And your Scriptural authority for this proposal is found where?
FReegards!
Posted on 12/17/2012 7:10:15 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
A vacancy occurs within a church (as in the pastoral position), and let's say an interim pastor steps in for a certain amount of time until a replacement pastor is voted in.
Let's say 4-5/6 licensed/ordained ministers within that denomination apply for the open position and thus for a chance to preach before the church - and the church members who will later hear those ministers will pray about which one they desire to be their pastor and eventually vote one in.
Should the board get to toss any of those names from consideration, if those licensed/ordained ministers are in good standing with their denomination?
Is not the board, in effect, indirectly choosing which pastor the people will decide on to be their pastor if they can toss the names of those ministers (for example) they think that perhaps they can't or won't be able to control once that minister is voted in?
And where in the Bible is there one scripture where the church board is to have authority beyond advising the pastor, much less having the ability to have a vote during board meetings - one vote each with the pastor having one vote?
Suppose the first 12 are dillheads and #13 was the right one.
No, you review all the applications that arrived within the prescribed time limit.
Of course search boards can make mistakes, they are human. As much as I don’t want a Yes-man to the Board, I don’t want a dictator as pastor either.
Had one...never will again. The Church Board finally booted his behind...and it wouldn’t have happened if the search committee had done their job, checked his references, and not given in to an impatience congegation damanding a pastor NOW.
Nowhere in scripture do we find a man heading a church called a pastor. Nowhere.
When the singular word “shepherd” or “pastor” is used in the New Testament, it always and only refers to the Lord Jesus Christ, never any other man. I Peter 5:4 for example, John 10:11, “I am the good shepherd.” And more. Only once in all scripture do we find the phrase, “My pastor....” Psalm 23.
The only time the noun pastor/shepherd is used in the New Testament, it is not singular, but plural. Ephesians 4:11
However, the verb form of the Greek word “poimen” is used as the charge, function, or responsibility of the elders (plural) or overseers (plural). E.g. I Peter 5:1,2 and others.
In my church (of about 150), the board is up for vote each year. By electing the person we are entrusting our major church desicisions to them. If we don’t think they can make those decisions, we don’t elect them. I’d imagine that the board would be open to suggestions on what pastor to look into. I would also assume that they are praying about the decision and will make a Godly decision pertaining to the search. If they don’t, there are bigger problems than electing a pastor.
As Simon Birch said, “what does this have to do with God?” There are much more important issues, such as the color of the carpet or whether to use oyster crackers or Panerra bread for communion. Leave it to Christians to take a simple administrative issue and elevate it to a crisis of faith.
As Simon Birch said, “what does this have to do with God?” There are much more important issues, such as the color of the carpet or whether to use oyster crackers or Panerra bread for communion. Leave it to Christians to take a simple administrative issue and elevate it to a crisis of faith.
I am on a church board, not always a fan of that, however, the board should be closer to the congregation, and I will take a church board over a Jim Jones type minister. The board system has probably evolved from our type of government. I agree with your comments. You have seen the examples too of churches that could not root out a minister that had gone bad.
It depends entirely on the rules of the particular denomination in which this happens.
There are no step-by-step instructions in the bible dictating how a church goes about picking a new pastor.
If that church/denomination has rules, then they should abide by them. If they don’t have rules, then they are in the unenviable position of flying by the seat of their pants.
The individual members get to vote with their feet or their pocketbooks. If they don’t like the decision, then they withhold their money or they go elsewhere. That generally gets their message across if enough band together in such ways to voice their displeasure.
“Leave it to Christians to take a simple administrative issue and elevate it to a crisis of faith.”
The board hires the Pastor and if he oversteps his bounds or begins to preach sermons which are not up to Biblical standards they can him. It also eliminates the personal ownership of a church by a Pastor, which can go bad quickly.
I will add that pastors are not known for their business acumen and the board provides this service as well.
My own Pastor is an employee of the church as well as a member and it has worked well for us over the years. It is, by the way, a Mega church.
Of course! To do otherwise would be as silly as not letting our parties’ power brokers select our presidential candidates for us!
Sorta like how the poltical parties used to pick a president?
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1 Timothy 5:17ff is a good place to begin.
Paul is writing to his young protege Timothy regarding the care and the governance of the local expression of the Body of Christ...
He speaks of the (qualified) elders (plural)...
.... that rule...
.... transliterated as (those who) direct the affairs of the church...
In the context of the honor (respect /compensation) these men deserve for the commitment of their time and talents.
Of special note are especially those who labor in preaching and teaching....
... connoting that the preachers/teachers are found among the (qualified) elders of the church.
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Acts 14:23
... the first elders were appointed by the apostolic team with prayer and fasting....
Ephesians 4:11ff
.... tells us about the five ministerial effects/offices that Christ has given to lead, teach strengthen, govern His church...
...and Titus 1:5
....might also give you some insight...
Hope this helps.
You should find it in the bylaws/rules of your particular denomination, not in scripture.
I do agree with the last several posts: many denominations (mine in Presbyterian Church in America) have established procedures, which I’ll outline in a sec.
The reason there is a deacon board (elders, in the case of the PCA) is to have a group charged with insuring the integrity of how the Word of God is taught within the congregation - both in the pulpit and in individual ‘sunday school’ or Bible study teaching situations.
These men are chosen based on their experience, training, personal integrity, testimony (Biblical principles from James) to assume this role. In many congregations they would adjudicate the pastoral decision.
In my PCA experience (both as a deacon and pastoral search committee member), the search committee was in charge of the entire process of conducting the search, collecting personal data from applicants, contacting men for interviews, performing background checks, etc. Once we settled on a choice, we then notified the Elders (the ‘board’, I presume, in your writeup) to conduct a more detailed interview based on their requirements.
Even after that, we weren’t done: the regional Presbytery had to have a say in interviewing the candidate and performing an examination before their acceptance of him as a member of the Presbytery.
At each step in the process, something could have come up that would have derailed the candidate. In my experience, we did indeed prevail, and the candidate was hired.
The goals of the PCA’s process are to insure that the teaching each pastor will provide are consistent with the scriptural worldview of the PCA in general - that no heresies will be cropping up. We are very careful about that - starting from the seminaries and throughout the pastor-selection and retention process. We do believe that it is a Biblical-based procedure, adhering to the demands of the scriptures that Paul wrote about in several places, plus the government organization of the church (the apostles being our Elders; the deacons being those in charge of service). For convenience, the PCA added additional layers (General Assy. and regional Presbyteries) that provide checks and balances on the local churches as well.
Now - that’s OUR method. I have seen/heard of other methods. I also know of ugly church splits that have occurred over the hiring of new pastors, the firing of old ones (that’s most difficult, because the church membership is often shielded from the details of ‘why’).
It is certainly possible that your Board decided that they wanted to do the initial culling of candidates to remove those who clearly would not work out for your church’s situation. Sure, it COULD be a ‘control’ issue - but not necessarily (I’ve actually known of a church that hand-picked a guy because he was the ‘good old boy’ that the board knew and wanted - and that decision caused a split. But it is also possible that they opted to reduce the work (and if a search committee does it right, there’s a bunch of work to do) by rejecting those who clearly could not pass muster [my own committee did so for at least half the applicants].
Sorry so long - there ARE some Biblical principles to follow in terms of the character of the man; not so much on the procedure of selection, but the terms ‘examination’ and ‘reputation’ are good themes to go by. How this is implemented is left to local governance.
And your Scriptural authority for this proposal is found where?
FReegards!
What say you?
What polity?
Is this a board of elders? If so, I'd say, yes, it's part of their job.
It isn’t that hard Mom.
If the Church doesn’t get donations pretty soon they get the message.
Oh, okay, I get it.
It’s Monday...sometimes the brain cells are still asleep...
Yes, and yes, it's one of their job duties. Why would a church want an uncontrollable pastor or desire to vote on a pastor that would oppose their board of elders?
“They received over 200 applications.
If everyone one of those have a trial sermon, and was reviewed by the Congregation it would take over 4 years.”
That one is easy. Just set up a good old fashion tent revival that lasts two weeks and let all of them take a turn every night till they have all spoken.
I know some of these protestant tent revivals in WV can have a min. of three preachers easy. Go for broke and try 5 or 7 a night.
Just be sure to offer “Prayer and medication” afterwards :)
bump!!
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