Posted on 10/29/2011 3:31:02 PM PDT by RnMomof7
So in short, belief or non-belief in Purgatory has zero effect on electedness and ergo in salvation.Logic is an unfair tool to use Larry. For shame!
Lies told by bigots are still lies.
My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.
For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,
For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with His arm:
He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
He has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree.
He has filled the hungry with good things;
and the rich He has sent empty away.
He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;
As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.
Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen
Magníficat ánima mea Dóminum,
et exsultávit spíritus meus
in Deo salvatóre meo,
quia respéxit humilitátem
ancíllæ suæ.
Ecce enim ex hoc beátam
me dicent omnes generatiónes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericórdia eius in progénies
et progénies timéntibus eum.
Fecit poténtiam in bráchio suo,
dispérsit supérbos mente cordis sui;
depósuit poténtes de sede
et exaltávit húmiles.
Esuriéntes implévit bonis
et dívites dimísit inánes.
Suscépit Ísrael púerum suum,
recordátus misericórdiæ,
sicut locútus est ad patres nostros,
Ábraham et sémini eius in sæcula.
Glória Patri et Fílio
et Spirítui Sancto.
Sicut erat in princípio,
et nunc et semper,
et in sæcula sæculórum.
Amen.
She became the Mother of God, in which work so many and such great good things are bestowed on her as pass man’s understanding. For on this there follows all honor, all blessedness, and her unique place in the whole of mankind, among which she has no equal, namely, that she had a child by the Father in heaven, and such a Child . . . Hence men have crowded all her glory into a single word, calling her the Mother of God . . . None can say of her nor announce to her greater things, even though he had as many tongues as the earth possesses flowers and blades of grass: the sky, stars; and the sea, grains of sand. It needs to be pondered in the heart what it means to be the Mother of God.
(Commentary on the Magnificat, 1521; in Luther’s Works, Pelikan et al, vol. 21, 326)
Context context context nares... this is a scripture that is addressing MINISTRIES.. not sin
Your other scriptures are also out of context and have not one thing to do with man purging his sin in Purgatory ..Catholics are clueless about reading scripture.. proof texting fire does not doctrine make
Nothing to do with Purgatory...
So tell me where the Catholic Church states that Purgatory is either a time or a place. The Catechism refers to it as a "state".
Lies told by bigots are still lies.
Here is Rashi's commentary on Deuteronomy 4:24:
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
(24) A JEALOUS GOD. jealous to take vengeance,
Shabbat Shalom
...................
glowing in his anger to exact punishment
from those who worship idols;
cf Rashi on (Num:25:11):(re: PHINEAS)
Six words, but in them is a great part of the difference between Catholics and those who oppose them:
To obey God is perfect freedom.
Six words, but in them is a great part of the difference between Catholics and those who oppose them:
To obey God is perfect freedom.
It makes no difference. As Jesus said, “TODAY”. A place, a state makes no difference as I see it, it’s just not biblical, not in the least.
Now that being said, I fully believe my RC friends and relations are brothers and sisters in Christ. They fully believe and trust that Christ died for their sins and that’s an end to it, we’ll have a grand argument in the afterlife won’t we...oh wait, we’ll know for sure then, but some of us will be red faced..hope it’s not me, but I’ll be glad to be there along with you.
Nope as that would be going through man. The only way too salvation is solely through Christ and Christ alone. Even Peter state this in Acts Ch 4
8Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, “Leaders and elders of our nation, 9are we being questioned because we’ve done a good deed for a crippled man? Do you want to know how he was healed? 10Let me clearly state to you and to all the people of Israel that he was healed in the name and power of Jesus Christ from Nazareth, the man you crucified, but whom God raised from the dead. 11For Jesus is the one referred to in the Scriptures, where it says, ‘The stone that you builders rejected has now become the cornerstone.’£ 12There is salvation in no one else! There is no other name in all of heaven for people to call on to save them.”
It would seem to me that would include any named church as well. No church not one will take you too heaven. His Name, His Blood, His Grace by the will of GOD given us, = Our Salvation and our eternal healing by the same. Christ paid our sins in full. Only in him are we made perfect. No deed we can do, no acts we can endure will remove even a spec or make us more pure. We are forgiven sinners righteous before GOD only through the cleansing Blood Of The lamb or we are going to hell either/or.
The thought so nice he said it twice!
Some Catholic reading on the subject.
http://www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory_qa.html
Since only those saved by the cross of Christ even GET to purgatory, this argument is complete and utter nonsense.
Belief in purgatory would even seem to grieve The concept of Purgatory denies the
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
substitutionary death and resurrection
of Yah'shua to cover all sins for mankind.
the Ru'ach HaKodesh. ( Eph 4:30)
The concept of Purgatory denies the substitutionary death and resurrection of Yah'shua to cover all sins for mankind.Nope.
Our Protestant brothers and sisters seem to have a lot of difficulties with abstract concepts. It seems like in many of these discussions Catholics are discussion the beauty of sunsets and rainbows with the color blind.
Let's take the bone that seems to be sticking in their craw on this thread, "Purgatory". The concept of purgation as a means of internal cleansing the was well established within the Mediterranean cultures. "Purgatory" quite simple means a place where "purgation" or purification takes place. Theological or spiritual cleansing may be foreign to some, but it was a common theme in both the Old and New Testaments.
In the ancient Roman and Mediterranean cultures purgation, or a purification, was a very common practice in food preparation (snails, titmice, etc.) in which the contents of the digestive tract was cleansed prior to cooking and eating for obvious reasons. Similarly, purgation was a common treatment for many illnesses. Anyone who has had a child with their stomach pumped knows it is still a valid medical practice. Purgation was a long held practice for funerary purgation throughout the ancient world and even today modern embalming uses similar practices. The purgation of criminals was even commonly attempted with sulfur and onions.
So, to a Catholic, like first or second century Christian, the concept of purgatory is not alien or foreign and is actually well grounded and understood.
Yah'shua speaking :shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiachMat 12:31 "Therefore I say to you,The concept of purgatory seems to blasphemes the Holy Spirit.
any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people,
but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven.
See 78
Really? Like you have some odd, special authority? Sorry, I will just gently pass on your odd views of God and faith.
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