Posted on 09/17/2018 11:01:08 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Ping me their names, I'll be happy to tell them personally that they're wrong. A devout Baptist is certainly a Christian whether they like it or not.
Though I suspect if you did a poll, you'd find about 10X as many "evangelicals" denying that Catholics are Christians, than vice versa.
95% of the Catholics I've met have no problem accepting all mainstream Orthodox and Protestant denominations are Christian.
I personally thought he did a good job as the leader of Catholicism... but since I'm not a Roman, it was not my focus.
(with all the usual caveats, like there is no church office of pope in the NT)
Have you commented on the leadership of any of the other denominations?
Sounds like you are butthurt...
Considering the condition of the RCC today, I think you have bigger fish to fry...than dragging up old wounds...
——There are quite a few traditionalist Catholics on this site who aver that Protestants are not Christians, so you might want to look into that since it disturbs you.——
I can’t tell you how many times I was accused of being a heretic and destined to everlasting hell because I didn’t bow down to Rome...sort of become humorous..
Thank you.
This is actually the first time I’ve read the “Vigano letter” and it’s made me even more sad.
Please keep praying for all of us.
That's a very naive statement, since the theologies of the evangelical and liturgical churches have absolutely nothing in common (except a vocabulary that means something completely different to each group). Their doctrines are completely contradictory to each other. They can't all be true. To pretend that Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Nestorians, high church Anglicans, and low church Fundamentalist Protestants all share the same religion is simply nonsense on the face of it.
To say otherwise is to simply be engaging in ecumania.
And you've seen "quite a few"? OK, please send links identifying those Catechism-rejecting Catholics who say non-Catholics who profess Christ are not Christians, and I will go after them hammer and tongs.
I'll be the Nemesis on the Premises. I'll thwack 'em like an Old School Nun.
You must be on a different religion forum than I’ve been on, or perhaps outrageous statements only register for you when coming from outside your particular sect, because Protestants have been being called heretics for the entire 13 years I’ve been here, on the religion forum with which I’m familiar. Am I going to go back and name every single one? No, I’m not going to spend days looking for it, but do me a favor and police your own going forward, since you’ve made the offer. It will be much appreciated.
The same can be said for any of the major world religions.
Put an ultra-orthodox Hasidic Jewish rabbi from Israel in the same room with a female lesbian reform Jewish rabbi from New York City and let me know how much common ground they can find theologically, though both will be seen as "Jewish Rabbis" to the general public.
Get a follower of Tolu-e-Islam (which rejects all hadiths) in the same room with the Ayatollah of Iran and see much common ground they can agree on. Bring in some radical black activist from the "Nation of Islam" (he will undoubtedly self-identify as a "Muslim" in public) in good measure and see how much he can agree with the other two.
Have a devout follower of Lingayatism Hinudism (they are an extremist monotheistic Shiva sect that believes Shiva alone is the one true God) meet up with a Hare Krishna (International Society for Krishna Consciousness) from California. See if they agree on anything. Both will claim to be Hindus.
I’m “technically” a Protestant, although consider myself an unaligned (non-sectarian) Christian (but deeply interested and concerned about the situation within the Catholic Church).
I don’t remember criticizing Pope Benedict, except for his abdication. It may simply have been the challenges and infestation of the sodomite cancer in the church was such that he was incapable of dealing with it. I think he was blackmailed/coerced into abdication, however.
I challenged him to do as well, because I'd love to tell these "Catholics" that they're wrong. Let me see a list of the screennames. Ping 'em all to this thread.
That’s it
Chaste homosexual priests ok
Apparently not
Not to be unduly challenging, but just reaching for clarity here: You say thee are "quite a few" Catholics in FR who say Protestants are not Christians. Could you find me one? Seriously.
I've honestly not seen it, but if you have, I want to swing into my self-appointed but hopefully constructive role of Mater et Magistra and Remedial Catechist Lady.
I don't know what your experience has been here at FR, but it's possible there may have been a misunderstanding of basic terms. Believing in a heresy (a religious error) or being in schism (formal church separation, esp. with bishops not in communion with each other) is not the same as being "non-Christian" or "damned."
I fully expect to see throngs of blessed souls rejoicing around the Throne of God who might have been involved in some degree of heresy or schism on this earth. As far as I can see (I speak here of my own observation), most heresy and schism stems from having been born and raised in a "separated" group and involves honest mistakes with no conscious choice against the Truth.
You have to be pretty "knowing" and "intentional" --- in other words, informed and deliberate --- to be culpable guilty of "formal heresy" especially in today's world, where confusion is so endemic.
Jesus is a just judge: so just, that when He makes His judgment, every single soul will say, "He's a genius: He's speaking exactly to my heart and my condition, and He got that absolutely right."
So Catholic doctrine explicitly teaches that a person in innocent error is not, for that reason, non-Christian or hated by God or damned.
I suppose there may be people who don't know that.
I generally agree with your position. In fact, I generally agree about Calvinism. But there are Calvinistic teachers I respect very much. I just don’t agree on some specific teachings, like 5-point Calvinism.
“To guys like Ray Comfort and his ilk, millions of people who sincerely believe in the Holy Trinity are no different than Buddhists.”
I have watched a lot of videos by Ray Comfort and believe that he is not only a true, born-again follower of Christ, but also a very good and gifted Evangelist. I cannot speak for him on his views of Catholicism, but what I’ve seen in his public videos is a willingness to engage anyone with a challenge as to whether they have repented of their sins and trusted in Christ for salvation. This offends a lot of people from all walks of life who tend to think the message proclaiming their need for salvation is offensive. These may be atheists, Catholics, Protestants, or others.
The reality is that people can grow up in a Catholic or Protestant church, or even be a clergyman of such a church, and have never actually received the gift of eternal life.
I’ll go further on your example. The demons know the Trinity is real, but they do not have saving faith. A person who has received a great deal of the truth and has heard the Bible read and proclaimed is in more danger than the Buddhist who never heard the message of salvation, unless they also respond to the message with repentance and faith. To whom much is given, much is required.
When people with a church background hear the Gospel preached to them, often they become defensive and rely on their church membership as evidence that the message is not for them. But it is especially for them (i.e. us). In the rare cases someone tries to share the Gospel with me in public, I let them know I already have trusted in Christ for salvation. I don’t get defensive because I’m glad that someone cares enough to try to win lost souls. If they are preaching a false Gospel though I warn them and give them scripture on what the true Gospel message is.
So far you haven't name a SINGLE one, let alone the "tons" you claim to "know".
Mrs. Don-o and I were curious because from personal experience we would find it very strange to see a catechism-beliving faithful Catholic try to argue with a straight face that devout mainstream protestants "are not Christian". I've never met anyone who says that in this day and age. It would be like hearing a Trump voter argue that George W. Bush was not President.
I had an interesting debate on facebook with fellow Catholics about a week ago, and they claimed the opposite: that they had "never" seen a devout protestant facebook friend claim Catholics "are not Christian". I was then able to show a discussion thread from only one day earlier where one of the board members on their friends list made a public statement that "many people do not know the real truth behind the Catholic Church, that it mixes Christian-sounding terms with paganism so to be Catholic means that one is not a Christian and does not know Christ"
Funny how they "never" noticed comments like that.
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