Hatch: Obama camp will 'throw Mormon church' at Romney [opening Ldsism...not throwing tis enough]

Politico ^ | April 4, 2012 | David Catanese

[Colofornian]

FARMINGTON, Utah -- Sen. Orrin Hatch predicted President Obama's campaign team would use Mitt Romney's Mormon faith against him in the general election.

Speaking to a group of GOP delegates at a campaign stop Tuesday, the six-term Republican incumbent warned, "You watch, they're going to throw the Mormon church at him like you can't believe."

Asked to elaborate in an interview later, Hatch fingered campaign adviser David Axelrod and White House aide David Plouffe as the masterminds who would insert the issue into the campaign.

"Let me tell you something. The Obama people have some of the best political consultants in the country and they don't get there because they're always wonderful people. They're very tough. I have respect for them. They're very tough. I've met with Axelrod, he's the best there is in the business. Plouffe, you've got to say he's one of the best. And there is nothing they won't do," Hatch asserted.

Hatch went even as far to say he thought the duo had already played the religion card against the likely GOP nominee, but failed to point to any evidence of it.

On Monday, Romney was confronted by a Ron Paul supporter with a question about whether he agreed with a passage in the Book of Mormon that describes cursing African Americans. Clearly annoyed, Romney answered with a swift "no" and moved on.

SNIP

"You can find some pretty outlandish statements by some of our early leaders that we've all had to live with from time to time..." Hatch told the gathering of delegates in this town about 20 minutes north of Salt Lake City.

SNIP

[Caipirabob]

Hi Gil4, I have a problem with romney as a socialist governor moreso than any issue of faith. We only looked into it because of the possibility he could be the nominee. I was completely disgusted with him long prior to this.

And really, my point isn't with the church's doctrine so much as how it will be used to destroy romney in the election.

It sounds like harsh persecution but my point is that we are going to have to answer for all of this in any argument we make for romney as a candidate. Well, not me. He can take a flying leap for all I care.

I think we are just beginning to see the attacks from this perspective. Did you see the news report that OReilly showed last night? I'll try to find the youtube video so you can see.

My concern is a practical assessment on how this doctrine will be used, in conjunction with obama's fostering of racial tensions, to completely destroy the GOP come fall.

Now on a personal level, my family would be categorized as lamanites by the mormon church. My beautiful kids would be subjected to institutionalized discrimination because of this. For that alone, I'd dismiss ever supporting one politically unless they openly repudiate the doctrine.

I didn't know any of this before. Knowledge worked against them in this case. Imagine what will happened with 150 million democrats being fed liberal propaganda in 30 second sound bytes. Imagine what will happen in cities like Detroit, St Louis and Philidelphia.

[BlueMoose]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/election-2012/team-obama-mitts-romney-mormon-faith-article-1.1056354

The evangelicals and FreeRepublic will carry the water on this.

[Irish Eyes]

........................................First of all...Obama had some Muslim primers as a kid...now prove (don't assume) that Obama is a Muslim......................

Our sheriff is trying to prove this with absolutely no help. Total blackout, It is like he is whispering in the forest.

Yes I will crawl over broken glass whomever is the Republican nominee.

[Gil4]

In post 91, Colofornian had a few descripitons of FR reactions to Romney, and this is the one that probably best described me:

#1 There’s the “laissez-faire” FREEPER approach to Romney’s Mormonism: “I don’t care about Romney’s religion...It doesn’t bother me what Romney’s religion is...it’s his [X, Y, Z] in his track record, etc.”

It sounds like you were there, too, until you started looking into the Mormon teachings. I think I might be heading in the same direction with you.

I still think he’s slightly preferable to Obama, but I would still rather have a floor fight and someone else.

[Caipirabob]

HI Bluemoose, really, there have been some slanderous attacks by the media on mormonism already. There was a segment on OReilly that was worse than any of the direct text that we've quoted here.

And please don't consider quoting the text as an attack. We have to flesh this out here and now. If romney and his team do not work out some defense on this, then he'll be taken apart by obamas media dogs this fall...romney may be mormon, but they are legion.

Hey folks, I found the video here. This was Bill OReilly pointing out a slanderous attack on mormonism - segment at 2:35.

The slander begins - O‘Donnell’s segment on Mormonism, in which he accused Mormonism’s founder Joseph Smith of having 48 wives

At least we are discussing actual text and not Peyton's Place fantasies by media jerks that are more likely based on their own experiences than anyone else.

The second video is even more devastating.

So Bluemoose, I hope this proves what my point is. Obama's media dogs will destroy romney over this. It was active institutionalized discrimination practiced right up to recently in the church. Given the current racial tensions that are being fostered, the GOP leadership flailing about not even trying to consolidate their conservative base and the absolute fiasco of considering a nominee like romney will lead to such a route this fall I can't believe it's really happening.

And no, my "lamanite" family and "tainted seed" still aren't happy about the book of mormon. Nephi, Jacob and Alma sound more like the basis for the democrat's Jim Crowe laws rather than religious text.

Jim Robinson specifically stated concerns for romney purely over his political record. He knew he was unacceptable due to his history of socialist policy. We did what we were supposed to: Research and learn for ourselves and arrive at our own truth as substantiated by the available facts.

Those facts are not just ugly, they are in truth devastating. I never knew this about mormonism and now? *shaking my head*

Supporting romney is like boarding the Titanic AFTER it hits the iceberg. You already know he's going down. The damage the mormon people will take? Who knows? I don't want to see them hurt over this, but they'd better come up with a darn could defense against the attacks that have already started.

[Caipirabob]

Hi Gol4, thanks for the response. I didn't know about any of this until we were compelled to research someone who might be our nominee. It's been an eye-opening experience and the more I've learned, the more shocked I become.

My personal perspective on ethnic/race relations is that we should integrate and acclimate through intermarriage. Others will simply acclimate and the small percentage that won't will eventually disappear as generations pass.

Just one of my big problems with socialist democrats is the intentional division they've created to destroy that natural progression to bring in new groups of people so that they can all experience the American dream. They've succeeded in destroying several generations of people by creating an "entitlement class" that we may never be able to assimilate.

So one day I'm investigating the foundational doctrine of a candidate for the presidency and I find that his church has a doctrine which I find absolutely intolerable integrated into what they consider "Holy Scripture".

I'm still trying to cope with the shock at this point. Thanks for listening to my blathering.

I'm going to give my buddy I was chatting about a call today and ask him to research it so we can discuss it.

[Colofornian]

Excellent post...

[Colofornian]

My personal perspective on ethnic/race relations is that we should integrate and acclimate through intermarriage. Others will simply acclimate and the small percentage that won't will eventually disappear as generations pass. Just one of my big problems with socialist democrats is the intentional division they've created to destroy that natural progression to bring in new groups of people so that they can all experience the American dream

There's both a dishonorable diversity -- a dishonorable multi-culturalism -- which the liberals emphasize...[After all, the very Latin undergirding the word "diversity" is apart]

And then there's an honorable -- and glorious -- Biblical integration of that diversity and multi-culturalism: The glory and honor of the nations will be brought into it. (Revelation 21:26)

The "it" referenced in Rev. 21 is heaven.

[Caipirabob]

I just spoke with my pal and he's going to start reading. I gave him the article you posted to me as an initial reference and asked him to read the BOM and make his own determination of context.

We'll hear something over the weekend if not today. I will post it here.

This guy is a genius, seriously. If anyone can dissect facts and formulate a specific assessment of a situation, he can. He'll let me know if I'm overreacting or not.

This will also be good information anyone who supports romney and wants to get an idea about the reception they'll get when the media begins it's assault in earnest.

[Elsie]

HI Bluemoose, really, there have been some slanderous attacks by the media on mormonism already.

I just HATE when that happens!!!

---

---

Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).

Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).

 

 

 

Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).

 

 

 

Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).

 

 

 

Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses

, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).

 

 

President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).

 

 

 

James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).

 

 

 

President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).

 

 

 

More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).

 

 

 

President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).

 

 

President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

[Elsie]

sus IS our very righteousness (1 Corinthians 1:30)...our very redemption!

MORMONs!!!!

The REAL Jesus still offers SALVATION!

You SLC folks are DAMNED!!!

---

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned;

and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given,

and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

[Elsie]

sus IS our very righteousness (1 Corinthians 1:30)...our very redemption!

MORMONs!!!!

The REAL Jesus still offers SALVATION!

You SLC folks are DAMNED!!!

---

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned;

and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given,

and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned.

Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

[Lazamataz]

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned; and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given, and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned. Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855)

Whatever religion this is, I'm converting.

[Caipirabob]

HI Bluemoose, really, there have been some slanderous attacks by the media on mormonism already.

Well, I mean that there's a difference between the discussion of the text of the doctrine as expressed in the BOM and the democrat propaganda that the media spews.

The real debate on theological differences is not the same as the mouth-frothing hysterical attacks by the media such as in the link with the two videos above.

As we know, the rats won't let facts get in their way.

Meanwhile, we have very real concerns that need to be discussed and addressed.

Anyway...I'll post my buddies response when he's done his research. Then we'll have at least an honest assessment of how this stuff will be received when it becomes the 24/7 focus by the media.

This will be a true taste of what is to come in the fall.

[magritte]

The Mormon Afterlife Plan sure offers a lot of perks...extra wives, become gods, have their own planets....probably their own espresso machines since that skipped caffeine on Earth...pretty sweet deal..

[Gil4]

“My personal perspective on ethnic/race relations is that we should integrate and acclimate through intermarriage. Others will simply acclimate and the small percentage that won't will eventually disappear as generations pass.”

My perspective is from Acts 17:26 - “from one blood He has made all the nations.” There is one race - the human race. All of the so-called races are just artificial distinctions based on differences in appearances that are caused by minuscule genetic variations. Changes in the amount of pigmentation in a certain layer of the skin are foolish things to get worked up about. It's even the same pigment, just different amounts - in simplistic terms, we're all different shades of the same color. We are descendents of Adam and Eve (and Noah and his family), so we are all related.

“And no, my “lamanite” family and “tainted seed” still aren't happy about the book of mormon.”

I'm not sure exactly what a “lamanite” is, but from the context I'd say it's a fictional term from the rantings of a racist nutcase. (Maybe ol’ Joe just got it wrong in the translation from New Egyptian.)

As for the “tainted seed,” the only comfort I can offer on that is to join you - as descendants of Adam we're all tainted seed, which is why the second Adam, Jesus, had to come.

http://www.gty.org/resources/articles/A335

[Caipirabob]

...probably their own espresso machines

WOOHOO!!! Oh, wait...

[NorthernCrunchyCon]

“Ask yourselves if you would rather have a Mormon or a Muslim as President of the United States.”

What’s the difference? Substantially they’re the same religion, only one is import while the other is domestic. But where the rubber meets the road, Joseph Smith Jr. called himself a modern day Mohamed, America’s first large-scale act of domestic terrorism was perpetuated by Mormons (google “Mountain Meadow Massacre” and note the date), and the two religions even hold conferences together:

http://www.uvu.edu/religiousstudies/mormonismandislam/

[Caipirabob]

I had a long talk with my pal today and he said he'd try to call back tonight once he read the initial article and then researched the text and quotes on the net.

I will post what he tells me tonight or tomorrow.

Cheers!

[no dems]

...it is Romney’s election to lose>..

He will, if we are silly enough to nominate him.
______________________________________________________________

“If”??? “If”??? ......... Sad to say, he’s going to be the nominee; no “if” about it.