Pope: No-work Sundays good, not just for faithful

Washington Post ^ | July 5, 2014 | Associated Press

[delchiante]

CAMPOBASSO, Italy — Pope Francis says abandoning the traditionally Christian practice of not working on Sundays isn’t such a good change. Francis on Saturday traveled to Molise, an agricultural region in the heart of southern Italy where unemployment is chronically high. While he said poor people need employment to have dignity, he disagreed with opening stores and other businesses on Sundays as a way to create jobs.m

[knarf]

... And Jesus met with the apostles on the first day .... Sunday.

[paintriot]

“If you love me, keep my commandments.”

[Mrs. Don-o]

I see there's a dispute about this. If there is a dispute, you're supposed to take it to the church to get a ruling.

Matthew 18:17
If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the Church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector.

The Church has the power of the Keys, the power to bind and loose, which Christ decreed not once but twice:

Matthew 16:19
I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”

... and Matthew 18:18

But I'm curious. To whom has Christ given the power of the Keys in your church?

[paintriot]

Wow. You sure do sweat about this. I offered up my belief only to be told I’m wrong. Maybe I am wrong. You prove my point of why I don’t care much for organized religion.

Hen peck someone else please.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Please: I gave my view; you gave yous. I did not condemn you, nor did I hen-peck. Responding on topic is not the same as hen-pecking, is it? If my words were not graceful, I apologize, though, because I would not willingly offend you.

I did ask some questions, though. And if you would answer them, I would listen respectfully. I am curious about how you see things,

[paintriot]

The FIRST day. “LET THERE BE LIGHT”

Where on earth do we get our light? The SUN. Yes, the same Sun as in SUNday. So.. First day is Sunday.

No harm in worship on all days.

[Karl Spooner]

No harm in worship on all days.

Exactly right. I know you recall that they tried to convict Christ for not following the Sabbath and the same bunch eventually murdered him. Christ IS the new Sabbath. If you got 4 or 5 minutes, this video lays that out pretty well in a short period of time.

http://youtu.be/mqafFliUPI8?t=1m1s

[af_vet_1981]

As a Catholic the Sabbath day is Sunday.

Where is that ?

[af_vet_1981]

the "Honor the Lord's Day" commandment

Where is that found ?

[af_vet_1981]

Not working on Sundays was never a "traditional practice", it was and still is Divine Law.

Where is this in the Bible ?

[delchiante]

What I have found is even Israel ignores 1/3 of the timekeeping their Fathers were taught (Moses) on their calendar., but it appears not be their fault..
But Divinely ordained...

Passover, according to Josephus and Philo, occurred when the ‘sun was in Aries’(Ram/Lamb)
The equinox was held back then so the sun, moon and stars alignments would have been a logical start.

But the equinox has moved... it is no longer in the Ram, but in Pisces( the two fish)

Israel observes its spring and fall feasts in Pisces and Virgo today and history shows it was previously in Aries and Libra..

Doesn’t sound like too much of a big deal since the earth has wobbled and Israel holds to the equinox...

We do know from Scripture the ‘Fishers of Men’ and His Virgin Bride, the Church are themes in the New Testament so maybe the fish and virgin are a sign of a new age..

So today, unknowingly to them, Israel’s feasts have moved from the Ram(Aries) to the Fishes(Pisces) and from the Scales (Libra) to the Virgin.. ( Virgo)
That is fascinating when learning of His calendar!

But there is a problem with this move... Scripture tells us the Messiah was born under a specific sign, and that sign would denote a different month number depending on when Passover is observed

It would be the sixth month, if the ‘sun in the Ram’ begins the year- or the seventh month if the ‘sun in Pisces’ begins the year...

So Israel (and those believers who follow and observe those feasts) starts their year a month early if Aries and Libra are still the correct signs, as it appears for Moses and Messiah....

Israel, given His instructions and their own history, seem to use only the sun as their guide and many of His Bride follow that same sun as their guide..
In a couple months, they will add the moon in there for their feasts and some of His bride do the same..

But are they His feasts?

Not if they are off by a month, they are not....

I shouldnt know any of this... but I have been blessed to have the scales fall off..
It doesn’t mean all my questions are answered, but it does mean I can test what the world does and compare it to what He shows us in His sky and Scripture...(and throw in a couple historians)

We all need His Mercy and Grace more than we know... even those entrusted with His calendar have been blinded..

Those of us who were never taught this need Him to teach them it to us as we are ignorant of those things innocently...

His churches can’t be bothered but each believer can ask, seek and knock...

Pray the scales come off...
It is a battle for worship.... and it predates each and every one of our births...
In the end, again, His Mercy and Grace is needed more than we know..

HalleluYah!

[af_vet_1981]

According to the Catholic Catechism (which I thought one or both of you would know by heart :) ), Sunday is not the Sabbath; it is the fulfillment of the Sabbath. The Sabbath is the seventh day of the week, in English Saturday, which is the day Jesus observed as Shabbat.

Sunday - fulfillment of the sabbath 2175 Sunday is expressly distinguished from the sabbath which it follows chronologically every week; for Christians its ceremonial observance replaces that of the sabbath. In Christ's Passover, Sunday fulfills the spiritual truth of the Jewish sabbath and announces man's eternal rest in God. For worship under the Law prepared for the mystery of Christ, and what was done there prefigured some aspects of Christ:107 Those who lived according to the old order of things have come to a new hope, no longer keeping the sabbath, but the Lord's Day, in which our life is blessed by him and by his death.108 2176 The celebration of Sunday observes the moral commandment inscribed by nature in the human heart to render to God an outward, visible, public, and regular worship "as a sign of his universal beneficence to all."109 Sunday worship fulfills the moral command of the Old Covenant, taking up its rhythm and spirit in the weekly celebration of the Creator and Redeemer of his people.

[EDINVA]

That seems like a silly question to those of us older than @ 55 who grew up in the U.S.A. It used to be that businesses closed on Sundays but police, firemen, doctors, nurses, etc. worked. Until relatively recently, most businesses closed on Christmas Day but that’s no longer the case.

The very orthodox Jews don’t have exceptions, never have and probably never will. They WILL let a child die rather than pick up a phone on the Sabbath. Sometimes they can find a goyem to do for them what they can’t do themselves, but in communities of only Orthodox, G*d help anyone who gets sick between sunset Friday and Sunset Saturday.

[Karl Spooner]

I don’t think they/are were Jews, per say. Kenites saying they are Jews might be more appropriate. You know, the ones that instigated the murder of Christ. Yeah, they riled up a bunch of folks against him, but that is no different than they do today.

[RetiredArmy]

When I was a kid of the 1960s we had Blue Laws. No one worked Sundays except gas stations and small grocery stores.

[piusv]

Yes, I worded that incorrectly. Basically, what I was saying was that the Day we observe is Sunday, not Saturday.

The Catechism also states:

The sabbath, which represented the completion of the first creation, has been replaced by Sunday which recalls the new creation inaugurated by the Resurrection of Christ.

I find it funny how this thread has turned into a debate over the Sabbath and no work on Sunday and nowhere do I even see Francis mentioning any of this in his homily....lol.

[piusv]

Nope. Not getting into Bible back and forth with you.

[af_vet_1981]

The very orthodox Jews don’t have exceptions, never have and probably never will. They WILL let a child die rather than pick up a phone on the Sabbath. Sometimes they can find a goyem to do for them what they can’t do themselves, but in communities of only Orthodox, G*d help anyone who gets sick between sunset Friday and Sunset Saturday.

Patently false; In Judaism, Pikuach Nefesh (Hebrew: פיקוח נפש) describes the principle in Jewish law that the preservation of human life overrides virtually any other religious consideration. When the life of a specific person is in danger, almost any mitzvah lo ta'aseh (Command to not do an action) of the Torah becomes inapplicable.[1]

[af_vet_1981]

Yes, I worded that incorrectly. Basically, what I was saying was that the Day we observe is Sunday, not Saturday. The Catechism also states: The sabbath, which represented the completion of the first creation, has been replaced by Sunday which recalls the new creation inaugurated by the Resurrection of Christ. I find it funny how this thread has turned into a debate over the Sabbath and no work on Sunday and nowhere do I even see Francis mentioning any of this in his homily....lol.

Good, that is what I expected. I suppose there would be some benefit if those who have rejected the meatier areas, if they can be regarded such, of the Catechism were to switch their observance from the seventh day to the eighth in that it might promote common interests and make observing Sunday easier (which was the historical tradition of most Protestants). I find the Sola Scriptura communities cannot completely explain switching from the seventh day to the first/eighth without resorting to tradition.

[Karl Spooner]

I find it funny how this thread has turned into a debate over the Sabbath and no work on Sunday and nowhere do I even see Francis mentioning any of this in his homily....lol.

Thanks for reading the article.

"He added: “Maybe it’s time to ask ourselves if working on Sundays is true freedom.”