Author: LDS is 'dangerous religion' [Romney article]

Deseret News ^ | May 31, 2011 | Hal Boyd

[Colofornian]

Bill Keller infamously announced in 2007, "If you vote for Mitt Romney, you are voting for Satan!"

While expressing less vitriol in his delivery, evangelical author Warren Cole Smith said something similar in his recent article, "A Vote for Romney Is a Vote for the LDS Church."

Smith wrote, "I believe a candidate who either by intent or effect promotes a false and dangerous religion is unfit to serve. … A Romney presidency would have the effect of actively promoting a false religion in the world. If you have any regard for the Gospel of Christ, you should care. A false religion should not prosper with the support of Christians. The salvation of souls is at stake."

Mormon scholar and author Joanna Brooks spoke with Smith about his views regarding Mormonism. In the interview posted on religiondispatches.org, Brooks said: "I can understand from an evangelical perspective why you view our religion as 'false.' But why do you think we are 'dangerous?'"

Smith replied, "Let me ask you: is anything that is false not dangerous? Anything false is dangerous. Falsehood leads to danger."

Brooks countered by asking if other faiths he considered theologically "false" like Judaism and Catholicism are also dangerous. Smith said that those faiths are both different from Mormonism.

[Colofornian]

This is a fair point, but you’re reaching back pretty far to the mid to late 1800s when Mormons were living in a sparsely settled U.S. Territory in what they called Deseret at the time. In modern times, Mormons tend to be pretty well integrated into American society both culturally and politically.

I posted the following in a January '11 thread to Zakeet:

Zakeet had mentioned: Temple Mormons such as Romney and Huntsman have prayed for the overthrow of the US Government as punishment for 19th century Mormon Persecution. Although the Temple Ceremony has changed since these gentlemen made their solemn oaths, they have never renounced the promises they made before their Mormon god.

I responded:

Very good post overall -- except I have a question related to this part above.

I believe, if I'm not mistaken, that the temple oaths to which you are referencing here were removed by the Lds "prophet" around 1926 or 1927. Mitt Romney was born in 1948.

So while George Romney may have been alive when these oaths were taken -- and it is true that those who took them were to pass them down 2 or 3 generations (which would thereby include Mitt & Huntsman's generation), I'm not sure we can say these men made such solemn oaths...only that their grandfathers and great grandfathers did...and that their grandfathers & great grandfathers were under solemn obligation to pass them down to the generations of Mitt Romney and Huntsman.

****

Anyway, I'm pointing out that the Mormon 'tude toward the U.S. extended well past the 19th century. Revenge oaths were still part of the Mormon church for over a quarter of the 20th century...about 85 years ago.

And these oaths were sworn by people who swore they would teach them 2-3 generations down the pike.

I guess then it depends upon how well you think Mormon parents alive in the mid-1920s were able to keep their sworn promises made before their god.

[afraidfortherepublic]

You are mixing TODAY’s practice with HISTORY which most Mormons denounced when they became citizens of the US. And, yes, I do know a little bit about Mormon practices and teachings. I know that there is much to admire about their family life, even if I do not believe their religion.

I would rather live next door to a Mormon family than to some FReepers who comment regularly here. I’m not going to comment further because I really do not like the ugly tone of this thread.

[abigail2]

I think this article is typical of the problem with "Christian" religions today. ANd why we are losing America to Godless socialists and murderous muslims. They lose sight of principles of Christianity and start finger pointing at each other instead of keeping their eyes on their self. Romney is a decent man. Alot of people in different religions are decent. Yet we bicker and finger point and forget that the bible says "know thyself", and don't try to take the sliver out of someone elses eye....you know the rest. As long as a person is decent and honorable he is my friend. If he is a Barney Frank or a Gadafi no, he is not my friend.

We should not belong to different churches except the Church of Finding the Truth...whenever two or more are gathered in my name...he did not say two or more Baptists, or two or more methodists...or Christian Scientist...Two decent people...

This is why we are in the state we are...

[greyfoxx39]

I am an Episcopalian but I would probably rather a President take spiritual advice from the head of the LDS church than the Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church.

Both the head of the LDS and Mitt have taken this solemn vow in the mormon temple: " You and each of you covenant and promise before God, angels, and these witnesses at this altar, that you do accept the Law of Consecration as contained in the Doctrine and Covenants, in that you do consecrate yourselves, your time, talents, and everything with which the Lord has blessed you, or with which he may bless you, to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, for the building up of the Kingdom of God on the earth and for the establishment of Zion.

Now, do you really want the dictatorship of the mormon church being the final word on the business of the nation? Remember, Romney asked permission of the mormon leadership to run for president.

[Colofornian]

Given a binary choice, greater or lesser evil, which would YOU choose?

First of all there's never only a "binary" choice. (There's ALWAYS a third-party vote if the GOP slits its own throat...or aren't you aware that the Whigs are no longer around & a new party called the GOP arose in the mid-1850s?)

We need peripheral vision...elsewise, if we're only beholden to the current campaign, people would vote for a Hitler type in a nanosecond if a worst evil candidate was running vs. him.

Take the biggest "loser" of a GOP candidate...say a pro-abort, pro-national healthcare, pro-homosexual candidate. Guess what? If you vote for such a candidate, you've wasted your vote. He will lose. Voting for a losing candidate -- even by people who think in your terms -- is indeed a wasted vote...which I thought was anathema to you.

So why would you waste your vote on a candidate you know will lose -- and taint your convictions & conscience in the process? And stab the GOP party in the back at the same time?

Vote for the lesser evil. Vote for the greater evil. Don’t vote and have no influence on the outcome. I’m really curious.

No. I wouldn't vote for Hitler in the 1930s Germany even if he were running vs. the anti-Christ.

Let me repeat what I wrote last Friday:

...there's a clear line in the sand. When the wife of a 40-yo marriage no longer sits in the middle portion of the seat of a pick-up truck, who moved?

We're not pushing the exit button; if the GOP decides to do that by electing Romney, they've exited and are threatening the entire party with Whigism.

At that point, should it occur, the GOP needs to clearly understand the true meaning of a "wasted vote." Too many GOPers in that circumstance would be tempted to think voting Third Party is a "wasted vote."

Allow me to be clear: Voting for Romney or a RINO is not only a wasted vote, but it's a vote for implosion of the GOP. It would be like planting extinction yeast in its very midst!

The GOP's already been guilty of tolerating too much moral erosion under the guise of "Big Tentism"; it's on a perilous course of implosion if it thinks its base will tolerate this.

We're not going to stand idly by when the RINOs attempts its GOP coups.

[Tennessee Nana]

I’ll add to my litany of plusses about Romney — at least he isn’t in favor of killing innocent babies
______________________________________________

Rombney has been ultra pro-abortiuon for more than 40 years

When ghe ran against Teddy Kennedy in 1994 for US Senate of MASS he claimed to be morte pro-aborion than Teddy

When he ran for MASS Gov in 2002 he claimed to be pro-abortion unlike his pro-life opponent who he slurred foir her pro-life record

In 2005 he was proud of his record of saying “I will protect a womans right to choose”

There have been many posts and videos about Romneys gruesome record on abortion

including his RomneyCare provisionb for $50 abortions in MASS

[mnehring]

I missed your comment. I was freepmailed that another forum claims i had it deleted- I didn’t. I’m not one to hit abuse, more of a forum anarchist myself. :)

[svcw]

A dangerous religion is one who aligns itself with:
a religion that excuses the killing of Jewish children.
a religion that requires women to be covered.
a religion that complains a terrorist is buried at sea.

[svcw]

At least Catholics believe in an Eternal Jesus and they do not believe that God was once a man.

[svcw]

No Romeny is pro-abortion. the so called pro-life stance only came about last election cycle. When he ran for senate he said he was more pro-choice than Kennedy.

[svcw]

I cannot recall any lds denounce the lds past, I have seen many deny it happened.

[svcw]

You might have a point if mormonISM was a Christian belief system.

[Colofornian]

Yet we bicker and finger point and forget that the bible says "know thyself", and don't try to take the sliver out of someone elses eye..

All done as you finger point, trying to remove the sliver out of our eyes, eh? (Which doctor approved your spiritual & political eyesight as "perfect" enough to perform such a task, I might ask?)

They lose sight of principles of Christianity and start finger pointing at each other instead of keeping their eyes on their self. Romney is a decent man.

If he is so "decent" then why has he retained a "prophet" he adheres to that labeled ALL Christians as "corrupt" and ALL their creeds as an "abomination?" (A later generation of Mormons were so enthralled with these claims they labeled them Mormon "scripture" -- see Joseph Smith History vv. 18-19 in the Pearl of Great Price). And since this is Mormon "scripture," it's not as though Romney can easily "take or leave" these claims.

This same "prophet" (Smith) labels all Christians as "apostate."

Tell me Abigail. Take your deepest beliefs. And this candidate considers them putrid (the literal meaning of abomination). Does that inspire you to vote for him? Really?

Tell me Abigail. Take whatever membership you hold most "sacred" in your life. And this candidate considers that you're actually an "apostate" from that group -- you just don't realize it. Does that inspire you to vote for him? Really?

...Christian Scientist

And the fact that you lump Christian Science alongside Christian groups like "Baptist" says a LOT about your lack of discernment...

Why stop at Christian Science? Why not Wiccan? Why not New Age groups? Sounds to me like you'd be a decent spokesperson for the Bahai faith, which would like to reduce what all religions believe so that it would sound as if they all believe the same thing.

[rickomatic]

What’s the difference between Romney and the current president?

One wears boxers, and the other one wears magic?

[Colofornian]

I'll add to my litany of plusses about Romney -- at least he isn't in favor of killing innocent babies, unlike the present occupant of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

Oh, no?

Dec, 2007: Romney is being interviewed by Katie Couric. Romney is speaking "pro-life" by mentioning the adoption of embryos. Then in the very next sentence he talks about parents giving up their embryos for "research" (destruction).

Can you say schizophrenic?

Romney supposedly underwent a "pro-life" conversion in late 2004 over the very issue of embryo destruction!

Was Romney "pro-life" in 2005 and 2006?

In May 2005 -- 6 years ago -- Romney promised he would uphold the "status quo" of pro-abortion laws in MA...after his so-called "pro-life" conversion. What true pro-lifer says such a thing?

In 2006, Romney passed his pro-abortion healthcare which increased access to abortions in MA. He also failed to veto a portion of that healthcare which pinpointed a member of Planned Parenthood to be on the permanent oversight board. Romney vetoed some sections of that healthcare boondoggle; but not that one.

Then Chris Wallace was interviewing Romney August 2007. Romney told Wallace that he NEVER considered himself "pro-choice" because he never "felt" he was "pro-choice." So there he was telling all he was never pro-abortion, after all.

How can we believe ANYTHING this man says?

If you want transcript excerpts & details...I have them.

[Tennessee Nana]

I would rather live next door to a Mormon family than to some FReepers who comment regularly here
______________________________________________
*I wouldnt

Going to church next to one of their “stake” buildings waqs bad enough

When My children were small we lived in another state and when we came in from the parking lot the mormon children lined up along the fence would be encouraged by thge mormon adeults to tease our children

they would shout that our children were going to Hell because they were not mormons and other horrible stuff while the adults would laugh and egg them on

We ran a gurnlet every Sunday morning running into church

Our pastor went over to talk to the mormon bishop etc but he was cursed out and told so on

My little girl would scream with fear at the taunting of those nice neighborly mormons and they would sneer at her crying

What woulfd you have done if that was your little girl who loved the LORD Jesus Christ but was told repeatedly she was going to Hell because she wasnt a Mormon ???

[Elsie]

My prayer, on that other thread, seems to have literally come to pass these days!!

So, with that said, you DEMONS are to remain silent and let the Voice of GOD be heard and followed.

[Elsie]

I see my comment was deleted.

Did you say BAD words??

[Elsie]

I was going to comment, but others already have.

[Godzilla]

You are mixing TODAY’s practice with HISTORY which most Mormons denounced when they became citizens of the US.

Then you have a GROSS ignorance of history my FRiend as well as mormon teachings (contrary to your bleat).

Mormons were CITIZENS when Joseph Smith started violating the law of the land by starting polygamy.

Mormons were CITIZENS when prophet Wilford Woodruff issued the Manifesto in 1890 'ending' polygamy and allowing statehood to Utah. In reality, polygamy continued 'semi-officially' until about 1910 (and currently continues via FLDS).

Mormons were CITIZENS when smith established the illegal Kirkland Bank in Kirkland Ohio.

I would dare say mormons were citizens in 1927 when they removed the oath against the US Gov't.

Mormons were CITIZENS of the country throughout its history 'afraid' - and the foundations of their teachings promulgate even through the modern era - as I noted.

Even today, a requirement of membership is to get a testimony that joseph smith and the book of mormon are true. Even today temple mormons are being taught they are bound to be gods and goddesses - literally. Even today afraid, the predjudices of the past continue forward.

Again, we are not voting for your neighbor and your poor understanding of their doctrinal beliefs - we are voting for a president who's fundamental world view is shaped by the religion and teachings of joseph smith and mormonism. And that is a valid basis to evaluate him on - just like his supporters are even now touting his mormonism as a plus.