What Did the Imam Really Say? [At the Vatican with the Pope]

Fr. Z/ WDTPRS ^ | 06/13/14 | Fr. Z

[Brian Kopp DPM]

What Did the Imam Really Say?

Posted on 13 June 2014 by Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

You probably know that, during the prayer for peace event in the garden’s behind St. Peter’s basilica, held by Pope Francis with the leaders of Israel, Palestinians and also the Ecumenical Patriarch, one of the invited guests, an Imam, reportedly prayed for Allah to grant victory over infidels.

“No, he didn’t!”, say some.  ”Yes, he did!”, say others.

I read at Gates of Vienna:

In his own words in the end he asked god to assist those in the state of weakness. He said intasar al mustaDaafin fil ArD ya rab al alamin wa salam ala mursalin… , which means assist people in the state of weakness in the land oh Lord of the worlds and peace be upon messengers.

I searched the phrase “intasar al mustaDaafin” or “assist people in the state of weakness” and found that Muslim Arabs use it often in their prayer for either Palestinians or Mujahidin who are fighting against “oppressors”. Possibly the Imam’s intention was precisely that, but he did not literally ask Allah to assist Muslims over non-believers.

However, a commentator says:

Without a shadow of a doubt [that] means make us VICTORIOUS over the Kaferin or unbelievers or deniers! Please don’t try to create clouds and doubts where there are non. It is not ambiguous at all.

Here is the translation from quran.com: “You are our protector, so give us victory over the disbelieving people.” sura 2 aya 286

It is asking Allah to give the Muslims victory in WARS that they had against pagan Arabs. This is the context.

There is a video of the Imam:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcyErI-4bSI

Some are saying that the controversial line was cut from the video.  I dunno.

However, again, a commentator wrote:

I do understand Quranic Arabic very well. I also know Quran itself rather well. I am an ex- muslim. This link that you have posted is cut! The full recitation of Quran by this imam that I watched on Al Arabiya chanal two days ago had his recitation till the last verses and without a shadow of a doubt he recited the 2nd sura Al Bagharah’s last few verses till the very end where he does recite ” And pardon us and forgive us and have mercy on us, you are our guardian, so make us victorious over the tribe of disbelievers ( or deniers as the word Kafir really means)”.

Now the question is who chopped this link to take out the controversial part out of it. It is cut literally in the middle of the verse where the controversial part starts and jumps to the imam’s prayer in his own words which are not controvercial. [I think around 2:24] You can recognize the end of recitation and beginning of his own prayer by the fact that he stopped singing and start speaking normally. If you pay attention you will notice that the place was cut. It is noticeable. They kept his recitation until the end of the of ” forgive us and have mercy on us.” But the last two sentences ” you are our guardian, so grant us victory over unbelievers” was neatly in very stalinesque fashion airbrushed out! Cunning bastards! That is why your Russian translator didn’t hear anything controversial. But he can go check his Quran and see that up till the last two sentences which are missing everything before it is sura2 last verses. Now you want to tell me he just left out the last half verse from his recitation?! Of course not! They are counting on people’s ignorance of Arabic and quraniccontent

I don’t know Arabic.

[Alex Murphy]

IB4TPIWMA

[boatbums]

That thread doesn't contain the actual prayers, Salvation. That's why I asked. DO you have some other source for the transcript of the actual prayers and words spoken by the Catholic and Orthodox representatives?

[Gamecock]

If we had the actual text I suspect:

- Reasonable Catholics would show up and use that as another reason they haven't attended mass in years.

-The FRoman Catholic Brigade will tell interpret what Frank REALLY meant to say.

[piusv]

We all know it was the former ecumenical crap. It’s just that most Catholics here love it and others recognize that it goes against Traditional Catholicism and that it should be condemned.

[piusv]

The words of a true pope. Thank you.

[piusv]

The big question is: Who edited the tape? It had to have been done by someone in the Vatican, or by someone employed by the Vatican. So the Imamgate scandal has just become even more scandalous.

I wouldn't be surprised by this at all. Just like they deleted Francis' previous scandalous interview statements from the Vatican website.

[Bigg Red]

Thanks for replying. Prayers for our Church.

[CTrent1564]

Gamecock

Ahhh, I see my assigning Alex the Moniker “Defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Brigades” has caught on as now we have the FRoman Catholic Brigade. Well done!. Now, do I get royalties????????????????????????? Of course, I will not take command of a brigade, I want a Division at least, and actually I think I should be in charge of a CORP.

[Gamecock]

I was going to say Parade of Papists but decided to be nice.

[CTrent1564]

Gamecock:

Ahhh, well appreciate the nicer side of Gamecock.

[Gamecock]

;-)