Journalists urged to allow Mormons to define themselves

Deseret News ^ | December 8, 2011 | Joseph Walker

[Saundra Duffy]

WASHINGTON, D.C. — News reporters and editors from around the country were urged to allow members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to define themselves rather than to exclusively look to sources outside the church for definitions of what it means to be a Mormon or to explain LDS doctrine or history.

"Define us by who we are and by our central beliefs rather than who we are not or by obscure or irrelevant beliefs," Michael R. Otterson, managing director of public affairs for the LDS Church, said during a Thursday morning session of a conference called, "Politics and Religion: Getting it Right in 2012."

--snip--

Otterson identified for the journalists what he considered the five most common stereotypes of members of the LDS Church — that they are not Christian, that they belong to a cult, that they are insular and secretive, that they are weird and that they practice polygamy.

--snip--

Otterson explained that members of the church are troubled when they are described as not Christian "because that suggests we are not followers of Jesus Christ, and Christ's divinity is a foundational belief in our faith."

[Tennessee Nana]

the Holy Ghost ever lives to lead us to a closer relationship with the Father and the Son.
_________________________________________________

Sandy

we have had a discussion on this in the past...

The Holy Ghost does not “ever live”

Cutting and pasting from FARMS/FAIR/Ldsorg just illuminates your ignorance...

you need to go to a Christian bookstore and buy a Bible...

and read it...

there is no verse in the Christian Bible to back up your false and error and wrong comments about the Holy Spirit...

[Vendome]

oh yeah!

forgot.

hey, thank you for help and support with her.

really helped when I needed it.

[Godzilla]

As for Kolob - I don’t think you should make fun of it. I don’t know what you get out of trashing my faith.

Oh really now SD, a bunch of humanoid 'gods' park themselves on some 'planet', hatch up plans, impregnate humans, are fickle on what they want - Oh and our sun receives it's light from this 'kolob' as well. Define that mormons, it is in your scriptures.

[Tennessee Nana]

As for Kolob - I don’t think you should make fun of it.
_____________________________________________

Sandy

youre right...

Its pathetic...

as well as evil and abusive and blasphemy..

for Mormon males to think they are going to have harems of young willing concubines to have fun with...

its no fun for Mormon females to contemplate...

What woman would look forward to such sexual enslavement forever ???

How much better to know one is going to Heaven to spend eternity worshipping the Lamb of God, the LORD Jesus Christ..

[ejonesie22]

[reaganaut]

She isn’t a lawyer. I spent a couple of hours on the Cal Bar site checking all the lawyers after someone mentioned it and there was no match and nothing even close.

Sandy is just simply a run of the mill Mormon and all that implies...

[reaganaut]

I’m glad I could help. I admire you for the care you gave her, it is a lot of work but the greatest joy there is as well.

[MHGinTN]

Ah, sorry. Let me try again.

Deceit is showing out from under the LDS skirt of self righteousness. The quote in post #98 is not ‘taken out of context’. The quoted passage is a clear assertion in the spirit of antichrist, recorded for posterity in the LDS inc JOurnal of Discourses. LDS apologists have chosen to try and deceive readers into thinking that quote is somehow less devilish if read in the context of the utterance. I listed the JD source date and number, why don’t LDS apologists show us how the spirit of antichrist will not be upon the utterance if ‘read in context’? If LDS inc cannot whitewash the assertion so it is not serving the spirit of antichrist then why not renounce the demonic cult into which they’ve tossed your immortal soul?

Will that work?

[Tennessee Nana]

“pecuilar” ???

Yes there definitely is something odd and unwise about rejecting God and His Salvation so freely given...

Jesus means “salvation”

[Religion Moderator]

Yes.

[Colofornian]

Oh really now SD, a bunch of humanoid 'gods' park themselves on some 'planet', hatch up plans, impregnate humans, are FICKLE on what they want - Oh and our sun receives it's light from this 'kolob' as well. Define that mormons, it is in your scriptures.

In light of the Mormon gods' fickleness, our "all things to all men" approach has allowed us to establish an online campus: Flying Inman Campus 4 Continuing Lds Education -- or F.I.C.C.L.E. for short.

We're here to educationally serve you and other Mormons, Saundra!

Merry Christmas!

[reaganaut]

So, that is a NO then.

Proof the LDS don’t understand basic theology. But then again, when you teach that you too will become gods, and thus God must have a physical body, the basic view of God having 3 aspects and not be different people escapes your grasp.

BTW, Peter wasn’t lying, but that does not exclude Christ being God (God incarnate).

AFA, Kolob, you have to admit it is one of the stupider Mormon doctrines. I thought it was dumb when I was LDS.

Re: you bragging about your grandson, that is the saddest thing I think I have ever read. Why on earth would anyone be proud of their grandson learning legalism. Mormons get SOOOOOO caught up in proper KJV English and the right order for prayer (which btw is nowhere near the ‘true order of prayer’ in the Temple Endowment), that they never really pray heartfelt prayers. God doesn’t care if we say ‘thee or thine’, He wants a conversation not heartless words. God didn’t teach your grandson that people who don’t pray the Mormon way don’t know “heavenly Father” - the Mormon cult taught him that.

Again, why do Mormons want to be considered Christians when they brag about a 6 year old saying that someone who doesn’t use the exact same formula doesn’t know God??

Disconnect thy name is Sandra Duffy.

[MHGinTN]

Thanks for the help. *Going for the wet noodle, to take my beating*

[Elsie]

Here’s the deal: I have my faith; you have yours.

You got a TEMPLE RECOMMEND?

That's what you'll need to live forever with this GOD that MORMONism has for you.

[Elsie]

Anyway, you can try to muddy the waters by digging through endless quotes taken out of context from historical writings but the fact remains that Jesus Christ is my personal Savior and the Savior of the world.

... the fact remains that you cannot continue to IGNORE what the leaders of MORMONism teach and expect JS to welcome you into MORMON heaven.

[Elsie]

I love Him and I wish you would stop saying stuff about my Savior that is not true.

 

Mosiah

Chapter 3

 

 

1 Thus the heaven and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2 And on the seventh day I, God, ended my work, and all things which I had made; and I rested on the seventh day from all my work, and all things which I had made were finished, and  I, God, saw that they were good;
3 And I, God, blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it; because that in it I had rested from all my work which  I, God, had created and made.
4 And now, behold,  I say unto you, that these are the generations of the heaven and of the earth, when they were created, in the day that I, the Lord God, made the heaven and the earth,
5 And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew. For I, the Lord God, created all things, of which I have spoken, spiritually, before they were naturally upon the face of the earth. For I, the Lord God, had not caused it to rain upon the face of the earth. And I, the Lord God, had created all the children of men; and not yet a man to till the ground; for in heaven created I them; and there was not yet flesh upon the earth, neither in the water, neither in the air;
6 But I, the Lord God, spake, and there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7 And I, the Lord God, formed man from the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul, the first flesh upon the earth, the first man also; nevertheless, all things were before created; but spiritually were they created and made according to my word.
8 And I, the Lord God, planted a garden eastward in Eden, and there I put the man whom I had formed.
9 And out of the ground made I, the Lord God, to grow every tree, naturally, that is pleasant to the sight of man; and man could behold it. And it became also a living soul. For it was spiritual in the day that I created it; for it remaineth in the sphere in which I, God, created it, yea, even all things which I prepared for the use of man; and man saw that it was good for food. And I, the Lord God, planted the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and also the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
10 And I, the Lord God, caused a river to go out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads.
11 And I, the Lord God, called the name of the first Pison, and it compasseth the whole land of Havilah, where I , the Lord God, created much gold;
12 And the gold of that land was good, and there was bdellium and the onyx stone.
13 And the name of the second river was called Gihon; the same that compasseth the whole land of Ethiopia.
14 And the name of the third river was Hiddekel; that which goeth toward the east of Assyria. And the fourth river was the Euphrates.
15 And I, the Lord God, took the man, and put him into the Garden of Eden, to dress it, and to keep it.
16 And I, the Lord God, commanded the man, saying: Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat,
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it, nevertheless, thou mayest choose for thyself, for it is given unto thee; but, remember that I forbid it, for in the day thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
18 And I, the Lord God, said unto mine Only Begotten, that it was not good that the man should be alone; wherefore,  I will make an help meet for him.
19 And out of the ground I, the Lord God, formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and commanded that they should come unto Adam, to see what he would call them; and they were also living souls; for I, God, breathed into them the breath of life, and commanded that whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that should be the name thereof.
20 And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but as for Adam, there was not found an help meet for him.
21 And I, the Lord God, caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam; and he slept, and I took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh in the stead thereof;
22 And the rib which I, the Lord God, had taken from man, made I a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23 And Adam said: This I know now is bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of man.
24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife; and they shall be done flesh.
25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

 

[Elsie]

The Trinity is a man-made concept.

MORMON Temple Rituals are man-made, as they are NOT found in ANY MORMON 'scripture'.

YOU 'deal with it'!

[Elsie]

Would you please stop spreading falsehoods about my Savior. Thank you and Merry Christmas.

The First Book of Nephi

Chapter 8

Lehi sees a vision of the tree of life—He partakes of its fruit and desires his family to do likewise—He sees a rod of iron, a strait and narrow path, and the mists of darkness that enshroud men—Sariah, Nephi, and Sam partake of the fruit, but Laman and Lemuel refuse. About 600–592 B.C.

 1 And it came to pass that we had gathered together all manner of ^aseeds of every kind, both of grain of every kind, and also of the seeds of fruit of every kind.

 2 And it came to pass that while my father tarried in the wilderness he spake unto us, saying: Behold, I have ^adreamed a dream; or, in other words, I have ^bseen a ^cvision.

 3 And behold, because of the thing which I have seen, I have reason to rejoice in the Lord because of ^aNephi and also of Sam; for I have reason to suppose that they, and also many of their seed, will be saved.

 4 But behold, ^aLaman and Lemuel, I fear exceedingly because of you; for behold, methought I saw in my dream, a dark and dreary wilderness.

 5 And it came to pass that I saw a ^aman, and he was dressed in a white ^brobe; and he came and stood before me.

 6 And it came to pass that he spake unto me, and bade me follow him.

 7 And it came to pass that as I followed him I beheld myself that I was in a dark and dreary waste.

 8 And after I had traveled for the space of many hours in darkness, I began to pray unto the Lord that he would have ^amercy on me, according to the multitude of his tender mercies.

 9 And it came to pass after I had prayed unto the Lord I beheld a large and spacious ^afield.

 10 And it came to pass that I beheld a ^atree, whose ^bfruit was desirable to make one ^chappy.

 11 And it came to pass that I did go forth and partake of the ^afruit thereof; and I beheld that it was most sweet, above all that I ever before tasted. Yea, and I beheld that the fruit thereof was white, to exceed all the ^bwhiteness that I had ever seen.

 12 And as I partook of the fruit thereof it filled my soul with exceedingly great ^ajoy; wherefore, I began to be ^bdesirous that my family should partake of it also; for I knew that it was ^cdesirable above all other fruit.

 13 And as I cast my eyes round about, that perhaps I might discover my family also, I beheld a ^ariver of water; and it ran along, and it was near the tree of which I was partaking the fruit.

 14 And I looked to behold from whence it came; and I saw the head thereof a little way off; and at the head thereof I beheld your mother Sariah, and Sam, and ^aNephi; and they stood as if they knew not whither they should go.

 15 And it came to pass that I beckoned unto them; and I also did say unto them with a loud voice that they should come unto me, and partake of the fruit, which was desirable above all other fruit.

 16 And it came to pass that they did come unto me and partake of the fruit also.

 17 And it came to pass that I was desirous that Laman and Lemuel should come and partake of the fruit also; wherefore, I cast mine eyes towards the head of the river, that perhaps I might see them.

 18 And it came to pass that I saw them, but they would ^anot come unto me and partake of the fruit.

 19 And I beheld a ^arod of iron, and it extended along the bank of the river, and led to the tree by which I stood.

 20 And I also beheld a ^astrait and narrow path, which came along by the rod of iron, even to the tree by which I stood; and it also led by the head of the fountain, unto a large and spacious field, as if it had been a ^bworld.

 21 And I saw numberless concourses of people, many of whom were ^apressing forward, that they might obtain the ^bpath which led unto the tree by which I stood.

 22 And it came to pass that they did come forth, and commence in the path which led to the tree.

 23 And it came to pass that there arose a ^amist of darkness; yea, even an exceedingly great mist of darkness, insomuch that they who had commenced in the path did lose their way, that they wandered off and were ^blost.

 24 And it came to pass that I beheld others pressing forward, and they came forth and caught hold of the end of the rod of iron; and they did press forward through the mist of darkness, ^aclinging to the rod of iron, even until they did come forth and partake of the ^bfruit of the tree.

 25 And after they had partaken of the fruit of the tree they did cast their eyes about as if they were ^aashamed.

 26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the ^aother side of the river of water, a great and ^bspacious building; and it stood as it were in the ^cair, high above the earth.

 27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the ^aattitude of ^bmocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

 28 And after they had ^atasted of the fruit they were ^bashamed, because of those that were ^cscoffing at them; and they ^dfell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

 29 And now I, Nephi, do not speak ^aall the words of my father.

 30 But, to be short in writing, behold, he saw other multitudes pressing forward; and they came and caught hold of the end of the ^arod of iron; and they did press their way forward, continually holding fast to the rod of iron, until they came forth and fell down and partook of the fruit of the tree.

 31 And he also saw other ^amultitudes feeling their way towards that great and spacious building.

 32 And it came to pass that many were drowned in the ^adepths of the ^bfountain; and many were lost from his view, wandering in strange roads.

 33 And great was the multitude that did enter into that strange building. And after they did enter into that building they did point the finger of ^ascorn at me and those that were partaking of the fruit also; but we heeded them not.

 34 These are the words of my father: For as many as ^aheeded them, had fallen away.

 35 And ^aLaman and Lemuel partook not of the fruit, said my father.

 36 And it came to pass after my father had spoken all the words of his dream or vision, which were many, he said unto us, because of these things which he saw in a vision, he exceedingly feared for Laman and Lemuel; yea, he feared lest they should be cast off from the presence of the Lord.

 37 And he did ^aexhort them then with all the feeling of a tender parent, that they would hearken to his words, that perhaps the Lord would be merciful to them, and not cast them off; yea, my father did preach unto them.

 38 And after he had preached unto them, and also prophesied unto them of many things, he bade them to keep the commandments of the Lord; and he did cease speaking unto them.

---

The Official Scriptures of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © 2006 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. Rights and use information. Privacy policy.

[Elsie]

Repeat: “Christ’s divinity is a foundational belief in our faith.”

If you were a CHRISTIAN; you'd say...

“Christ’s divinity is THE foundational belief in our faith.”

[Elsie]

In so doing I notice you avoid my question.

So does EVERYONE!