Who Is a True Jew?

BibleProphecyBlog.com ^ | October 19, 2011 | Dr. Tony Garland

[GiovannaNicoletta]

Q. In the Old Testament, the terms "Israel," "Jacob," and "Jew" all seem to clearly be applied to the grandson of Abraham, the son of Isaac, the man Jacob and his physical descendants (Gen. 32:28; 35:10). But in the New Testament, the terms "Israel" and "Jew" are used in passages which are more difficult to understand which some interpret as teaching that faithful Gentiles are described as "Israel" or "true Jews" (e.g., Rom. 2:28-29; 9:4; Gal. 6:16). Can you shed some light on this?

A. I believe that much of the confusion concerning the use of the term “Israel” in the New Testament - and especially whether it refers to believing Gentiles - can be cleared away by recognizing that although, consistent with its use in the Old Testament, the term always denotes those who are physical descendants of the man Jacob, there are also passages where the writer desires to call attention to a subset from within the physical descendants of Jacob who also share the faith of father Abraham. Here are some principles to consider when reading such passages:

• The unbelieving descendants of Jacob are said to be “not Israel” (e.g., Rom. 9:4) and are described by Jesus as those who “say they are Jews, but are not” (Rev. 2:9; 3:9). In other words, true Israel consists of true Jews who, like Paul, are both physical descendants of Jacob and share the faith of Abraham (Luke 3:8). The unbelieving descendants, by rejecting the faith of their physical father Abraham, are said to have a different father - the devil (John 8:39-44; Rev. 2:9; 3:9).
• Even though unbelieving descendants of Jacob are sometimes referred to as those who “say they are Jews, but are not, but lie” (Rev. 3:9), there are other passages in which the term “Israel” is clearly applied to the same group of unbelieving Jews (e.g., Rom. 9:4,31; 10:1,21; 11:7,25-29). Thus, what is being stressed is that the physical descendants of Jacob who reject the faith of Abraham are not fulfilling their true intended position of being both physical descendants and believers. The New Testament writers are careful, when necessary, to differentiate the entire nation of physical descendants (which includes non-believers) from the elect remnant which believe. [1] While some passages emphasize this truth when making a specific point, we must take care to realize many other passages equally assert that the unbelieving descendants of Jacob are still “Israel” and “Jews.”
• Passages which are distinguishing between a true Jew (of faith) and those who are merely physical descendants but lack faith never refer to Gentiles as “Jews” or “Israel.” The distinction which is being made is between believing descendants of Jacob and unbelieving descendants of Jacob - but in both cases descendants of Jacob. This becomes evident when one is careful to consider the context and logic involved in the passages. For example, “They are not all Israel who are of Israel” (Rom. 9:4). Someone who has formal training in logic will recognize this statement as describing a strict superset/subset relationship. Two groups are involved with one group being strictly contained entirely within the other. The superset are those “who are of Israel” - the physical descendants of the man Jacob. The subset from within that group are those who “are not . . . Israel” - the unbelieving physical descendants of the man Jacob who the Scriptures elsewhere indicate are not true Jews (Rom. 2:28-29; Rev. 2:9; 3:9). A pictorial aid known as a Venn diagram can be helpful here. In this particular case, the diagram will consist of two concentric circles, much like a donut or - more appropriately considering the subject at hand - a bagel! The outer circle of the bagel surrounds everyone born in the physical line of descent from Jacob. The inner circle of the bagel surrounds those who have been born in the physical line of descent from Jacob, but who also believe in Jesus as Messiah. The region between the two, in red, represents “not all Israel” - unbelieving Jews - whereas the region in green represents believing Jews who are elsewhere called “the Israel of God” (Gal. 6:16).

Who Is a True Jew?

A key distinction which must be kept in mind is to notice that the New Testament never refers to Gentile believers as the seed of Isaac or children of Jacob. Instead, “those who are of faith are sons of Abraham” (Gal 3:7-9,29). This is because we Gentiles who believe participate in the unconditional promise which God gave to Abraham, “In you all the families of the earth shall be blessed” (Gen. 12:3 cf. Gal. 3:8). The way in which the Gentiles participate in this promise is through their identification with Abraham’s descendant Jesus, having believed upon Him by faith. Instead of being sons of Isaac or sons of Jacob, our relationship as Gentiles to the New Covenant covenant goes back to its very source in the promises given to Abraham who is called the “father of all those who believe” (Rom. 4:11) - both believing Jews and believing Gentiles (Luke 19:9; Rom. 4:11-18). This is the root of the cultivated olive tree into which believing Gentiles have been grafted and unbelieving Jews have been cut off (Rom. 11:16-18). [2]

After warning the church of Philippi concerning unbelieving Jews, where Paul is emphasizing that true circumcision is of the heart, the most he will say is “we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh”. Thus Paul contrasts spiritual circumcision of the heart by faith with physical circumcision, an external rite which in and of itself does not produce saving faith. If there was ever a passage where Paul could clearly redefine Israel to mean believing Gentiles this is it, yet he does not go that far. Even here, Paul is not really teaching anything new because this theme is strongly taught within the Old Testament (e.g., Deu. 10:16; 30:6; Ps. 119:70; Jer. 4:4; 9:26; Eze. 36:26; 44:7).

• What this means is that the larger circle (superset) - the outer rim of the “bagel” - which also circumscribes the inner circle (subset) encircles people who are all physical descendants of Jacob and contains not a single Gentile, believing or otherwise.
• Passages which distinguish between believing Jews and unbelieving Jews are placed around the concentric circles with arrows pointing to which of the two groups are in view: 1) the Jewish believing remnant represented by the center green region; 2) the unbelieving Jews who are not “true Jews” in the outer red region.
• A third yellow circle, below the two concentric circles, shows the position of believing Gentiles who are “sons of Abraham by faith” but also still called “Gentiles” and never Jews.
• The rest of the diagram, the region outside the circles (or background as it were), can be thought of as containing unbelievers who are neither the physical descendants of Jacob nor share the faith of Abraham. These, together with the Jews in the red region, are lost having never trusted in the ultimate representative of true Israel: Jesus Christ.

I hope this helps to clarify the way in which the New Testament addresses the issue of physical descendants of Israel verses Gentiles who are children of Abraham by faith - but still Gentiles (Gal. 2:12,14; Eph. 3:6).

Endnotes:

[1] Concerning the believing remnant, see 1Ki 19:18; 2Ki 19:4; 2Ki 19:30; 2Ki 21:14; 2Ki 25:22; Ezr 9:8; Ezr 9:15; Isa 1:9; Isa 6:13; Isa 7:3; Isa 10:20-22; Isa 28:5; Isa 37:4; Isa 37:31-32; Isa 46:3; Isa 59:21; Isa 65:8; Jer 5:10; Jer 5:18; Jer 23:3; Jer 44:28; Jer 50:20; Eze 5:3; Eze 5:12; Eze 6:8-10; Eze 9:8; Eze 9:11; Eze 11:13-16; Eze 12:6; Eze 14:22; Joe 2:32; Mic 2:12; Mic 5:7-8; Mic 7:18; Zec 11:10; Zec 13:8-9; Ro 9:6; Ro 9:27; Ro 11:5; Ro 11:17; Ro 11:25; Ga 6:16; 1Pe 1:1; Re 12:17
[2] A common error in interpreting this passage is to mistake the cultivated olive tree with its root as denoting Israel such that believing Gentiles are joined to Israel. But the root concerns the promises made to Abraham as the father of the faithful. Also, unbelieving Jews who are called “Israel” in this passage are broken off from the tree with its root. Thus, the tree and its root cannot be Israel.

[RegulatorCountry]

But for the sake of argument. Since you are (apparently) attributing kiddush Hashem to Jesus for his martyrdom, the corollary can also exist. From the Jewish point of view, Jesus would be guilty of a chilul Hashem for giving non-Jews the impression that G-d is okay with human sacrifice, violates His own Torah and that makes G-d look bad in the eyes of the gentiles.

... and to demonstrate the impossibility of that which you propose, we return yet again to God's command of Abraham, that he sacrifice his only begotten son. Your logic would have God committing an abomination against Himself, and would render Isaac guilty of chilul Hashem.

For this reason your argument is untenable.

[patlin]

This is my day for corrections as I can clearly see (was working with old glasses, thus misread the Hebrew letters). Please accept my sincere apologies, Here is the correction...

In Gen 2:4 YHVH says “these are the generations of the heavens and the earth when they were created”. The Hebrew letter “Yod” which also represents the hand of YHVH in certain words appears 2x in the Hebrew spelling of generations.

It is the “Tav” not the “Yod” that appeared 2x in Gen 2, then disappeared in Gen 5 and finally reappeared in Ruth 4.

tav-vav-dalet-lamed-vav-tav

That which connected “adam” to YHVH was removed thereby turning “adam” into Adam,”iysh”. Then YHVH prophesied in Ruth that “adam” would be restored through the generations of house of David.

[blasater1960]

Wow..that is a unique viewpoint.

Yah'shua is now the eternal High Priest with authority

It doesnt bother you that Jesus was not of a priestly tribe? You cant be of the tribe of Judah and then be a high priest...

It has been held that Melchizedek was Shem...the forerunner of the Aaronic priesthood.

shalom

[patlin]

rookie teacher mistakes make me crazy...

tav-vav-lamed-dalet-vav-tav = TOLDOT = GENERATIONS

[blasater1960]

... and to demonstrate the impossibility of that which you propose

Impossibility? Why would you say that? Jesus was a Jewish man...subject to public awareness of his observance by his followers and already he had been accused of blasphemy in public, he ripped on the gentile woman and said“It is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.”, calling her and her people dogs! a Chilul Hashem and I could list others. For Jesus to give the apperance that G-d somehow approved his would-be-sacrifice for the sins of the world is also chilul Hashem. As for the Akeda...take that up with G-d.

I ran it by a Rabbi and this was the reply:

It is absolutely a chilul Hashem- desecration of G-d's name- to say anything about Xtianity as being a kiddush Hashem- sanctification of G-d's name. Yesh"u was tried for treason, NOT for an act that was a kiddush Hashem, and then his death became theologically treated as a human sacrifice. A sin offering, atoning for the people. That does sound like G-d approving of a human sacrifice, which we know not to be true.

Your argument is the one in trouble and untenable.

[patlin]

It doesnt bother you that Jesus was not of a priestly tribe?

No it does not because the Melchisedek Priesthood is not of the earthly kingdom. Abraham was Hebrew and all tribes came through him. The Heavenly priesthood is neither Judah or Levite, they are Isra’el. However I do study under a Levite who is a direct descendant of Aaron.

Exodus 25:8 “They are to make me a sanctuary, so that I may live among them. 9 You are to make it according to everything I show you -the design of the tabernacle and the design of its furnishings. This is how you are to make it”

Hebrews explains the difference between the original and the earthly.

Hebrews 7:1 This Malki-Tzedek, king of Shalem, a cohen of God Ha’Elyon, met Avraham on his way back from the slaughter of the kings and blessed him; 2 also Avraham gave him a tenth of everything. Now first of all, by translation of his name, he is “king of righteousness”; and then he is also king of Shalem, which means “king of peace.” 3 There is no record of his father, mother, ancestry, birth or death; rather, like the Son of God, he continues as a cohen for all time. 4 Just think how great he was! Even the Patriarch Avraham gave him a tenth of the choicest spoils. 5 Now the descendants of Levi who became cohanim have a commandment in the Torah to take a tenth of the income of the people, that is, from their own brothers, despite the fact that they too are descended from Avraham. 6 But Malki-Tzedek, even though he was not descended from Levi, took a tenth from Avraham. Also, he blessed Avraham, the man who received God's promises; 7 and it is beyond all dispute that the one who blesses has higher status than the one who receives the blessing. 8 Moreover, in the case of the cohanim, the tenth is received by men who die; while in the case of Malki-Tzedek, it is received by someone who is testified to be still alive. 9 One might go even further and say that Levi, who himself receives tenths, paid a tenth through Avraham; 10 inasmuch as he was still in his ancestor Avraham’s body when Malki-Tzedek met him. 11 Therefore, if it had been possible to reach the goal through the system of cohanim derived from Levi (since in connection with it, the people were given the Torah), what need would there have been for another, different kind of cohen, the one spoken of as to be compared with Malki-Tzedek and not to be compared with Aharon? 12 For if the system of cohanim is transformed, there must of necessity occur a transformation of Torah. 13 The one about whom these things are said belongs to another tribe, from which no one has ever served at the altar; 14 for everyone knows that our Lord arose out of Y’hudah, and that Moshe said nothing about this tribe when he spoke about cohanim. 15 It becomes even clearer if a “different kind of cohen,” one like Malki-Tzedek, arises, 16 one who became a cohen not by virtue of a rule in the Torah concerning physical descent, but by virtue of the power of an indestructible life. 17 For it is stated, “You are a cohen FOREVER, to be compared with Malki-Tzedek.” 18 Thus, on the one hand, the earlier rule is set aside because of its weakness and inefficacy 19 (for the Torah did not bring anything to the goal); and, on the other hand, a hope of something better is introduced, through which we are drawing near to God. 20 What is more, God swore an oath. For no oath was sworn in connection with those who become cohanim now; 21 but Yeshua became a cohen by the oath which God swore when he said to him, “ADONAI has sworn and will not change his mind, ‘You are a cohen forever.’” 22 Also this shows how much better is the covenant of which Yeshua has become guarantor. 23 Moreover, the present cohanim are many in number, because they are prevented by death from continuing in office. 24 But because he lives forever, his position as cohen does not pass on to someone else; 25 and consequently, he is totally able to deliver those who approach God through him; since he is alive forever and thus forever able to intercede on their behalf. 26 This is the kind of cohen gadol that meets our need - holy, without evil, without stain, set apart from sinners and raised higher than the heavens; 27 one who does not have the daily necessity, like the other cohanim g’dolim, of offering up sacrifices first for their own sins and only then for those of the people; because he offered one sacrifice, once and for all, by offering up himself. 28 For the Torah appoints as cohanim g’dolim men who have weakness; but the text which speaks about the swearing of the oath, a text written later than the Torah, appoints a Son who has been brought to the goal forever.

Now here is where Christians who translated the Scriptures took the liberty to insert words that are not in the original Greek in order to place the fault in the Torah rather than themselves(Adam-”iysh”).

8:1 Here is the whole point of what we have been saying: we do have just such a cohen gadol as has been described. And he does sit at the right hand of HaG’dulah in heaven.d 2 There he serves in the Holy Place, that is, in the true Tent of Meeting, the one erected not by human beings but by ADONAI. 3 For every cohen gadol is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; so this cohen gadol too has to have something he can offer. 4 Now if he were on earth, he wouldn't be a cohen at all, since there already are cohanim offering the gifts required by the Torah. 5 But what they are serving is only a copy and shadow of the heavenly original; for when Moshe was about to erect the Tent, God warned him, “See to it that you make everything according to the pattern you were shown on the mountain.” 6 But now the work Yeshua has been given to do is far superior to theirs, just as the covenant he mediates is better. For this covenant has been given as Torah on the basis of better promises. 7 Indeed, if the first("iysh" priesthood)(covenant - is not in original text) had not given ground for faultfinding, there would have been no need for a second one. 8 For when he says, “’See! The days are coming,’ says ADONAI, ‘when I will establish over the house of Isra’el and over the house of Y’hudah a new covenant.

The heresy of Christian doctrine exposed, especially that of Catholicism & their laws of confession through the priesthood. Am I saying that the Levitical priesthood is bad & needs to be abolished? Heavens no! Their purpose is not yet been fulfilled, i.e. protecting the integrity of Torah & YHVH;s Sabbath, Holy Sabbaths & appointed convocations as well as YHVH's calendars(civil & religious). The only responsibility taken from them by the new covenant was the yearly ritual sacrifice for sin. Never again will blood be shed as atonement for sin.

It has been held that Melchizedek was

Since the Melchisedek Priesthood existed before man, the 1st would have been “adam” before he, Adam(iysh), succumbed to sin. However, I would like to read the Jewish writings that say Melchisedek was Shem and how they make this connection using Scripture. Would you be willing to share where I can read the specific writings on this that connects it to Scripture as all I have been able to find thus far is speculation(Ramban) and YHVH does not speculate.

Melchisedek only appears with Abraham, then is mentioned by YHVH through David in the Psalms and finally appears in the letter to the Hebrews right before the Temple was destroyed in 70AD.

This is why one needs to study Scripture from beginning to end, in that order but as a whole, AND in the "Light" of the Hebrew language it was given in. The testimony of Yah'shua began on day one and is why it was spoken in the Torah, repeated in the 1st century gospel writings and at the the closing of Revelation; "Do not to add to or take away".

[blasater1960]

Here see what you think of this. Critique as you see fit!

Melchizedek

[patlin]

Thank you, I will definitely read & study it.

Shalom!

[patlin]

Thank you, it was all very interesting but as I said, Melchisedek coming from Shem is merely speculation based on oral law & writings that do not reference one passage in Scripture. The writers conclusion is also based on false Christian teaching since the writer obviously did not take the time to actually go to the Greek text of the book of Hebrews to see that words(I only gave one example) in the letter to the Hebrews had been taken away and replaced with ones that support the false doctrine of Christendom.

The writer also conveniently leaves out the fact that Paul(Rabbi Sha’ul who the letter to the Hebrews is attributed to) studied under Gamaliel and thus Rabbi Sha’ul would have had in depth knowledge of any and all writings concerning the Melchisedek priesthood. Thus he(Rabbi Sha’ul) was speaking from authority & knowledge not speculation.

Melchisedek came to Abram bringing bread & wine which is one of the requirements for sealing a covenant(breaking of bread). Then there is the offering, another requirement of covenant making. Finally after this has taken place, Abram brings the blood sacrifices also required for covenant making, is put to sleep, then the Holy Fire(fire that will destroy the earth just before the millennial reign) walks through the pieces thereby sealing the covenant and then a few years later comes the eventual change of name from Abram to Abraham.

The writer also denies the spiritual “ROCK” that was with the people in the desert. Was not that “ROCK” YHVH? The “ROCK” of all salvation who rescued the children of Isra’el from slavery & lead them out of Egypt.

Ex 20:1 Then Elohim spoke these words: 2 “I am YHVH your Elohim, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the abode of slavery"

The writer begins and ends with the attitude that Judaism is superior to all man named religions, thereby it is only the seed of an earthly Levite “iysh” that could possibly be a Melchisedek priest. I think the writer needs to reread Exodus 25:8 “They are to make me a sanctuary, so that I may live among them. 9 You are to make it according to everything I show you”

In Exodus 19, YHVH had Moshe speak to ALL the children of Isra’el. “3 Moshe went up to God, and ADONAI called to him from the mountain: “Here is what you are to say to the household of Ya’akov, to tell the people of Isra’el:...5 Now if you will pay careful attention to what I say and keep my covenant, then you will be my own treasure from among all the peoples, for all the earth is mine; 6 and you will be a kingdom of cohanim for me, a nation set apart”

All tribes(descendants of Jacob) were to be part of the priesthood, not just the Levites. It was only after the golden calf incident that it was taken from them and placed in the care of one.

Now, please do not take this personal as I do respect my Jewish brethren, but this has been the problem from the beginning, man(iysh) wanting to have power over man(iysh) both civilly & religiously but especially religiously. Everyone thinking that their religious doctrine is the one that rules during the millennial kingdom in the heavenly tabernacle as high priests therefore no one can come into the kingdom but by their doctrine(oral law).

I respect your religion and thank you for the gift of knowledge, which is the Word of YHVH, that the house of Judah preserved however, the Talmud is not the "inspired Elohim breathed word of YHVH". If it was, it would have been canonized and even Judaism has not gone so far as to try & do that. It does however prove their integrity, passion & loyalty to YHVH and thus the reason YHVH did not divorce the house of Judah even though HE also called her a harlot. Therefore, while we go to Talmud, Midrashim and other oral works for wisdom, we do not take them as gospel. We separate the wheat from the tares using the Scripture(YHVH's testamony which is Genesis thru Revelation) as our guide.

[antisocial]

Thanks for pinging me to your posts. I read and enjoy each of them.
Shalom

[blasater1960]

Greek text of the book of Hebrews to see that words(I only gave one example) in the letter to the Hebrews had been taken away and replaced with ones that support the false doctrine of Christendom.

Do you have a link to this "correct" version of Hebrews? I studied greek long ago and have a Nestle GT I can compare it to. The book of Hebrews is in fact littered with falsehoods and I my opinion shouldnt even be in the NT. That is, if I was a Christian.

The writer also conveniently leaves out the fact that Paul(Rabbi Sha’ul who the letter to the Hebrews is attributed to) studied under Gamaliel

The problem is there is no outside conformation of this either in the Talmud or in the works of Josephus. Acouple of Gamaliels students are referenced but not Paul or Saul. Respectfully, Paul does not sound like a trained pharisee, his logic is flawed and thoughts are not that organized. Even the church in Jerusalem was wary of him.

[TaraP]

Hi Blaster!

Thanks for your reply! I always appreciate your insight.

I just know I see so much biblical prophecy coming to fruition...The News is something right out of the Bible now!

Be well and Shalom to you!

Tara/ Tarah!
:)

[Hacksaw]

Welcome to FR. Your pot stirring posting history has been duly noted.

proe, don't be bothered by people with control issues. They are nobody important.

[TaraP]

I hope you don’t mind, but I just want to chime in your conversation about Sacrafice....I do believe *Christ*
is G-d not in G-d’s full nature because G-d is not a man.

Scripture speaks of the SON/Sun of G-d and the Son/Sun of Man in the Malachi scripture and in the Gospels..

Jesus did not say he was G-d but that he was one with G-d...

The first Man/ Adam did not have a human father and he was fully human, so that should tell us..G-d in his infinite nature can create *Man* I think science has evolved in the area of Cosmology, the Universe and *Creation* that we now have a (4-D) understanding of the Bible and G-d’s infinite nature as a *Consuming Fire* or as energy, dark matter, Quantumn Physics etc.

Is it possible that G-d in his power and greatness can transform part of his *Oneness* into a fully human being that is divine?? I don’t think any scripture says:
No he cannot?

I have wondered what the purpose of *Animal Sacrafice* was for a long time...You take the innocent *Perfect Lamb* who goes willingly to slaughter and kill it, because Man sinned..

Well does that make much sense to our Human mind??? I would say no....

However G-d must of had a plan before *Creation* that animals would be created and serve a much *Higher Purpose* other than just for food help or companionship. If animal sacrafice could reconcile sinful man to a Holy righteous G-d then when is Animal Sacrafice sufficent to satisfy G-d?

Apparently it isn’t, because Aniaml Sacrafice seems to have no end...

So if Jesus also referred as the *Perfect Lamb of G-d who takes away the Sins of the World* it seems as well G-d had a *Higher Purpose* for what *SACRAFICE* truly means in reconcilliation for Man and G-d.

Can we see that G-d might of been telling Abraham that Human Sacrafice is an abomination because no one is *Higher* than G-d and G-d who would sacrafice himself in the oneness of being fully human and divine is the only one that could serve that purpose and satisfy G-d..THE END...

When Jesus said: *IT IS FINISHED* I believe he meant Sacrafice has ended, once and for all...

The Bible says Jesus sat down at the right had of the *Father* Animal sacrafice has no end, no finally sitting down, it is a revolving door that never satisfies G-d.

If G-d is outside of time and Space can he go back in our time and wipe every sin we ever commited yesterday, today and tomorrow? Yes...

I believe that is why Jesus said: We present to G-d spotless and blameless, because Jesus paid it all...

It is not what we can do for G-d...It is what G-d had done for us....

That said: I do believe what blasater 1960 says: Is that the Jewish Priests are returning and will teach the nations about G-d...

Moses, Abraham, David, with Christ at the head in Jerusalem....

Just what I believe....

I appreciate all the insight many of you have on this topic!

[patlin]

Do you have a link to this "correct" version of Hebrews?

I have not ordered a physical copy of the Greek interlinear 1st century writings. I use http://www.e-sword.net/ and thus have not found a need to buy a paper copy.

In the KJV the word "covenant" is italicized. Any word in the 1st century writings that is italicized means that it was not in the original text. When I go to the Greek interlinear 1st century writings(NT), the Greek word for covenant is not there. However, right after "the first" there are 2 Strongs numbers, one is the meaning of "the first" and the other is in brackets with no Greek word associated with it. Thus the word "covenant" was pulled out of thin air.

The same thing appears in Acts 20 & 1 Cor 16 where Paul is clearly writing during the Omer. The original text refers to "first" / "one" of "sabbatons", however when it made its way into English(not sure about Latin as I don't use that translation at all) first / one of sabbatons got changed to 'first of the week' taking out the plurality which was meant to give notice to the time of year and then taking our sabbath to give justification that the sabbath was changed from Saturday to Sunday.

As far as Paul studying under Gamaliel,I'll let Paul testify for himself using his testimony when false accusations were brought against him.

Acts 21:39 But Paul said, “I am a Jew from Tarsus, in Cilicia, a citizen of no mean city; and I implore you, permit me to speak to the people.” 40 So when he had given him permission, Paul stood on the stairs and motioned with his hand to the people. And when there was a great silence, he spoke to them in the Hebrew language, saying,. . . 22:1 “Brethren and fathers, hear my defense before you now.” 2 And when they heard that he spoke to them in the Hebrew language, they kept all the more silent. Then he said: 3 “I am indeed a Jew, born in Tarsus of Cilicia, but brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, taught according to the strictness of our fathers’ law,"

G1059 Gamaliel γαμαλιηλG1059 GAMALIEL
gam-al-ee-ale'
Of Hebrew origin [H1583]; Gamaliel (that is, Gamliel), an Israelite: - Gamaliel

Gamaliel 1st appears in Acts 5:29 But Peter and the other apostles answered and said: “We ought to obey God rather than men. 30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus whom you murdered by hanging on a tree. 31 Him God has exalted to His right hand to be Prince and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. 32 And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”...Gamaliel’s Advice... 33 When they heard this, they were furious and plotted to kill them. 34 Then one in the council stood up, a Pharisee named Gamaliel, a teacher of the law held in respect by all the people, and commanded them to put the apostles outside for a little while. 35 And he said to them: “Men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what you intend to do regarding these men. 36 For some time ago Theudas rose up, claiming to be somebody. A number of men, about four hundred, joined him. He was slain, and all who obeyed him were scattered and came to nothing. 37 After this man, Judas of Galilee rose up in the days of the census, and drew away many people after him. He also perished, and all who obeyed him were dispersed. 38 And now I say to you, keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing; 39 but if it is of God, you cannot overthrow it—lest you even be found to fight against God.”

Is it no wonder that the early RC which later became RCC wanted the book of Acts removed from the canon. They had to know that the truth of their transgressions & the truth of their false religious doctrine would eventually come to the surface.

Paul does not sound like a trained pharisee, his logic is flawed and thoughts are not that organized

This is an incorrect conclusion based on what Christendom teaches. When one removes the Greek lenses one has read through all their lives the truth is as obvious as the nose on ones face. I bucked the truth for a long time because I would not let my heart believe that the clergy I trusted was teaching false doctrine. It wasn't until I let go of man(iysh) lead study & let YHVH lead the way that the truth was revealed. It was a several year painstaking journey.

[blasater1960]

Hi Tarah- Here is a video series you might like on Unifies Field Theory and Judaism (kabbalah) It is thought provoking. Unified Field Theory and Kabbalah

And I know how you feel about sacrifices: Deeper look at sacrifices

[TaraP]

Thanks Blasater!

I will watch!

One other thing I wanted to ask you from your perspective, is the Transformation of Angels into human form...

In the Book of Genesis when the Angel of the LORD visited Abraham..Abraham greeted them and they ate with him and Sarah as well as Abraham washed the Angel of the LORD’s feet...

Now that being said..What is your understanding regarding how Angels can transform there nature into human form?

Thanks again for the video!

[blasater1960]

FYI...Errors in Hebrews...line by line:

Hebrews Critical Review

Chapter 1

1 In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe. (There is no prophecy in the “OT” that ever mentions that His son will speak to us. G-d Himself never mentions a “son” at any critical juncture such as Mosaic Covenant at Sinai or the Abrahamic Covenant or at anytime, other than Israel,David and Solomon.

3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, (Not possible, G-d in Deut 4:15 says He has NO FORM) sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. 4 So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

5 For to which of the angels did God ever say,

“You are my Son; today I have become your Father” (This quote refers to David and/or Solomon and/or Israel, G-ds first born son) [a]?

Or again,

“I will be his Father, and he will be my Son” (Solomon) [b]?

6 And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says, “Let all God’s angels worship him.”( No scripture says this) [c]

7 In speaking of the angels he says,

“He makes his angels spirits, and his servants flames of fire.” (This is about G-d…not angels) [d]

8 But about the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever; a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom. (This is about G-d not “the son”)

9 You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy.”( This Psalm verse is directed to the King who is being married) [e]

10 He also says,

“In the beginning, Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands. 11 They will perish, but you remain; they will all wear out like a garment. 12 You will roll them up like a robe; like a garment they will be changed. But you remain the same, and your years will never end.” (This is about G-d not a son) [f]

13 To which of the angels did God ever say, “Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet” (This is a Psalm concerning David, who is asked to wait until his enemy Saul is brought down not about a son) [g]?

14 Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?

Chapter 2

1 We must pay the most careful attention, therefore, to what we have heard, so that we do not drift away. 2 For since the message spoken through angels was binding, and every violation and disobedience received its just punishment, 3 how shall we escape if we ignore so great a salvation? This salvation, which was first announced by the Lord, was confirmed to us by those who heard him. 4 God also testified to it by signs, wonders and various miracles, and by gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to his will (There can be no new salvation plan, G-d gave us one already and said it was forever, signs, wonders and gifts are never to be accepted if they accompanied by a “new plan” Deut 13) .

5 It is not to angels that he has subjected the world to come, about which we are speaking. 6 But there is a place where someone has testified:

“What is mankind that you are mindful of them, a son of man that you care for him? 7 You made them a little[a] lower than the angels; you crowned them with glory and honor 8 and put everything under their feet.”[b][c] In putting everything under them,[d] God left nothing that is not subject to them.[e] Yet at present we do not see everything subject to them.[f] 9 But we do see Jesus, who was made lower than the angels for a little while, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone. Psalm 8 is a Psalm concerning David. No one else.

10 In bringing many sons and daughters to glory, it was fitting that God, for whom and through whom everything exists, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through what he suffered. 11 Both the one who makes people holy and those who are made holy are of the same family. So Jesus is not ashamed to call them brothers and sisters.[g] 12 He says,

“I will declare your name to my brothers and sisters; in the assembly I will sing your praises.”[h] 13 And again, “I will put my trust in him.” It doesn’t say this in Isaiah

And again he says, “Here am I, and the children God has given me.” This is Isaiah speaking of himself and his children who, like Hosea’s, were instrumental in his prophetic work. .[j]

14 Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death—that is, the devil—G-d, not the “devil” has the power of death!— 15 and free those who all their lives were held in slavery by their fear of death. 16 For surely it is not angels he helps Where does it say that in the bible? , but Abraham’s descendants. 17 For this reason he had to be made like them,[k] fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest Jesus is not of the tribe of Levi…cant be a priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people. 18 Because he himself suffered when he was tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted G-d, who is omniscient, who made man, doesn’t know how a man feels unless he becomes a man? That is certainly putting non-biblical restrictions on G-d’s power..

Chapter 3

1 Therefore, holy brothers and sisters, who share in the heavenly calling, fix your thoughts on Jesus (We are to fix our thoughts on G-d and Him only, there is no other. Any “fixing of thought” on anything or anyone else is Idolatry. , whom we acknowledge as our apostle and high priest. 2 He was faithful to the one who appointed him, just as Moses was faithful in all God’s house. 3 Jesus has been found worthy of greater honor than Moses (No. Moses and all the patriarchs were faithful to G-ds commands; Paul’s description of Jesus is NOT faithful to G-d since it changes the Torah. Thou shalt not add or subtract from the words of the Torah.) , just as the builder of a house has greater honor than the house itself. 4 For every house is built by someone, but God is the builder of everything. 5 “Moses was faithful as a servant in all God’s house,”[a] bearing witness to what would be spoken by God in the future (Moses NEVER claimed that a future messiah would be G-d, would do the law for us or that he would kill himself as a human sin sacrifice) . 6 But Christ is faithful as the Son over God’s house. And we are his house, if indeed we hold firmly to our confidence and the hope in which we glory.

7 So, as the Holy Spirit says:

“Today, if you hear his voice, 8 do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion, during the time of testing in the wilderness, 9 where your ancestors tested and tried me, though for forty years they saw what I did. 10 That is why I was angry with that generation; I said, ‘Their hearts are always going astray, and they have not known my ways.’ 11 So I declared on oath in my anger, ‘They shall never enter my rest.’ ”[b]

12 See to it, brothers and sisters, that none of you has a sinful, unbelieving heart that turns away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called “Today,” so that none of you may be hardened by sin’s deceitfulness. 14 We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end. 15 As has just been said:

“Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion.”[c]

16 Who were they who heard and rebelled? Were they not all those Moses led out of Egypt? 17 And with whom was he angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies perished in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief. This comparison of the exodus is not valid at all. The Israelites rebelled against G-d and His servant Moses. The message of the NT does not meet the requirements of scripture in the “OT” regarding keeping the Torah forever, not adding or subtracting to the word of G-d and many others. Therefore, it is to be rejected. There is NO rebellion in rejecting false teaching. Worth repeating the “rebellion” is by those straying for Torah law, not by those that hold fast to it.

Chapter 4

1 Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it. 2 For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.[a] 3 Now we who have believed enter that rest, just as God has said,

“So I declared on oath in my anger, ‘They shall never enter my rest.’”[b] And yet his works have been finished since the creation of the world. 4 For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: “On the seventh day God rested from all his works.”[c] 5 And again in the passage above he says, “They shall never enter my rest.”

6 Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience, 7 God again set a certain day, calling it “Today.” This he did when a long time later he spoke through David, as in the passage already quoted:

“Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts.”[d] 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day Joshua did give them rest and the other “day” spoken of is not a new Torah or new law. 9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; 10 for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from their works,[e] just as God did from his. 11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience. The author of Hebrews has it exactly backwards. Those who are Torah observant are obedient and those seeking some new understanding, never known by our forefathers are the disobedient ones.

12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. 13 Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest Jesus can not be a high priest, wrong tribe. who has ascended into heaven,[f] Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin He did sin. He lied to the high priest, he spoke badly of the gentile woman and her family, he cursed a tree for no reason…there are many others. 16 Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

Chapter 5

1 Every high priest is selected from among the people and is appointed to represent the people in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. 2 He is able to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, since he himself is subject to weakness. 3 This is why he has to offer sacrifices for his own sins, as well as for the sins of the people. 4 And no one takes this honor on himself, but he receives it when called by God, just as Aaron was.

5 In the same way, Christ did not take on himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him,

“You are my Son; today I have become your Father.” That is not Jesus but Solomon and David[a]

6 And he says in another place,

“You are a priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.”[b] (This again has nothing to do with Jesus. Melchizedek was a forerunner of the Aaronic priesthood and was most likely Shem, Noah’s son who was alive and was King of Salem at the time of Abram. This is pre-law and pre-Abraham (Abram not Abraham), therefore Melchizedek was a righteous Noahidic Priest, so when Christians say Jesus was like Melchizedek, they are calling Jesus a non-Jew. So the bottom line is that this is a Psalm of David, Melchizedek means “righteous king” in Hebrew. David was a righteous King; the Davidic line would be forever. Psalms 110:4 defines the status of King David, which also confirms that his distinctive monarchy would be continued in his successors. In addition to his regal dignity, he would also perform certain priestly functions, albeit not of the same standing as Aaron and his descendants, the Priests)

7 During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death (G-d praying to G-d? G-d trying to save G-d from death?) , and he was heard because of his reverent submission. 8 Son though he was, he learned obedience from what he suffered (G-d needed to learn obedience to G-d?) 9 and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him (Nowhere in Torah or the Jewish bible is this taught) and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek( G-d made G-d a high priest? One who is not of the tribe of Levi? No).

11 We have much to say about this, but it is hard to make it clear to you because you no longer try to understand. 12 In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God’s word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! 13 Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. 14 But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.

Chapter 6

1 Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death,[a] and of faith in God, 2 instruction about cleansing rites,[b] the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And God permitting, we will do so.

4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen[c] away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. 7 Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.

9 Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case—the things that have to do with salvation. 10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them. 11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized. 12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.

13 When God made his promise to Abraham, since there was no one greater for him to swear by, he swore by himself, 14 saying, “I will surely bless you and give you many descendants.”[d] 15 And so after waiting patiently, Abraham received what was promised.

16 People swear by someone greater than themselves, and the oath confirms what is said and puts an end to all argument. 17 Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised. (Unchanging nature of His purpose?) The author of Hebrews has TOTALLY changed G-ds salvation program), he confirmed it with an oath. 18 God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us may be greatly encouraged. 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, firm and secure. It enters the inner sanctuary behind the curtain, 20 where our forerunner, Jesus, has entered on our behalf. (A complete departure from Torah. Nowhere does it say that ANYONE can become a sin sacrifice on our behalf). He has become a high priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.

Chapter 7

1 This Melchizedek was king of Salem and priest of God Most High. He met Abraham (Abram…not Abraham) returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him, 2 and Abraham gave him a tenth of everything. First, the name Melchizedek means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace.” 3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, resembling the Son of God, he remains a priest forever.

4 Just think how great he was: Even the patriarch Abraham gave him a tenth of the plunder! (It was BEFORE Abram has received the final covenant…that is why he tithed to him)5 Now the law requires the descendants of Levi who become priests to collect a tenth from the people—that is, from their fellow Israelites—even though they also are descended from Abraham. 6 This man, however, did not trace his descent from Levi, yet he collected a tenth from Abraham and blessed him who had the promises. 7 And without doubt the lesser is blessed by the greater. 8 In the one case, the tenth is collected by people who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9 One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, 10 because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor.

11 If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood (Nowhere in the bible does it say that the goal of the Levitical priesthood is perfection! Perfection is not the goal! A relationship with G-d is the goal and forgiveness of sin, through repentance, prayer, fasting and charity. When there is a Temple, then sacrifice for unintentional sin and G-ds presence can resume on earth, in the temple. —and indeed the law given to the people established that priesthood—why was there still need for another priest to come (There was no need and is no need) , one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron? 12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also (Where does it say that in the bible? The bible says the Law is forever and the priesthood is returning). 13 He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe, and no one from that tribe has ever served at the altar. 14 For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about priests. 15 And what we have said is even more clear if another priest like Melchizedek appears, 16 one who has become a priest not on the basis of a regulation as to his ancestry but on the basis of the power of an indestructible life (Where does the bible say that? The author is ASSUMING that the Psalm 110 passage refers to an eternal person in the form of Melchizedek. Again, Melchizedek was a man, who lived and died, Shem, son of Noah... 17 For it is declared:

“You are a priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.”[a]

18 The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless (Blasphemy! Weak and useless? G-ds regulation is flawed and useless?) 19 (for the law made nothing perfect Psalm 119, the longest chapter in the bible makes it clear that the law IS EFFECTIVE, the law was NOT to promote perfection but is a blueprint for the Jew to repair himself and the world.) , and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.

20 And it was not without an oath! Others became priests without any oath, 21 but he became a priest with an oath when God said to him: “The Lord has sworn and will not change his mind: ‘You are a priest forever.’”[b]

22 Because of this oath, Jesus has become the guarantor of a better covenant (The new covenant is not a new Torah or new Law and occurs at the end of times. 2000 years ago were not the end of times).

23 Now there have been many of those priests, since death prevented them from continuing in office; 24 but because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood. 25 Therefore he is able to save completely[c] those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them. (We do not need a mediator, we each are responsible for our own sin and there is not one case in the bible where a mediator was used to ask for forgiveness of sin, other of course than the temple priests)

26 Such a high priest truly meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. 27 Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. 28 For the law appoints as high priests men in all their weakness; but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever. (The bible says the law is forever. therefore there is no “after the law”.)

Chapter 8

1 Now the main point of what we are saying is this: We do have such a high priest, who sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven, 2 and who serves in the sanctuary, the true tabernacle set up by the Lord, not by a mere human being.

3 Every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices, and so it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer. 4 If he were on earth, he would not be a priest, for there are already priests who offer the gifts prescribed by the law. 5 They serve at a sanctuary that is a copy and shadow of what is in heaven. This is why Moses was warned when he was about to build the tabernacle: “See to it that you make everything according to the pattern shown you on the mountain.”[a] 6 But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises (Again, new covenant does NOT mean new Torah and it occurs at the end of times which did not occur 2000 years ago.).

7 For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said[b]:

“The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. 9 It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord. 10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people. 11 No longer will they teach their neighbor, or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest. .(As you can see, this has not occurred yet and is an end times event , therefore the new covenant has not been entered into yet.) 12 For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”[c]

13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear

Chapter 9

1 Now the first covenant had regulations for worship and also an earthly sanctuary. 2 A tabernacle was set up. In its first room were the lampstand and the table with its consecrated bread; this was called the Holy Place. 3 Behind the second curtain was a room called the Most Holy Place, 4 which had the golden altar of incense and the gold-covered ark of the covenant. This ark contained the gold jar of manna, Aaron’s staff that had budded, and the stone tablets of the covenant. 5 Above the ark were the cherubim of the Glory, overshadowing the atonement cover. But we cannot discuss these things in detail now.

6 When everything had been arranged like this, the priests entered regularly into the outer room to carry on their ministry. 7 But only the high priest entered the inner room, and that only once a year, and never without blood, which he offered for himself and for the sins the people had committed in ignorance. 8 The Holy Spirit was showing by this that the way into the Most Holy Place had not yet been disclosed as long as the first tabernacle was still functioning. 9 This is an illustration for the present time, indicating that the gifts and sacrifices being offered were not able to clear the conscience of the worshiper. 10 They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings—external regulations applying until the time of the new order.

11 But when Christ came as high priest of the good things that are now already here,[a] he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not made with human hands, that is to say, is not a part of this creation. 12 He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood (G-d forbids human sacrifice, Jesus did not die as a sacrifice by having his throat slit but he suffocated to death, his fat and offal not burned, his blood was not sprinkled on the altar, therefore by no measure, a proper sacrifice) , thus obtaining[b] eternal redemption. 13 The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean. 14 How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death,[c] so that we may serve the living God!

15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

16 In the case of a will,[d] it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, 17 because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. 18 This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood. 19 When Moses had proclaimed every command of the law to all the people, he took the blood of calves, together with water, scarlet wool and branches of hyssop, and sprinkled the scroll and all the people. 20 He said, “This is the blood of the covenant, which God has commanded you to keep.”[e] 21 In the same way, he sprinkled with the blood both the tabernacle and everything used in its ceremonies. 22 In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness (The bible NEVER says that. Lev 17:10 says that blood is not to be eaten, it is not a food. Why? Because the only use for blood, is for atonement. It does NOT say, that it is the ONLY means of atonement and in fact, Lev 5 describes the use of FLOUR as an atonement for sin. The bible has many examples of prayer, repentance, fasting and charity as PREFERRED means of atonement. NOT blood..

23 It was necessary, then, for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these sacrifices, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence. 25 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him (If so, why is the 3rd temple going to be rebuilt? Sacrifices and the levitical priesthood are returning? FOREVER! Ezek 43-44.

Chapter 10

1 The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming (The law is forever Ps 111 and others) —not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. 2 Otherwise, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. 3 But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins. 4 It is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said:

“Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me ; ( It doesn’t say that, that is a blatant mistranslation. It says: “Sacrifice and meal offering You have not desired; My ears You have [b]opened; Burnt offering and sin offering You have not required”. The author of Hebrews is playing with the scriptures fast and loose. And we are supposed to trust in it?

6 with burnt offerings and sin offerings you were not pleased. (Again, the author tampers with the text, it says: 16 “For You (AF)do not delight in sacrifice, otherwise I would give it; You are not pleased with burnt offering. 17 The sacrifices of God are a (AG)broken spirit; A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise”. And likewise: 6 (A)With what shall I come to the LORD And bow myself before the God on high? Shall I come to Him with (B)burnt offerings, With yearling calves? 7 Does the LORD take delight in (C)thousands of rams, In ten thousand rivers of oil? Shall I present my (D)firstborn for my rebellious acts, The fruit of my body for the sin of my soul? 8 He has (E)told you, O man, what is good; And (F)what does the LORD require of you But to (G)do justice, to (H)love [a]kindness, And to walk [b](I)humbly with your God)

7 Then I said, ‘Here I am—it is written about me in the scroll— I have come to do your will, my God.’”[a]

8 First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them”—though they were offered in accordance with the law. 9 Then he said, “Here I am, I have come to do your will.” He sets aside the first to establish the second. (No..not true, the law is still in place) 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all (sacrifices are returning…why? Christians say those will be for a memorial to Jesus’s work …totally impossible).

11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13 and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. 14 For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.

15 The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says:

16 “This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”[b] 17 Then he adds:

“Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more.” (More text tampering! It says: Behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a (BX)new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, [c] The new covenant is with Israel and Judah NOT the gentiles. Then the writer ships this part “They will (CE)not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they will all (CF)know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the LORD,”…That has NOT happened yet…therefore no new covenant exists for Israel, the house of Judah and certainly NOT THE GENTILES.

18 And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary (Ezek 44).

A Call to Persevere in Faith

19 Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds, 25 not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left (Not true! Read the account of Jonah…prayer, repentance and fasting and the Ninevites were forgiven…No blood…no sacrifice), 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[d] and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”[e] 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

32 Remember those earlier days after you had received the light, when you endured in a great conflict full of suffering. 33 Sometimes you were publicly exposed to insult and persecution; at other times you stood side by side with those who were so treated. 34 You suffered along with those in prison and joyfully accepted the confiscation of your property, because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions. 35 So do not throw away your confidence; it will be richly rewarded.

36 You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37 For, “In just a little while, he who is coming will come and will not delay.”[f] (2000 years is not a delay?)

38 And, “But my righteous[g] one will live by faith. And I take no pleasure in the one who shrinks back.”[h]

39 But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved.

Chapter 11

1 Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for. 3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible. 4 By faith Abel brought God a better offering than Cain did. By faith he was commended as righteous, when God spoke well of his offerings. And by faith Abel still speaks, even though he is dead. 5 By faith Enoch was taken from this life, so that he did not experience death: “He could not be found, because God had taken him away.”[a] For before he was taken, he was commended as one who pleased God. 6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

7 By faith Noah, when warned about things not yet seen, in holy fear built an ark to save his family. By his faith he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness that is in keeping with faith. (More than that! He received a covenant that is still valid today for Gentiles, the seven (some say 6) laws of Noah.)

8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going. 9 By faith he made his home in the promised land like a stranger in a foreign country; he lived in tents, as did Isaac and Jacob, who were heirs with him of the same promise. 10 For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God. 11 And by faith even Sarah, who was past childbearing age, was enabled to bear children because she[b] considered him faithful who had made the promise. 12 And so from this one man, and he as good as dead, came descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as countless as the sand on the seashore.

13 All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance, admitting that they were foreigners and strangers on earth. 14 People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. 15 If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 Instead, they were longing for a better country—a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.

17 By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had embraced the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, 18 even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.”[c] 19 Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead, and so in a manner of speaking he did receive Isaac back from death. (Not true. Abraham had faith that G-d would provide an alternative sacrifice, which he did. This a not a picture of Jesus but a clear prohibition of human sacrifice for ever and always! Hence Jesus as a human being is an improper sacrifice. G-d says He HATES human sacrifice, it is an ABOMINATION to Him and the thought of making it a command never entered His mind! )

20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau in regard to their future. 21 By faith Jacob, when he was dying, blessed each of Joseph’s sons, and worshiped as he leaned on the top of his staff. 22 By faith Joseph, when his end was near, spoke about the exodus of the Israelites from Egypt and gave instructions concerning the burial of his bones. 23 By faith Moses’ parents hid him for three months after he was born, because they saw he was no ordinary child, and they were not afraid of the king’s edict. 24 By faith Moses, when he had grown up, refused to be known as the son of Pharaoh’s daughter. 25 He chose to be mistreated along with the people of God rather than to enjoy the fleeting pleasures of sin. 26 He regarded disgrace for the sake of Christ as of greater value than the treasures of Egypt, because he was looking ahead to his reward. 27 By faith he left Egypt, not fearing the king’s anger; he persevered because he saw him who is invisible. 28 By faith he kept the Passover and the application of blood, so that the destroyer of the firstborn would not touch the firstborn of Israel. (It is more than that! They killed the Egyptian Idol –the Ram-lamb god, by faith they knew G-d would spare them. Had G-d not been faithful the Egyptians would have slaughtered the Israelites for killing their “lamb of god”. Exodus 8:22)

29 By faith the people passed through the Red Sea as on dry land; but when the Egyptians tried to do so, they were drowned. 30 By faith the walls of Jericho fell, after the army had marched around them for seven days. 31 By faith the prostitute Rahab, because she welcomed the spies, was not killed with those who were disobedient.[d]

32 And what more shall I say? I do not have time to tell about Gideon, Barak, Samson and Jephthah, about David and Samuel and the prophets, 33 who through faith conquered kingdoms, administered justice, and gained what was promised; who shut the mouths of lions, 34 quenched the fury of the flames, and escaped the edge of the sword; whose weakness was turned to strength; and who became powerful in battle and routed foreign armies. 35 Women received back their dead, raised to life again. There were others who were tortured, refusing to be released so that they might gain an even better resurrection. 36 Some faced jeers and flogging, and even chains and imprisonment. 37 They were put to death by stoning;[e] they were sawed in two; they were killed by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated— 38 the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, living in caves and in holes in the ground. 39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, 40 since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.

Chapter 12

1 Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2 fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith. For the joy set before him he endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God. 3 Consider him who endured such opposition from sinners, so that you will not grow weary and lose heart. 4 In your struggle against sin, you have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood. 5 And have you completely forgotten this word of encouragement that addresses you as a father addresses his son? It says, “My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline, and do not lose heart when he rebukes you, 6 because the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.”[a]

7 Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? 8 If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all. 9 Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! 10 They disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. 11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.

12 Therefore, strengthen your feeble arms and weak knees. 13 “Make level paths for your feet,”[b] so that the lame may not be disabled, but rather healed. 14 Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord. 15 See to it that no one falls short of the grace of God and that no bitter root grows up to cause trouble and defile many. 16 See that no one is sexually immoral, or is godless like Esau, who for a single meal sold his inheritance rights as the oldest son. 17 Afterward, as you know, when he wanted to inherit this blessing, he was rejected. Even though he sought the blessing with tears, he could not change what he had done. 18 You have not come to a mountain that can be touched and that is burning with fire; to darkness, gloom and storm; 19 to a trumpet blast or to such a voice speaking words that those who heard it begged that no further word be spoken to them, 20 because they could not bear what was commanded: “If even an animal touches the mountain, it must be stoned to death.”[c] 21 The sight was so terrifying that Moses said, “I am trembling with fear.”[d]

22 But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly, 23 to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God, the Judge of all, to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel. 25 See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven? 26 At that time his voice shook the earth, but now he has promised, “Once more I will shake not only the earth but also the heavens.”[e] 27 The words “once more” indicate the removing of what can be shaken—that is, created things—so that what cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Therefore, since we are receiving a kingdom that cannot be shaken, let us be thankful, and so worship God acceptably with reverence and awe, 29 for our “God is a consuming fire.”[f]

Chapter 13

1 Keep on loving one another as brothers and sisters. 2 Do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by so doing some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it. 3 Continue to remember those in prison as if you were together with them in prison, and those who are mistreated as if you yourselves were suffering. 4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral. 5 Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.”[a]

6 So we say with confidence, “The Lord is my helper; I will not be afraid. What can mere mortals do to me?”[b] 7 Remember your leaders, who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith. 8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever. 9 Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings. It is good for our hearts to be strengthened by grace, not by eating ceremonial foods, which is of no benefit to those who do so. 10 We have an altar from which those who minister at the tabernacle have no right to eat.

11 The high priest carries the blood of animals into the Most Holy Place as a sin offering, but the bodies are burned outside the camp (Only the waste products were burned outside the camp, including the poop) . 12 And so Jesus also suffered outside the city gate to make the people holy through his own blood (He was killed outside not by bloodshed but by suffocation which is an unkosher method of death). 13 Let us, then, go to him outside the camp, bearing the disgrace he bore. 14 For here we do not have an enduring city, but we are looking for the city that is to come.

15 Through Jesus, therefore, let us continually offer to God a sacrifice of praise—the fruit of lips that openly profess his name. 16 And do not forget to do good and to share with others, for with such sacrifices God is pleased. 17 Have confidence in your leaders and submit to their authority, because they keep watch over you as those who must give an account. Do this so that their work will be a joy, not a burden, for that would be of no benefit to you. 18 Pray for us. We are sure that we have a clear conscience and desire to live honorably in every way. 19 I particularly urge you to pray so that I may be restored to you soon.

Benediction and Final Greetings 20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep, 21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. 22 Brothers and sisters, I urge you to bear with my word of exhortation, for in fact I have written to you quite briefly. 23 I want you to know that our brother Timothy has been released. If he arrives soon, I will come with him to see you. 24 Greet all your leaders and all the Lord’s people. Those from Italy send you their greetings. 25 Grace be with you all.

[blasater1960]

Forgot I had this link also on Melchizedek:(And he is a Christian)

Melchizedek

[patlin]

FYI...Errors in Hebrews...line by line

Thank you for the detailed reply. It is going to take me a long time to get through it. However, I see a problem right at the gate...you continue to use Christian religious doctrine which is what one must NOT do to discern the truth. Giving answers based solely on rejection of Messiah that is due to false Christian religious doctrine without showing where the English text changed the meaning of the Greek text also does not give “Light” to the truth. This is exactly why the division of YHVH’s house continues; opinions of man that are strictly based on religion of man.

Another extremely important point I will make at this time is that “In the beginning” YHVH spoke to directly to our ancestors, the world did not begin in the desert at Mt Sinai. This was HIS original intent. YHVH never wanted a fleshly mediator to be between HE and man. YHVH is the original High Priest(”Malki-Tzedek” which is a title not person) and that priesthood has never existed on earth but; has always existed in YHVH’s kingdom in heaven.

Since our last chat, I have taken time to further study the “Order of Malki-Tzedek”. I have come to a better understanding of the possibility of YHVH using Shem as HIS messenger of the heavenly Malki-Tzedek Priesthood. I do believe this is true but not for reasons told of in the Talmud, Midrashim or other writings. The “Order of Malki-Tzedek” is indeed the heavenly priesthood which was before the beginning. It was through this priestly order in which the 1st sacrifice occurred... YHVH sacrifices an animal in order to provide cover & protect man(iysh) who had sinned. It is also, in my opinion, the greatest showing of YHVH’s grace in the entire Scriptures and it is this original state of grace that we currently live under until HE brings us to live in HIS kingdom.

The Aaronic/Levitical priesthood is a reflection of the heavenly “Malki-Tzedek Priestly Order”, not the other way around as man did not exist before YHVH and everything HE created or commanded existed before HE formed adam.

I understand your rejection of Rabbi Sha’ul writings because it is wholly based on false Christian religious doctrine. If I was an orthodox Jew, I too would reject who they teach Jesus, their Messiah is... one who came to establish a new priestly order, an entirely new church & an entirely new religious doctrine based on some imaginary new set of commandments that cannot be found anywhere in the 1st century writings that rejects all that is YHVH. The fact is, there is absolutely nothing new in the 1st century writings that is not confirmed by Torah & the Prophets. Not one iota!!!

The reason religious doctrine continues to divide YHVH's children is because all religions only study what supports their religious doctrine. I became increasingly aware of this recently when I found out that certain text of the Prophets are not studied by Judaism(Is 53 for example), just as the false religious doctrine of Christianity denies Torah in order to continue their pagan traditions that YHVH calls abominations.

“Spirit & Word” has no form but it can speak through a form (Malki-Tzedek/Shem).

SHALOM!