Three Ways Catholic Tradition Bolstered My Protestant Faith

Her-menutics ^ | March 21, 2014 | Andrea Palpant Dilley

[ebb tide]

These years later, I'm still not a Catholic. I'm a high church evangelical Protestant. However, I borrow gratefully from the Mother Church. Insofar as the weaknesses of Catholicism were "corrected" by the Protestant Reformation, here's how Catholicism corrects the weaknesses of my Protestant faith: Sacramental worship I attend an evangelical church in the Anglican/Episcopal tradition.

[Jim Noble]

Whenever I see a brother or a sister trying to follow Jesus, I say, "Amen".

Remember the words of the Lord before you all start throwing stones.

[Salvation]

Megachurch pastor stuns congregation by announcing he’s converting to Catholicism[Ulf Ekman]
Ulf Ekman Converts to Roman Catholicism

Did this person convert or not?

[man_in_tx]

Apparently, Pastor Ekman did, but the writer of the article, Andrea Dilley, did not, though she does laud the positive influences she believes she has received from the Roman Catholic church. (She is Anglican/Episcopal.)

[man_in_tx]

Interesting article. Genuine first-person testimony.

Observation: She does not seem to embrace the concept of “total depravity,” or, as it might be called today, “pervasive corruption of every part of our character and being by original sin.”

Total depravity does not mean we are as evil as we can be, but it does mean that no part of our being and character iscompletely free of the corruption of sin from the moment of conception.

Her “I’m not total garbage” statements sets up a false dichotomy. Reformed theology does not posit that we are total garbage. Christ redeemed His people — no one correctly posits that he died for “garbage.”

She appears to adopt a semi-pelagian position, which, though incorrect, does not, of course, necessarily invalidate her testimony of faith in Christ.

[Iscool]

Ulf Ekman, the pastor of a prominent megachurch in Sweden, recently announced his conversion to Catholicism. Some Protestants responded to the news with the kind of intrigue and betrayal we might expect when a man defects from his country. Others of us were left standing on the shore, wondering, Should I go, too? What's my religious heritage and where do I belong?

I don't think that she ever found Jesus...She is looking for a religion, a Church, not Christianity...

[Salvation]

I just re-read the entire article. She sounds close, but no cigar.

[ebb tide]

Are you still a sedevacantist?

[narses]

My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.
For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,
For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with His arm:
He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
He has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree.
He has filled the hungry with good things;
and the rich He has sent empty away.
He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;
As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen

Magníficat ánima mea Dóminum,
et exsultávit spíritus meus
in Deo salvatóre meo,
quia respéxit humilitátem
ancíllæ suæ.

Ecce enim ex hoc beátam
me dicent omnes generatiónes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericórdia eius in progénies
et progénies timéntibus eum.
Fecit poténtiam in bráchio suo,
dispérsit supérbos mente cordis sui;
depósuit poténtes de sede
et exaltávit húmiles.
Esuriéntes implévit bonis
et dívites dimísit inánes.
Suscépit Ísrael púerum suum,
recordátus misericórdiæ,
sicut locútus est ad patres nostros,
Ábraham et sémini eius in sæcula.

Glória Patri et Fílio
et Spirítui Sancto.
Sicut erat in princípio,
et nunc et semper,
et in sæcula sæculórum.

Amen.

She became the Mother of God, in which work so many and such great good things are bestowed on her as pass man’s understanding. For on this there follows all honor, all blessedness, and her unique place in the whole of mankind, among which she has no equal, namely, that she had a child by the Father in heaven, and such a Child . . . Hence men have crowded all her glory into a single word, calling her the Mother of God . . . None can say of her nor announce to her greater things, even though he had as many tongues as the earth possesses flowers and blades of grass: the sky, stars; and the sea, grains of sand. It needs to be pondered in the heart what it means to be the Mother of God.

(Commentary on the Magnificat, 1521; in Luther’s Works, Pelikan et al, vol. 21, 326)

[daniel1212]

She is Anglican/Episcopal.)

That helps to explains it. They are the closest "Protestant" church to Rome, including in being liberal .

[man_in_tx]

I just re-read the entire article. She sounds close, but no cigar.

//////////////
Correct - she (perhaps, just barely) falls on this side of the Cath/Prot divide.

[man_in_tx]

She is Anglican/Episcopal.)

That helps to explains it. They are the closest “Protestant” church to Rome, including in being liberal .

//////////////

In general, you are correct (on the liberal part), but there do exist some Anglican churches in the US, Africa, and elsewhere that are not liberal. (I know: I have attended one or two.)

[imardmd1]

Remember the words of the Lord before you all start throwing stones.

What he said was, "O woman, where are those accusers of yours? Not one condemned* you, did he?"

Then she said, "O Lord, not one**."

Then Jesus said to her, "Neither do I Myself condemn* you. Go on***! And |from now| keep on sinning no longer!"

-----

Notes:
* = condemn with a sentence of death and Hell
** = masculine
*** = continue on with your life
|...| = implicit

Jesus judged rightly but did not impose the sentence demanded by The Torah, for two eyewitnesses are required to execute the sentence expected for the crime (and it was a crime).

Do you think she then stopped sinning. Was she a sinner because she sinned, or did she sin because she was a sinner? Hm?

(Don't forget that for some Bible scholars, the authenticity of this passage is open to question. I don't, but it is not one, then, upon which to solely build your faith.)

[Zuriel]

**She became the Mother of God**

Not possible. God has no beginning or ending, cannot be added to or decreased. God cannot die. The Son of God died. “Him God raised up”. (from Peter’s testamony to Cornelius. You would do well to read it again very slowly a few times. (Peter defines the Godhead much better than the RCC or Luther.)

“But to us there is but ONE GOD, the FATHER, OF WHOM are all things, and we IN him;(semi-colon) and one Lord Jesus Christ, BY WHOM are all things, and we BY him”. I Cor. 9:6 (Paul defines the Godhead much better than the RCC or Luther.)

verse 7: “Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge..”. (boy, that’s the truth!!)

**It needs to be pondered in the heart what it means to be the Mother of God.**

Neither Peter, or Paul, appear to have pondered such a gross misunderstanding of the scriptures.

Jesus explained the Godhead quite simply in John 4:23,24. and taught that the Father is in him, and he in the Father. He taught further that the Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father.

The Father is THE source of all things divine, and dwells, with unlimited power, in Jesus Christ.

[Faith Presses On]

Luther wasn’t a Protestant pope. He had in fact been Catholic, as we all know. Certainly, as the Bible says, I call Mary blessed among women, and as we frequently talk about in Biblle-believing churches, we should agree to what the Lord wants for us, in faith, as His servants, and we should “do whatever He, Jesus, tells us to do,” but the robbing of worship of God, and dependence on Him, which breaks the first of the Ten Commandments, I won’t do.
I so love the Lord that I will not be robbed in the relationship I have with Him to worship another creature, though she blessed among women. I still love Mary as “brethren” in Christ, and I love that the Lord blessed her so, and I see that spiritually God re-creates the same miracle when Jesus is born in the hearts of believers, and they are transformed into a new creature and taken from spiritual death to life, but I will try to as jealously guard my relationship with the Lord as He does our relationship. To make the choice to call on Mary for help and Cont’d

[Faith Presses On]

protection, and to call her “my life, my sweetness, and my hope,” would mean I lose out On being with Lord Himself. Paul wrote that through Jesus’ sacrifice what had separated us from God had been torn down, so I will go to the Lord, and commune with Him. From reading and accepting the whole Bible, I also can do nothing else. “Sola Scriptura” does not mean Scripture and nothing else, as from what I recall there are even other solas. It only means, the Bible, and no, “yes, buts.” We’re actually to do as Mary did, trust and obey God.

[Faith Presses On]

I first read the whole Bible about ten years ago, which really brought me to the Lord and changed my whole life and way of seeing things, although I was a believer before. I considered for the second time in my life what church to follow since the Lutheran didn’t seem right to me and knew just to follow the Bible. The area I’d lived my whole life in at the time was 80% Catholic, so I considered Catholicism, but decided after a time that it didn’t follow the Bible as it should. I was still mostly positive on it, though, but over time with experiencing more of the Lord and learning more, I’ve become more and more troubled by it.
Back 8 or so years ago, though, I would listen to Catholic radio and watch its TV for spiritual food still, and once on an EWTN program the host concluded with something like, “in the name of Mother, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.” I even saw the show’s replay so I know I didn’t imagine it. I’m only sorry that I wasn’t more skeptical then of the RC Church (Cont’d)

[Faith Presses On]

so I would have exactly remembered what the host said beyond all doubt. But to the best of my recollection, that is the exact phrase he used, although it still amazes to think that he actually did.

[Faith Presses On]

There is a lot of concern among Bible-believing Christians over megachurches, and I am more cautious about them and big-name leaders. Jesus said the last shall be first and the first last, and that He came to serve, not be served. Those who follow or stay in the churches of Rick Warren, or Joel Osteen, tend to believe as they do or they wouldn’t be there. So it’s not surprising that this megachurch pastor’s congregation was stunned, because he didn’t change his positions over night, and those who follow the Bible most likely left either this church a long time ago or were never a part of it but from what they knew of it were not surprised but this pastor’s move.

[Faith Presses On]

I agree also. Pretty much everything she wrote seems to not really be based on a solid foundation of Scripture, but what she’s picked up along the way. I understand this from being raised in the Lutheran Church in the 70’s and 80’s, where I learned the Gospel, Jesus’ most famous commands, like to forgive, and a few of the best known Old Testament stories. We were given only a tiny amount of Scripture and never told to read the Bible, so I understand her perspective and how she might draw conclusions that the Catholic Church emphasizes God’s family, that speaking of unworthiness before God is biblical, and that even with no merit of our own we can relate to others outside the church, because we all need Jesus just as much. It does seem that all she really knows is religion. I pray that changes and she comes to know the Lord Himself.