Active intercession?

OSV.com ^ | 11-01-17 | Msgr. Charles Pope

[Salvation]

Active intercession?

Question: Are the saints in heaven active in the affairs of Earth? — Robert Bonsignore, Brooklyn, New York

Answer: Yes, we have a lot of evidence for that. But exactly how and to what extent they are aware and active is not fully known to us.

It seems unlikely that the saints can merely look down and watch us as though they were watching a movie, or that they can know our inmost thoughts. Such things are probably beyond their capacity and might even be considered intrusive of our privacy.

It seems safer to assume that the saints are aware of our needs and condition to the degree that God reveals this to them. Thus, if I am asking St. Anthony to pray for me, his capacity to hear my request is facilitated by the Lord and due to the membership both St. Anthony and I have in the Body of Christ. By analogy, the two members of my body that I call my hands can interact by the fact they are coordinated through my head. Jesus is the Head of the Body, the Church and everything in his Body is under his authority and coordinated by him, including the awareness and communion of various members of the body with each other.

[metmom]

Says the guy who is still here himself.

[metmom]

Yes, God is not the God of confusion, nor of any attempts to divide the Body of Christ. How can those who are seeking to sow distension among Christians fail to see that they are the tools of the Evil One?

Then why are the Orthodox and Rome still at odds with each other?

And why are Catholics on FR running down the pope for trying to reconcile with Protestants?

[metmom]

The doctrine of Purgatory is false because it is not supported by Scripture.

It claims that the blood of Jesus is not enough to cleanse a person from their sin when Scripture tells us that the blood od Jesus is the ONLY thing that cleanses us from our sin.

The doctrine of Purgatory in effect states that Jesus’ death and resurrection was not good enough and did not finish the job of redemption.

Utter blasphemy.

[metmom]

Book learning is meaningless without the enlightening of the Holy Spirit.

You laundry list of degrees and education is meaningless and impresses no one besides yourself.

[metmom]

Why are you here egging people on in a fight?

[metmom]

Why are you badgering ealgeone about what church he goes to?

It makes no difference to one who is born of the Spirit.

Church affiliation is irrelevant.

[metmom]

Let me know if you get an answer.

[trebb]

I have to ask....again....why would one pray to a dead mortal (saint or not) when Jesus came to earth as 100% Man and 100% God in order to give us a personal relationship and a direct line to God the Father, Through God the Son?

"Oh Lord, hear my prayer - please tell St. Such-and-Such that I need help in his special area and have him petition You on my behalf"......

One of the reasons I hate religion - men make up rules and other men try to justify them...

[PeterPrinciple]

I have to ask....again....why would one pray to a dead mortal (saint or not) when Jesus came to earth as 100% Man and 100% God in order to give us a personal relationship and a direct line to God the Father, Through God the Son?

---

A very valid question I have also asked but gotten no answer.

But the answer to that question is too revealing...........

Mat 16:16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
Mat 16:17 Jesus replied, “You are blessed, Simon son of John, because My Father in heaven has revealed this to you. You did not learn this from any human being.

[trebb]

Kind of ironic that a church can declare mortal folks “saints” and then profess that it is a good thing to pray to them instead of using the direct path Jesus gave us....kind of makes some of them “elites” while God sees us as His kids.....I can see respecting those who did a lot to carry the Word and Good News, but some seem to go a bit overboard...

[Biggirl]

Just think when you have a need and you ask others to keep you in their prayers.

[tired&retired]

I’ve read the first 50 posts and feel that I am observing an ego battle filled with injured pride by all participants.

The problem with that is that possession of knowledge fills us up and we then have no room for the Holy Spirit as we are full of ourselves. The Holy Spirit contains all the knowledge and guides us through the experience. Without the experience, all the knowledge is worthless. Much like reading books on bikes but never riding one.

True knowledge is is humbling in that the more you learn, the more you realize you don’t know. And, you have more unanswered questions.

Now, as to the question. Jesus never wanted us to worship Him, but only His Father in Him. The same is true for the Saints. While they may intercede, it is only to guide us toward knowing and experiencing Our Father better.

Intercession is necessary as without it no one else would ever grow toward God as the hurdle to cross would be too high.

Humility is the stepping stone that we must cross to find and experience God.

[tired&retired]

Excellent post in 19

[tired&retired]

I have had the honor of knowing a few Muslims who were more Christ like in their behavior than most proclaiming Christians. When I read the wisdom in the poetry of Rumi and Hafiz, I have no doubt that they knew Christ personally in their hearts.

Many Christians treat non Christians the same as the Pharisees treated Jesus.

[Elsie]

I'll 'discuss' it:

This ---> Question: Are the saints in heaven active in the affairs of Earth?

<--- is the WRONG question.

It should be --->

Is there ANY Scriptural evidence that points to anyone other than GOD and His Angels in Heaven interacting with humans on Earth?

(other than Satan and his fallen angels; that is)

[Elsie]

Yes, we have a lot of evidence for that. But exactly how and to what extent they are aware and active is not fully known to us.

It seems unlikely that the saints can merely look down and watch us as though they were watching a movie, or that they can know our inmost thoughts. Such things are probably beyond their capacity and might even be considered intrusive of our privacy.

It seems safer to assume that the saints are aware of our needs and condition to the degree that God reveals this to them. Thus, if I am asking St. Anthony to pray for me, his capacity to hear my request is facilitated by the Lord and due to the membership both St. Anthony and I have in the Body of Christ. By analogy, the two members of my body that I call my hands can interact by the fact they are coordinated through my head. Jesus is the Head of the Body, the Church and everything in his Body is under his authority and coordinated by him, including the awareness and communion of various members of the body with each other.

 

 

This indicates NOT a 'lot' of  'evidence' but shows LOTS of assuming and claiming 'facts' not in evidence.

[Elsie]

Lifelong Protestant here, and sick and tired of willfully ignorant knee-jerk anti-Catholic posters who attack the Catholic Church at every opportunity.

I guess that you consider ME to me to be an ignorant, knee-jerk, anti-Catholic poster.

I will ASSUME that you will now be able to dismiss ANYTHING I type here as rubbish; not worth reading.

Oh well; I've been called ugly by toads before.

[Elsie]

(FYI B.A, M.A, and Ph.D. in Theology here)

1 Corinthians 2:1-5
New International Version (NIV)

1 And so it was with me, brothers and sisters. When I came to you, I did not come with eloquence or human wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God.
2 For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
3 I came to you in weakness with great fear and trembling.
4 My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power.

[Elsie]

Absolutely - more than you, for I perceive that you are more wedded to your particular doctrinal beliefs than to God’s Truth.

HMMMmmm...

---

As I was walking across a bridge one day; I saw a man standing outside the railing, about to jump off.

 

So I ran over and said, "Stop! Don't do it!"

"Why shouldn't I?" he said.

 

I said, "Well, there's so much to live for!"

He said, "Like what?"

 

I said, "Well...are you religious or atheist?"

He said, "Religious."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Christian or Buddhist?"

He said, "Christian."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Catholic or Protestant?"

He said, "Protestant."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Episcopalian or Baptist?"

He said, "Baptist!"

 

I said,"Wow! Me too! Are you Baptist Church of GOD or Baptist Church of the Lord?"

He said, "Baptist Church of GOD!"

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Original Baptist Church of GOD, or are you Reformed Baptist Church of GOD?"

He said,"Reformed Baptist Church of GOD!"

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1915?"

He said, "Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1915!"

 

I said, "Die, heretic scum", and pushed him off.

 

-- Emo Phillips

---

I suppose there is one on the web where the answer to the question is "Catholic"...