Do most Calvinists really know what Calvin taught about predestination?

Running Away From My Church Blog ^ | 5/25/2018 | Robert Messner

[tiredofallofit]

Well I finally got around to it – I am reading through some of the Institutes of the Christian Religion by John Calvin. I say “some” because the complete work spans more than 1500 pages and deals with some of the most weighty and complex theological issues known to mankind. I have chosen for now to plod my way through the most controversial aspects of Calvin’s writings; the topics of predestination and election.

Most of my friends who call themselves Calvinists are eager to disassociate themselves from the doctrine of “double predestination”. They state that God has predestined some to eternal life, but they assure me that He would never send people to hell. People get there on their own, I am told. And what did Calvin teach? I ask. Usually, I receive some sort of vague answer – like how Calvin’s writings are difficult to understand or how misunderstood he is by other denominations. Ok, I get that. He was an intellectual giant – but what did he say about double predestination and if you don’t know exactly, then why do you call yourself a Calvinist?

So I decided to have a look for myself. Surprisingly, The Institutes of the Christian Religion are not so difficult to read or comprehend, despite the complexity of the topics discussed.

Calvin begins his discourse on the doctrine of predestination and election in Chapter 21 of Book 3 of his Institutes. If one just reads the title of this chapter and nothing else, he or she quickly ascertains Calvin’s view on double predestination – for the chapter is titled “OF THE ETERNAL ELECTION, BY WHICH GOD HAS PREDESTINATED SOME TO SALVATION, AND OTHERS TO DESTRUCTION.” That’s pretty clear, is it not?

But in case you still doubt his position, allow me to share with you this excerpt from Section 5 in Chapter 21:

"All are not created on equal terms, but some are preordained to eternal life, others to eternal damnation; and, accordingly, as each has been created for one or other of these ends, we say that he has been predestinated to life or to death."

He goes on to address the “arrogant” and “blasphemous” objections which are leveled at his view of predestination. And there are plenty of such objections. In typical Calvin style, he does not back down nor does he attempt to soften his message. God ordains some people to heaven and some people to hell, end of story.

“If that is what Calvin truly taught,” a Calvinist friend told me recently, “then I shouldn’t call myself a Calvinist. That’s not what I believe.”

There is no doubt that Calvin fully subscribed to the doctrine of double predestination. He invented it! Maybe it’s time for some Calvinists to revisit these Institutes of his and reevaluate their desire to affix this label on themselves.

Reference:

Calvin, John. Institutes of Christian religion. Trans. Henry Beveridge, Esq. 1599. Christian Classics Ethereal Library. Nov. 1999. 20 Sept. 2001

[MHGinTN]

Notice the twisting of what you posted? The assumption (the poster is full of them) that confession is not available except through an institutionalized hierarchy is satans game for obfuscating the Grace of God in Christ. Confessing to our Father when we are born from above IS the way that GOD our FATHER raises we children up in the way that we should go. The poster is dishonest and trying to get argumentation, using bait and switch and taunts. Self identified leftists tactics.

[metmom]

For what it’s worth, I personally do not know of any Calvinist who believes that non-Calvinist are not Christian, but I cannot say the converse is true.

I have heard that as the argument goes that if you take the non-Calvinist position, that means that you believe that you contribute to your own salvation, somehow putting your salvation in the *salvation by works* category.

IOW, the only alternative to Calvinism is salvation by works ergo, if you are not Calvinist, then by default you believe in salvation by works.

[kosciusko51]

I don’t see it that way: I’ve heard too many good Baptist preachers teach Grace alone by faith alone to buy that argument. I see it more as a theological debate, not an issue of salvation.

[metmom]

Is Confession just a Catholic position? I don’t think so.

MHG is right.

You are twisting what I said.

I specified the confession to a man for the forgiveness of sin, not confession in and of itself.

So, noob, what's your purpose here, besides blog pimping?

Reviewing your posting history, it looks like you are a Catholic.

Is that the case?

A simple *yes* or *no* will suffice.

[MHGinTN]

“many good Baptist preachers teach Grace alone by faith alone \” If you will put an e on the end of ‘faith’ it might fit better.

[Kandy Atz]

JESUS is the door.

Absolutely.

I remember when the Revelation found in Ephesians 1 really exploded in my spirit. My Heavenly Father made provision for me long before I ever had the chance to sin. He had a plan to rescue me from spiritual death long before sin even entered this world. That’s profound LOVE.

His Way makes religion just seem so silly.

[Salvation]

The authority of Christ is passed down through ordinations from the Bishop to the priest.

The formula of absolution used in the Latin Church expresses the essential elements of this sacrament: The Father of mercies is the source of all forgiveness. He effects the reconciliation of sinners through the Passover of his Son and the gift of his Spirit, through the prayer and ministry of the Church:

God, the Father of mercies, through the death and the resurrection of his Son has reconciled the world to himself and sent the Holy Spirit among us for the forgiveness of sins; through the ministry of the Church may God give you pardon and peace, and I absolve you from your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So we know that when we partake of the Sacrament of Reconciliation that God forgives and forgets our sins.

[MHGinTN]

Does God forgive sin that is not confessed to a member of your organization? Is your institution absolutely required for forgiveness?

[SoConPubbie]

He called me a liar. Showing off my humanity.

You seem confused as to what it means to be a "Christian" and to make a profession of Christianity.

Christian means to be Christ-like, your two posts on this thread where you cursed at posters you don't agree with are not Christ-like.

To be a Christian means you must be born-again, a new creature in Christ, whereby old things have passed away and all things are new and where there is no more condemnation because Christ has delivered you from your sinfulness and forgiven you of your sins.

I'm assuming that you believe this. Do you?

[tiredofallofit]

I specified the confession to a man for the forgiveness of sin, not confession in and of itself. I was responding to confession as you specified it. The Catholic Church is not the only church in which such confession takes place. But for some reason, you decided to turn it into a Catholic issue. You and MHG have the same problem - when someone answers your questions in opposition to your beliefs, you accuse them of twisting your words. It's a fun party trick but most can see through it.

[MHGinTN]

You are a twister. And what you accuse is absurd on the face of it, since you have been exposed as using bait and switch and false attributions. That, interestingly enough, identifies you more than any words we might post describing you.

[MHGinTN]

I am sorry if I stumped you with my queries, I understand the enigmatic position you’ve chosen.

[tiredofallofit]

Go ahead. Spell it out. How have I been accused of using bait and switch and false attributions? Specific examples are welcome.

[SoConPubbie]

You and MHG have the same problem - when someone answers your questions in opposition to your beliefs, you accuse them of twisting your words. It's a fun party trick but most can see through it.

Not a party trick, just an honest observation of your posting on this thread, however, maybe you just made a mistake and the before mentioned bait and switch was just you forgetting to be more specific?

[tiredofallofit]

Please tell me which bait and switch you are referring to and I will answer you.