Posted on 10/29/2011 3:31:02 PM PDT by RnMomof7
Catholics who believe a purifying fire will purge away their sins are deluded victims of a fatal fabrication. The invention of a place for purification of sins called Purgatory is one of the most seductive attractions of the Roman Catholic religion. Pastor John MacArthur of Grace Community Church described this deceptive hoax brilliantly. He said: "Purgatory is what makes the whole system work. Take out Purgatory and it's a hard sell to be a Catholic. Purgatory is the safety net, when you die, you don't go to hell. You go [to Purgatory] and get things sorted out and finally get to heaven if you've been a good Catholic. In the Catholic system you can never know you're going to heaven. You just keep trying and trying...in a long journey toward perfection. Well, it's pretty discouraging. People in that system are guilt-ridden, fear-ridden and have no knowledge of whether or not they're going to get into the Kingdom. If there's no Purgatory, there's no safety net to catch me and give me some opportunity to get into heaven. It's a second chance, it's another chance after death" (from "The Pope and the Papacy").
The Origin of Purgatory
There was no mention of Purgatory during the first two centuries of the church. However, when Roman Emperor Theodosius (379-395) decreed that Christianity was to be the official religion of the empire, thousands of pagans flooded into the Church and brought their pagan beliefs and traditions with them. One of those ancient pagan beliefs was a place of purification where souls went to make satisfaction for their sins.
The concept became much more widespread around 600 A.D. due to the fanaticism of Pope Gregory the Great. He developed the doctrine through visions and revelations of a Purgatorial fire. According to the Catholic Encyclopedia (CE), Pope Gregory said Catholics "will expiate their faults by purgatorial flames," and "the pain [is] more intolerable than any one can suffer in this life." Centuries later, at the Council of Florence (1431), it was pronounced an infallible dogma. It was later reaffirmed by the Council of Trent (1564). The dogma is based largely on Catholic tradition from extra- biblical writings and oral history. "So deep was this belief ingrained in our common humanity that it was accepted by the Jews, and in at least a shadowy way by the pagans, long before the coming of Christianity" (CE). It seems incomprehensible that Rome would admit to using a pagan tradition for the defense of one of its most esteemed "Christian" doctrines.
The Deception of Purgatory
Purgatory comes from the Latin word “purgare,” which means to make clean or to purify. The Catholic Encyclopedia defines purgatory as "a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God’s grace, are not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions." They must be purified of these "venial" sins before they can be allowed into heaven. Here we see Catholicism perpetuating the seductive lie of Satan by declaring "you will not surely die" when you commit venial sins (Gen. 3:4). The Council of Trent dares to declare that "God does not always remit the whole punishment due to sin together with the guilt. God requires satisfaction and will punish sin...The sinner, failing to do penance in this life, may be punished in another world, and so not be cast off eternally from God." (Session 15, Can. XI). Those Catholic Bishops had the audacity to declare that the suffering and death of God's perfect man and man's perfect substitute was not sufficient to satisfy divine justice for sin.
The Motivation for Purgatory
Over the centuries billions of dollars have been paid to Roman Catholic priests to obtain relief from imaginary sufferings in Purgatory's fire. The Catholic clergy has always taught that the period of suffering in Purgatory can be shortened by purchasing indulgences and novenas, buying Mass cards and providing gifts of money. When a Catholic dies, money is extracted from mourning loved ones to shorten the deceased's punishment in Purgatory. When my dear old dad passed away as a devout Catholic of 79 years, I was amazed at the hundreds of Mass cards purchased for him by well-meaning friends. We have heard of other Catholics who have willed their entire estates to their religion so that perpetual masses could be offered for them after they die. It is no wonder that the Catholic religion has become the richest institution in the world. The buying and selling of God's grace has been a very lucrative business for the Vatican.
Another motivation for Rome to fabricate the heretical doctrine of Purgatory is its powerful effect on controlling people. Ultimately, the enslavement and subjugation of people is the goal of every false religion, and Purgatory does exactly that. The concept of a terrifying prison with a purging fire, governed by religious leaders, is a most brilliant invention. It holds people captive, not only in this life but also in the next life. Catholic clergy will not say how many years people have to suffer for their sins or how many Masses must be purchased before they can be released from the flames. This dreadful fear and uncertainty is the most ruthless form of religious bondage and deception!
Another motivation for Rome to fabricate the heretical doctrine of Purgatory is its powerful effect on controlling people. Ultimately, the enslavement and subjugation of people is the goal of every false religion, and Purgatory does exactly that. The concept of a terrifying prison with a purging fire, governed by religious leaders, is a most brilliant invention. It holds people captive, not only in this life but also in the next life. Catholic clergy will not say how many years people have to suffer for their sins or how many Masses must be purchased before they can be released from the flames. This dreadful fear and uncertainty is the most ruthless form of religious bondage and deception!
Another motivation for Rome to fabricate the heretical doctrine of Purgatory is its powerful effect on controlling people. Ultimately, the enslavement and subjugation of people is the goal of every false religion, and Purgatory does exactly that. The concept of a terrifying prison with a purging fire, governed by religious leaders, is a most brilliant invention. It holds people captive, not only in this life but also in the next life. Catholic clergy will not say how many years people have to suffer for their sins or how many Masses must be purchased before they can be released from the flames. This dreadful fear and uncertainty is the most ruthless form of religious bondage and deception!
Biblical Support for Purgatory
There is absolutely none! In fact, neither the word nor the concept of sin-purifying fire is found in Scripture. The Vatican was confronted with this in the 16th century when the Reformers protested its practice of buying and selling of God's grace through indulgences. Backed into a corner, the Council of Trent added the apocryphal books to its canon of Scripture. Rome now declares there is scriptural support for purgatory in the apocryphal book of Second Maccabees. The council ignored the fact that the Jewish scribes never recognized the apocryphal books as inspired or part of the Hebrew Scriptures. They were never included because of their many historical, theological and geographical errors. Since God is not the author of error, He obviously did not inspire the writers of the Apocrypha. This is why the Apocrypha was never included in the original canon of 66 books. ..........."
The Biblical Rebuke of Purgatory
God's Word leaves absolutely no possibility for sin to be purged away by anything other than the blood of Jesus Christ. The beloved apostle John penned these words with irrefutable clarity. He wrote, "The blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin" and "all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:7, 9). John did not say "some" sins or "most" sins, but all sin! This soundly rebukes the need for a sin-purging fire. God's Word also declares, "All things are cleansed with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no forgiveness" (Heb. 9:22). When Jesus "made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high" (Heb. 1:3). Those who desire to have their sins purged need to trust a person, not a place. The blood of Christ is the only cleansing agent for sin! Those who come to the cross of Christ must come with empty hands of faith, bringing nothing but their sins.
Every blood-bought believer is instantly present with their Redeemer at the moment of death. To be "absent from the body" is to be "at home with the Lord" (2 Cor. 5:6-8). This good news was affirmed by the Lord Jesus with the promise He gave to the repentant thief at Calvary. He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise" (Luke 23:43). This habitual sinner did not need a fire to purge his sins.
Catholics who believe in Purgatory need to be asked: "Who is in charge of releasing souls from the purging fire?" It cannot be God because of His promise to believers. "Their sins and iniquities I will remember no more" (Heb. 10:17). After conversion, God no longer counts sins against His children (2 Cor. 5:19).
Purgatory is a travesty on the justice of God and a disgraceful fabrication that robs Christ Jesus of His glory and honor. He alone satisfied divine justice, once and for all, by the perfect and finished sacrifice of Himself. The fatal deception of Purgatory blinds Catholics from the glorious Gospel of grace. It is one of Satan's many lies which keep his captives from knowing and trusting the sufficiency of Jesus Christ. It is Christ alone that will present us "faultless before the presence of his glory" (Jude 24).
This just seems to be so,,,anti-bible...
Exactly.. they had a pope that had the position bought for him
Some of the indulgences and sale of relics went to build St Peters..the rest went to the pope for his use...
All right... a few more moments to think (hopefully) and to type.
First of all: forgive me for saying so, but those (including the OP) who are attempting to argue against the Catholic Church (and the doctrine of Purgatory, in particular) have shown some rather... imperfect understanding of the doctrine itself. I don’t think it’s asking too much for critics to *understand* the *actual* doctrine, as the Catholic Church actually teaches it (e.g. one commenter confused it with Limbo, another claimed that it’s a substitute for Hell, and the confusions go from there), before presuming to attack it. Otherwise, they will be fighting a phantom enemy, and they will leave the real doctrine untouched.
Let me summarize, as best I can, the actual doctrine of Purgatory (especially since some of the critics declined to read the long quotes which did a more fulsome job):
Purgatory is the temporary state of being (though some translations may have slight differences in that word) in which those who are saved (i.e. die without being in a state of unrepented mortal sin), if they are still impure in any way (either through any lingering attachment to sin, or due to any temporal punishment which has not yet been satisfied, etc.), are purified... after which they enter Heaven straight-away.
Purgatory is not a substitute for Hell; those who are damned, are damned, and they never see or experience Purgatory at all.
Purgatory is not limbo; the former is a solemn truth of the Catholic Faith whic describes the state of being of those who are saved, but are not yet fully clean, while the second was a mere hypothesis about the fate of those who died in a state of original sin (i.e. unbaptized), but without personal, actual sin.
I won’t even dignify some of the more shallow anti-Catholic canards (e.g. Purgatory = money-making scheme, etc.) with an answer, save to say that such play-ground taunts could easily be turned back on their makers (with equal illogic). E.g. “The Bible is simply a money-making scam used to (a) get $$$ as the best-seller of the world, and (b) get gullible Christians to “tithe” on their income to their pastor/worship-leader/favourite televangelist, etc.” I trust we can keep the discourse above such cheap nonsense as that, what?
I’ll reply to a few of the other posts, in a moment.
In the sacrificial ritual that prefigured Christ the lamb was 'bled out" ..blood was always considered 'unclean ' in the OT...
We know that when the sword was placed in the side of Christ water came out..
So I believe we can be assured 3 hours of bleeding on the cross.. and the scripture telling us that we are saved by the blood shed on that cross indicates there was no blood left in the corpse of Christ.. when he arose on Easter morning... and that the glorified body that rose in the ascension had no need for blood.. His work was finished
Luk 24:39 — Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
..as i finished that sentence I said and get things sorted out and finally get to heaven if you've been a good Catholic.
Sorry if that was confusing ...
Can you tell me what Christ accomplished on the cross?? Were any saved? Or did Christ make heaven a possibility for men again ??
I was quite surprised to see the author didn’t refer to them as Papists ...
Carl,
I’ll reply to your salient points later, if you like; but in the meantime, could you address the earlier (and logically precedent) point of showing me where “sola Scriptura” is taught in the Bible? (This completely side-steps another important point of “how did the Bible get compiled, and how were the Canonical Books selected without error?”, but I’ll set that aside, for the moment.)
Since “sola Scriptura” ultimately reduces itself to saying, “If it isn’t in the Bible, then don’t trust it for matters of salvation”, wouldn’t it be good to know if “sola Scriptura” is, ITSELF, in the Bible? If not, then sola Scriptura would recommend that we not trust sola Scriptura, would it not? That would seem to be a problem...
Ummm and just who DISTRIBUTES these merits??? HUH.???? Hey kiss a relic..say a pray ..send some money to Rome.. ...
The authors of the catechism are mislead and spiritually blind..
Asking again..what was accomplished at the cross? Was anyone saved or did it open up the possibility of man being saved??
An example is found in 2 Timothy 3, 4. Here Paul writes to his younger brother in the faith, Timothy. He writes that Timothy — who was instructed in the faith by his mother and grandmother — has also learned all about Paul’s teaching (3:10). Timothy has been mightily helped by all sorts of oral teaching, some of it apostolic. Yet Paul writes these words to Timothy:
And indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them; and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work. I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires; and will turn away their ears from the truth, and will turn aside to myths. But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry. (2 Timothy 3:12; 4:5)
You see paladinan, Paul reminds Timothy that the Scriptures are able to make him wise unto salvation in Christ Jesus (3:15). He teaches that the Scriptures are useful for teaching, reproof (rebuking), correcting, and training in righteousness (3:16). Because the Scriptures have this character, they thoroughly equip the man of God for every good work (3:17). So Paul tells Timothy that he must preach this Word, even though the time is coming when people will not want to hear it, but rather will want teachers to suit their fancy, or the middle ages church’s pocketbook which is what this doctrine was meant to enhance. Not any religious significance, just a device to make fat monks fatter.
spear, BLOOD and water. Jo 19:34.
blood was always considered 'unclean ' in the OT...
When I wrote "the blood is the life" I was referring to the covenant with Noah, which permitted eating animals but not "the flesh with the blood," which is its life. SO, yes, I kind of knew that blood is treyf.
I never thought that what IHS said in the upper room was meant to be an exhaustive inventory. HE didn't mention teeth and gullet, yet he ate before them.
We're not going to get far on the physiology of the resurrected body, I suspect. He is palpable, has the ability to eat, but not the need. I can see his having blood though not the need for it.
IN any event, I didnot think Cromwell blasphemed when heinvoked the bowels of Christ, I do not think this saints blasphemes when she invokes his blood, especially because such stuff, to me, always seems to be figurative and not literal language.
Ya' know that conversation we were having yesterday regarding NT Scripture and if Paul knew he was writing Scripture (or any of the NT writers,for that matter)? Here's something that I came across as I was studying. It is amazing to me what God shows us at certain times.
"Even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you, as also in ALL HIS EPISTLES, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest [twist], as they do also the OTHER SCRIPTURES, unto their own destruction." 2 Peter3:15,16.
Now, I've read this passage probably a hundred times, but the words I put in bold make one very important point: Peter acknowledges Paul's writing to be Scripture.
The NT canon, exactly like the OT, was accepted and recognized by a consensus of the believers as it was being written, as the testimony of Peter proves.
This time frame was about 66 A.D. "The other Scriptures" Peter speaks of by that time, 66 A.D. would have included most of the remainder of the NT. They must have been readily available and well-known by then, because Peter doesn't even need to name them.
Just thought I would give you something to chew on. Besides an Immodium tablet the size of a plate...:)
So the cross did nothing more than make salvation possible..
False alternatives,owing to an excessively mechanical and legalistic view of theology.
Please tell us what Jesus did on the cross..another poster says the cross "opened the gates of heaven'.. so that man may choose to walk through them.. seeming to say He atoned for original sin..and the rest is up to us.. so what say you?
IF a person is not a true Christian, and rejects the Grace of God without works of the Law, then that person's FINAL FATE is SEALED at the moment of death: Hell.
That is exactly what the Bible teaches. Anything that adds to or removed from these truths in the Bible alone does not teach what Christ Jesus and God the Father desires for us to learn regarding Heaven and Hell and Grace salvation.
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