church_me

Answering Protestants ^ | 7 March 2014 | Matthew Olson

[matthewrobertolson]

Only trusting the Bible without the Church would be like loving "Romeo & Juliet" and hating Shakespeare's explanation of it.

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[redleghunter]

Is that a “yes”? You see the ECF writings as equal to the NT apostolic works?

Please let your yes be yes and your no be no.

[LurkingSince'98]

with all due respect, I actually thought you were reading my posts.

I said what I meant and I meant what I said:

“...all Catholics view the writings of the Church Father to have significant standing in our beliefs.”

and

...”we BELIEVE the Church to be both Scriptural and traditional.”

and

“That’s why I said you have to rely 100% on the Bible it’s the only thing you’ve got.”

For The greater Glory of God

[metmom]

As said before protestants threw out the the Sign of the Cross, the Crucifix, Latin prayers, the Mass, Icons, the books of the Apocrypha, prayers to the saints, the writings of the Early Church Fathers, and the list is endless - all of that thrown away and they were part and parcel of the Church life for early Christians.

Show us that out of the book of Acts.

[metmom]

Well, which is it then?

...”we BELIEVE the Church to be both Scriptural and traditional.”?

or....

“That’s why I said you have to rely 100% on the Bible it’s the only thing you’ve got.”?

Or are you referring to Prots in that last comment?

And, pray tell, what would be wrong with relying 100% on the God breathed, Holy Spirit inspired word of God?

[fabian]

The real problem in most churches today is that they are part of the cult of Christian apostasy...
http://youtu.be/BHnXvpPRHrE

[LurkingSince'98]

it is obvious that you believe that when the last apostle died all revelation from and by the Holy Spirit died with them.

So all you have is what is written in the Bible, which you received from the Catholic Church.

The same Catholic Church which holds the original complete works, and oldest fragment of works of the books of the bible.

The same Catholic Church who voted on the Canon of the Bible and who accepted the very books you read and rejected the ones you don’t.

The same Catholic Church who translated the bible from the original Greek and Aramaic texts into Latin via St Jerome.

The same Catholic church who copied and recopied the bibles BY HAND through the dark ages.

The same Catholic Church who printed the Bible (Gutenberg was a Catholic); but, probably unknown to you, that there had already been three or four printed versions of the Latin/German bible PRIOR to Gutenberg.

The same Catholic Church whose Councils defended early Christians against all heresies, which they did in writing and for which there is a printed record.

So today, I make and say The Sign of The Cross, repeat the Nicean Creed, sing the Sanctus, hold a Crucifix, gaze upon pictures of icons that are still today in the catacombs in Rome - all whose origins are from the 1st Century AD.

In addition, I read the writings of Clement of Rome, Mathetes, Polycarp, Ignatius, Barnabas, Papias, Justin Martyr, Irenaeus; all who wrote in the First Century.

In addition, I read the bible and hear more Scripture read at Mass everyday, than most protestants hear in Church in a month of Sundays (I know this from personal experience and complaints from protestant friends.)

However, your protestant predecessors have thrown out: the Sign of the Cross, the Crucifix, Latin prayers, the Mass, Icons, the books of the Apocrypha, prayers to the saints, the writings of the Early Church Fathers, the list is endless - all of that thrown away.

I believe to be protestant is to be dead to history; since everything that was thrown out was also history - your history.

The protestants have a shell of a faith left over - it is no wonder they love the Bible - it is the only thing they have.

For The Greater Glory of God

[metmom]

For the greater glory of God would be acknowledging HIS work in providing Scripture and preserving it.

Not taking credit for the Catholic church doing it.

[metmom]

So today, I make and say The Sign of The Cross, repeat the Nicean Creed, sing the Sanctus, hold a Crucifix, gaze upon pictures of icons that are still today in the catacombs in Rome - all whose origins are from the 1st Century AD.

And that is taught where in Scripture?

[LurkingSince'98]

“taught where in Scripture?”

I didn’t say Scripture I said HISTORY.

I believe to be protestant like yourself is to be dead to history; since everything that was thrown out was also history - YOUR history.

AMDG

[LurkingSince'98]

actually it is YOU who are not giving credit to the Catholic Church:

.....which holds the original complete works, and oldest fragment of works of the books of the bible.

.....who voted on the Canon of the Bible and who accepted the very books you read and rejected the ones you don’t.

.....who translated the bible from the original Greek and Aramaic texts into Latin via St Jerome.

.....who copied and recopied the bibles BY HAND through the dark ages.

.....who printed the Bible (Gutenberg was a Catholic); but, probably unknown to you, that there had already been three or four printed versions of the Latin/German bible PRIOR to Gutenberg.

.....whose first six Popes were martyred for their faith.

.....whose Councils defended early Christians against all heresies, which they did in writing and for which there is a printed record.

.....whose Crusaders shed their blood at Tours so Spain and Europe did not become Islamist.

The Holy Spirit handed down the Scripture and the Catholic Church preserved and defended it.

Again to be protestant is to be ignorant of History.

Ad Majoram Dei Gloriam

[metmom]

actually it is YOU who are not giving credit to the Catholic Church:

Dang straight I'm not!

[metmom]

Hey! What happened to the title of this thread?

It’s been changed.

It was “The Bible & the Church” and now it says “church_me”.......

[Admin Moderator]

In the Religion Forum, when ever a poster posts something not in English, the rule is that it has to be translated.

Please translate the non-English phrase in post #5 and any other time you use a foreign language do the same.

[Salvation]

Pope says its “absurd to love Christ without the Church, to listen to Christ but not the Church"
Why Do Non-Catholics Want So Desperately for the Catholic Church to Change Its Teachings?
Catholicism For Protestants
History of the Catholic Church: From the Apostolic Age to the Third Millennium
The Adventure of Disruption

In Defense of the Papacy: 9 Reasons True Christians Follow the Pope
The Four Pillars of the Christian Life
Fragments of Catholic Truth: Yes to Christ, No to the Church?
The Uniqueness of Christianity: 12 Objections Answered
The Church – The Bride of Christ
Catholic Identity Once Again
Essays for Lent: The Church
Woe to the Solitary Man – A Brief Meditation on our Need for the Church
Jesus and His Church Are One
How Old Is Your Church?

[LurkingSince'98]

“Dang straight I’m not!”

my point exactly because you are ignorant of the facts I presented, ignorant of Church history.

The saddest part is that it is your history too and you just don’t get it.

AMDG

[metmom]

I don’t believe the revisionist church history the Catholic church posits as it tries to retroactively claim all sorts of things for itself, things that happened hundreds of years before the Catholic church existed.

I am well aware of what the Catholic church claims for itself. I just don’t believe it because I don’t find any support for it in Scripture.

[LurkingSince'98]

Dear Admin Moderator

I have posted

Ad Majoram Dei Gloriam

OR

AMDG

OR

For the Greater Glory of God

Every single time I have posted several hundred times

It is my signoff

Ad Majoram Dei Gloriam

[AppyPappy]

I don’t know what that means but I’d like to be the first to say I am offended by it.

If that’s OK.

[LurkingSince'98]

“I don’t find any support for it in Scripture.”

Again it proves my point that you are ignorant of History since all of the item I listed happened in the time AFTER Scriptures were written,i.e. post Scriptural history.

You are representative of the vast majority of protestants who know little or nothing of the history of THEIR own faith.

ADMG

[metmom]

Again it proves my point that you are ignorant of History since all of the item I listed happened in the time AFTER Scriptures were written,i.e. post Scriptural history.

Which proves my point that it's not found in Scripture, therefore is not important.