem. The ones with the "mark" were in allegiance with God. However, in Apocalypse, the mark is reversed. That is to say, the mark was on those who were against God and had allegiance to the "beast."

John wrote that the number "is the number of a man's name; and his number is 666." This tells us that those who received the "mark" were actually in allegiance with a "man," an actually person of the first century. So, who was he? Lucius Domitius Ahenobarbus! Better known as Nero Caesar.

John used a puzzle called gematria in which numbers are used to represent certain letters. John used this puzzle to reveal Nero without actually writing down his name. Remember, the early churches were being persecuted during this time—not only from the Jews, but also from the Romans. The numerical values of the Hebrew letters in Neron Kesar (Nero Caesar) are:

Nero's Name

Nero Caesar fits the gematria code number "666." Using this code, his name would be rendered as "NRWN QSR." (NRWN QSR). The number values are:

N = 50
R = 200
W = 6
N = 50
Q = 100
S = 60
R = 200

which, when added together, equals 666. The fact that Nero fits the description of the "beast" is well documented. According to Suetonius, he murdered his parents, wife, brother, aunt, and many others close to him and of high station in Rome. He was a torturer, a homosexual rapist, and a sodomite. He even married two young boys and paraded them around as his wives. One of the boys, whose name was Sporus, was castrated by Nero. He was truly bestial in his character, depravity, and actions. He devised a kind of game: covered with the skin of some wild animal, he was let loose from a cage and attacked the private parts of men and women, who were bound at stakes. He also initiated the war against the Jews which led to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD..

Nero’s persecution, which was initiated in A.D.64, was the first ever Roman assault on Christianity. Roman historian Tacitus (A.D. 56-117) spoke of Nero's "cruel nature" that "put to death so many innocent men." He records the scene in Rome when the persecution of Christians broke out: "And their death was aggravated with mockeries, insomuch that, wrapped in the hides of wild beasts, they were torn to pieces by dogs, or fastened to crosses to be set on fire, that when the darkness fell they might be burned to illuminate the night." Christians were crucified, beheaded, burnt alive, and used as torches to light the palace gardens. Historically, Nero is the one that persecuted Christians beyond all comparison. St. John’s banishment to Patmos (where he wrote the book of Apocalypse) was itself a result of the great persecution of Nero. The apostle Paul was tortured and then beheaded by the evil Emperor Nero at Rome in A.D. 67. The apostle Peter, who was crucified upside down, was another victim of Nero, .

As Church father Eusebius notes: "Nero was the first of the emperors who showed himself an enemy of the divine religion." Sulpicius Severus concurs: "He first attempted to abolish the name of Christian." In his Annals, Roman historian Tacitus points to those who were persecuted as "those who . . . were vulgarly called Christians." Roman historian Suetonius concurs, for in a list of the few "positive" contributions of Nero as emperor, he includes the fact that Nero persecuted Christians: "During his reign many abuses were severely punished and put down, and no fewer new laws were made:. . . . Punishment was inflicted on the Christians, a class of men given to a new and mischievous superstition."

Noted church historian J. L. von Mosheim wrote of Nero's persecution: "Foremost in the rank of those emperors, on whom the church looks back with horror as her persecutors, stands Nero, a prince whose conduct towards the Christians admits of no palliation, but was to the last degree unprincipled and inhuman. The dreadful persecution which took place by order of this tyrant, commenced at Rome about the middle of November, in the year of our Lord 64. . . . This dreadful persecution ceased but with the death of Nero. The empire, it is well known, was not delivered from the tyranny of this monster until the year 68, when he put an end to his own life." (L. von Mosheim, Historical Commentaries, I:138,139).

His bestial cruelty is evidenced in the writings of the Roman historian Suetonius (A.D. 70-160), who speaks of Nero's "cruelty of disposition" evidencing itself at an early age. He documents Nero's evil and states: "neither discrimination or moderation [were employed] in putting to death whosoever he pleased on any pretext whatever." Suetonius notes that Nero "compelled four hundred senators and six hundred Roman knights, some of whom were well to do and of unblemished reputation, to fight in the arena."

Roman naturalist Pliny the Elder (A.D. 23-79) described Nero as "the destroyer of the human race" and "the poison of the world." Roman satirist Juvenal (A.D. 60-140) speaks of "Nero's cruel and bloody tyranny." Elsewhere, he calls Nero a "cruel tyrant."

Nero so affected the imagination that the pagan writer Apollinius of Tyana, a contemporary of Nero, specifically mentions that Nero was called a "beast": "In my travels, which have been wider than ever man yet accomplished, I have seen many, many wild beasts of Arabia and India; but this beast, that is commonly called a Tyrant, I know not how many heads it has, nor if it be crooked of claw, and armed with horrible fangs. . . . And of wild beasts you cannot say that they were ever known to eat their own mother, but Nero has gorged himself on this diet."


How Nero fulfills Prophesy

In Apocalypse 13:7, the Beast is said to "make war with the saints and to overcome them." Apocalypse 13:5 says that the beast would conduct such blasphemous warfare for a specific period of time: 42 months. The Neronic persecution was instituted in 64 AD and lasted until his death in June 68 AD, which is three and a half years, or 42 months! Nero fits the bill for the role of the beast!

Apocalypse 13:10 and 14 says the Beast not only slays by the sword, but ultimately is to die of a sword wound. Do you know how Nero died? According to Suetonius, he "drove a dagger into his throat, aided by Epaphroditus, his private secretary" (ch.49). Nero killed with the sword and was killed by the sword. That Nero did, in fact, kill by the sword is a well-attested fact. Paul, for example, is said to have died under Nero by decapitation by means of the sword. Tertullian credits "Nero's cruel sword" as providing the martyr's blood as seed for the church. He urges his Roman readers to "Consult your histories; you will there find that Nero was the first who assailed with the imperial sword the Christian sect."

Nero died in the middle of the war on June 8th, 68 AD, and Vespasian went back to Rome to fight to become the new emperor. During this time the Christians fled Jerusalem because they heeded the warning of Matthew 24:16; the Jews thought the respite was a sign from God of victory and they gathered in Jerusalem in great numbers. The Romans came back and destroyed the city.

Apocalypse 17:3 tells us that the beast is red. The red color may be indicative of the bloodshed caused by the beast. But Suetonius writes of the legend associated with Nero's ancestral parentage, which explains why he had a red beard, which was very unusual in those times.

Apocalypse 17:10 says, "And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space." The five "kings" were not ruling at the same time, for the text stated "five are fallen," meaning that five of those kings had come and gone. Then "one is," meaning the "king" who was ruling at the time Apocalypse was written. Here, in this verse, we have one of the clearest proofs for Nero being the beast. If we simply examine the list of Roman Emperors, we will be able to determine who the sixth king was. Flavius Josephus clearly points out that Julius Caesar was the first emperor of Rome, followed by Augustus; Tiberius; Caius (Caligula); Claudius; and the sixth emperor was…Nero (Antiquities, books 18 and 19), who assumed imperial power upon the death of the fifth emperor, Claudius, in October, A.D. 54. The matter is confirmed just a little later in the writings of Roman historians: Suetonius (Lives of the Twelve Caesars and Dio Cassius, Roman History 5). Nero reigned from 54AD to June of 68AD. John informs us that the seventh king was "not yet come." That would be Galba, who assumed power upon Nero's death in June, A.D. 68. But he was only to continue a "short space." As a matter of historical fact, his reign lasted but six months until January 15, A.D. 69.

What about the Beast's death-wound and his subsequent resurrection? Let us now consider John's revelation of the Beast arising from the dead (Apocalypse 13:3-4). At this point we need to reflect upon a most significant series of historical events of the A.D. 60s. First, with the death of Nero, the Roman Empire's founding family vanished from rule. Following the death of Nero was the extinction of the Julian line. Immediately, the Roman Empire was hurled into civil wars of horrible ferocity and dramatic proportions. These civil wars would strike everyone as being the very death throes of Rome, the Beast generically considered. Before the world's startled eyes, the seven-headed Beast (Rome) was toppling to its death as its sixth head (Nero) was mortally wounded with the sword.

Tacitus's detailed account of the ruin wreaked upon Rome almost equals in psychological horror, cultural devastation, and human carnage that which befell Jerusalem during the Jewish War, as recorded by Josephus and Tactius. The Roman civil wars were the first fruits of Nero's death. Josephus records that the destruction was so horrible, that the general Vespasian, "was not able to apply himself further in other wars when his native country was laid waste." Josephus agrees that during this time Rome was brought near to utter "ruin." He notes that "about this time it was that heavy calamities came about Rome on all sides." According to 4 Ezra 12:16-19, written around A.D. 100, the Empire was "in danger of falling": "In the midst of the time of that kingdom great struggles shall arise, and it shall be in danger of falling; nevertheless it shall not fall then, but shall regain its former power."

But what eventually occurred at the end of these death throes? Suetonius informs us that: "The empire, which for a long time had been unsettled and, as it were, drifting through the usurpation and violent death of three emperors, was at last taken in hand given stability by the Flavian family." Josephus sets forth this view of things when he writes: "So upon this confirmation of Vespasian's entire government, which was now settled, and upon the unexpected deliverance of the public affairs of the Romans from ruin, Vespasian turned his thoughts to what remained unsubdued in Judea." Thus, after a time of grievous civil wars, the Empire was revived by the ascending of Vespasian to the purple.

The point is not that Nero’s name is the primary identification of 666. The point is, instead, what the number meant to the seven churches. St. John’s Biblically informed readers will have already recognized many clear indications of the Beast’s identity. Nero arrived on the scene as the first great persecutor of the Church, the embodiment of the "666-ness" of the Empire, and – Lo and behold! – his very name spells out 666! It is significant that "all the earliest Christian writers on the Apocalypse, from Irenaeus down to Victorious of Pettau and Commodian in the fourth, and Andreas in the fifth, and St. Beatus in the eighth century, connect Nero, or some Roman emperor, with the Apocalyptic Beast ." There should be no reasonable doubt about this identification. St. John was writing to first-century Christians, warning them of things that were "shortly" to take place. They were engaged in the most crucial battle of history, against the Dragon and the evil Empire which he possessed. The purpose of the Apocalypse was to comfort the Church with the assurance that God was in control, so that even the awesome might of the Dragon and the Beast would not stand before the armies of Jesus Christ. Christ was wounded in His heel on Friday, the sixth day, the Day of the Beast – yet that is the day He crushed the Dragon’s head. At his most powerful, St. John says, the Beast is just a six, or a series of sixes; never a seven.

It is charged by some that Neron Kesar is merely a convenient "misspelling" of Nero’s name in Hebrew. This objection overlooks the fact that before the modern introduction of dictionaries the world was simply not as concerned as we are about uniformity in the spelling of names. Alternate spellings were common (e.g. "Joram" and "Jehoram" in the Old Testament), especially in the transliteration of words into a foreign tongue. But the allegation of misspelling is wholly wrong anyway. The form Neron Kesar is the linguistically "correct" Hebrew form, is the form found in the Talmud and other rabbinical writings, and was used by Hebrews in the first century, as archaeological evidence has shown. As F. W. Farrar observed, "the Jewish Christian would have tried the name as he thought of the name-that is in Hebrew letters. And the moment he did this the secret stood revealed. No Jew ever thought of Nero except as ‘Neron Kesar,’ and this gives at once . . . 666" (The Early Days of Christianity, Chicago and New York: Belford, Clarke& Co., 1882, p. 540). Of some related interest is the fact that if Nero’s name is written without the final "n" (i.e., the way it would occur to a Gentile to spell it in Hebrew), it yields the number 616 — which is exactly the variant reading in a few New Testament manuscripts. The most reasonable explanation for this variant is that it arose from the confusion over the final "n".

It may now be pointed out that in an Aramaic document from Murabba’at, dated to the "second year of the emperor Nero," the name is spelled ‘rsq nwrn’ as required by the theory (i.e., that 666 signifies Nero). The last two consonants of ‘rsq’ are damaged, but enough is preserved to show that no vowel-letter was written between the ‘q’ and ‘s’ (Apocalypse 13:18 and a Scroll from Murabba’at). The evidence can be seen by consulting the French work edited by P, Benoit, J. T. Milik, and R. DeVaux, Discoveries in the Judean Desert of Jordan II (Oxford, 1961), page 18, plate 29.

The Christians of the first century were under the military authority of Rome, a nation which openly proclaimed its rulers, the Caesars, to be divine. All those under the jurisdiction of Rome were required by law to publicly proclaim their allegiance to Caesar by burning a pinch of incense and declaring, "Caesar is Lord". Upon compliance with this law, the people were given a papyrus document called a "libellus", which they were required to present when either stopped by the Roman police or attempting to engage in commerce in the Roman marketplace, increasing the difficulty of "buying or selling" without this mark. This is the

essence of Scripture’s warnings to the early Christians of 70 AD against taking upon themselves the "mark of the beast namely Nero's coin".

89 posted on 09/28/2020 2:49:08 AM PDT by Cronos (19 years on FR)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal
Reject the teachings of false teachers like Missler, Darby and other preachers and pastors you follow and instead turn to Jesus Christ

Don't deny Jesus' OWN words "to this generation" namely the generation of those listening to Him

90 posted on 09/28/2020 2:51:04 AM PDT by Cronos (19 years on FR)
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