Posted on 03/25/2011 9:19:12 AM PDT by Colofornian
When the Paragon types; the linking is done.
We don't prove: we accuse.
--MormonDude(The proving of INNOCENCE is left to the accusee.)
It is simple. You have no idea what you are talking about. I do know Hebrew and if YOU knew Hebrew you would understand how the plural works.
A)Elohim, has a plural ending, -im but doesnt not mean more than one. (G-d doesnt contradict himself like you). For example, heaven in in Hebrew, is Shamayim. Are there three heavens? no. Is a description of vastness of heaven.
The same with water- Mayim.
Life- Chayim The face is Panim. Do you have more than one face?
G-d called Moses an Elohim in Exodus 7, is Moses also a god-man?
Judges are are called Elohim. Are they god-men?
The Hebrew word echad work exactly like the word one in english. You can have one set of something or actually one object.
2 Samuel 13:30 And it came to pass, while they were in the way, that tidings came to David, saying, Absalom hath slain all the king's sons, and there is not ONE (echad) of them left.
Eccl 4:8 8 There is ONE (echad) that is alone, and he hath not a second; yea, he hath neither son nor brother; yet is there no end of all his labour......
And Yachid is NOT the word for one. It means unique. The word for One is echad. And G-d calls himself one and never refers to himself as yachid. Why dont you just let G-d describe himself? He makes it abundantly clear.
You are not a fast learner. We have had this discussion before. Why dont you just stop trying to shoe-horn your god-man into G-d. You are no different than a mormon trying to defend his heresy.
OH!! They wuz gonna KILL us all and BURN us out and MAIM our children!
We just HAD to flee!
FACT: Lot's of mormons stayed behind and prospered and flourished, acquiring all the land and buildings that B.Y. decided to ABANDON on the ill-fated handcart journeys.
Prophet my butt!
Nice disclaimer...
Why are you so angry?
Could you please point out a single example of a Christian "attack" on MORMONism on FR?
(I'd like to see just what TRUTH is considered to be an ATTACK.)
You make my point. Water is both singular (water) and plural (waters) simultaneously.
Water is vaporized and less visible. Water can be "incarnated" (embodied) as ice. Such water is plural (vapor; ice; & in most recognized fluidity). But all is water (all same nature; substance).
Thank you for introducing my point.
Your fellow Karaite Jews sharply disagree with you. I have asked Karaites their opinion of the Kabbalah, they mince no words, calling it abominable, polytheistic, witchcraft.
I am over 40, by the way. I have read Gershom Sholem, etc. Anybody without a religion to defend, in your case Judaism, can see the sephiroths, mere attributes you call them, are but a form of occult theosophy.
It is widely known that occultists like Helena Blavasky adopt Kabbalistic principles and use them in their evil systems. So do the Freemasons and witchcraft systems. Just about everything on the evil, satanic, occult side uses the Kabbalah. The Karaites are right.
There you go!
Making it PERSONAL!
Deuteronomy 4:11-12 You came near and stood at the foot of the mountain while it blazed with fire to the very heavens, with black clouds and deep darkness. Then the Lord spoke to you out of the fire. You heard the sound of words but saw no image; there was only a voice.
Deuteronomy 4:35 You are the ones who have been shown, so that you will know that God is the Supreme Being, and there is none other besides Him!
Deuteronomy 4:39 Know therefore today, and take it to your heart, that the Lord, He is God in heaven above and on the earth below; there is no other!
Deuteronomy 6:14 You shall not follow other gods, any of the gods of the peoples who surround you!
Deuteronomy 32:39 See, now, that I, I am He — and no god is with Me.
I Samuel 2:2 There is none holy as the Lord, for there is none beside Thee; neither is there any Rock like our God.
I Kings 8:27 For will God indeed dwell on the earth? Behold the heaven and heaven of heavens cannot contain Thee, how much less this house that I have built?
I Kings 8:60 So that all the nations of the earth may know that the Lord is God and that there is no other!
II Kings 19:19 Now, O Lord our God, deliver us from his hand, so that all kingdoms on earth may know that You alone, O Lord, are God
Isaiah 40:18 To whom then will you liken God? To what likeness will you compare unto Him?
Isaiah 40:25 “To whom then will you liken Me, that I should be his equal?” says the Holy One.
Isaiah 42:8 I am the Lord, that is My name, and My glory will I not give to another. Neither My praise to graven images!
Isaiah 43:10-11 “You are My witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and My servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe Me and understand that I am He. Before Me no god was formed, nor will there be one after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.”
Isaiah 44:6-8 This is what the Lord says, Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty, “I am the first and I am the last; apart from Me there is no God! Who then is like Me? Let him proclaim it. Let him declare and lay out before Me . . . . Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are My witnesses. Is there any God besides Me? No, there is no other Rock; I know not one.”
Isaiah 44:24 Thus said the Lord, your Redeemer, the One who formed you from the womb, “I am the Lord Who makes everything, Who stretched forth the heavens alone, Who spread out the earth by Myself.”
Isaiah 45:5-6 I am the Lord, and there is no other; besides Me there is no God; I will strengthen you . . . . In order that they know from the shining of the sun and from the west that there is no one besides Me; I am the Lord and there is no other!
Isaiah 45:21-22 . . . Who announced this from before, who declared it from the distant past? Is it not I, the Lord, and there is no God apart from Me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none but Me. Turn to Me and be saved, all you ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other!
Isaiah 46:5 To whom shall you liken Me and make Me equal and compare Me that we may be alike?
Isaiah 46:9 Remember the first things of old, that I am God and there is no other; I am God and there is none like Me.
Isaiah 48:11 . . . My honor I will not give to another.
Hosea 13:4 I am the Lord your God, Who brought you out of Egypt. You shall acknowledge no god but Me, no savior except Me!
Joel 2:27 You shall know that I am in the midst of Israel, and I am the Lord your God, there is no other; and My people shall never be ashamed.
Malachi 2:10 Have we not all one Father? Has not one God created us? Why should we betray, each one his brother, to profane the covenant of our forefathers?
Psalm 73:25 Whom have I in heaven but You? Earth has nothing I desire besides You.
Psalm 81:8-9 Hear, O My people, and I will admonish you; O Israel, if you would listen to Me! Let there be no strange god among you; nor shall you worship any foreign god.
Nehemiah 9:6 You alone are the Lord; You made the heavens, the heaven of the heavens and all their host, the earth and all that is upon it, the seas and all that is in them, and You give life to all, and the heavenly host bow down before You.
I Chronicles 17:20 O Lord, there is none like You, neither is there any god beside You, according to all that we have heard with our ears!
How much more clear could HaShem be? If he was sharing his nature, glory and equal with another, He would have said so PLAINLY and DIRECTLY. Certainly by the time of Sinai and the giving of Torah, he would have said, I have another, he is my son and he is me. Or, I am three yet one etc....
G-d NEVER introduces another as part of his Onesss, therefore, you make him out to be a liar and a deciever who WITHHOLDS his nature from us, all the while telling us of his soliatary oneness.
Karaites? So what. They are not mainstream Judaism. I personally do not study Kabbalah. Does mainstream Judaism consider Kabbalah the study of 10-in-1 godhead, like Christianity? no.
“Anybody without a religion to defend, in your case Judaism.”
To clarify what I said here. In your case you are not defending Judaism per se, but your flavor of Judaism: Kabbalist Judaism. Karaite Judaism is not Kabbalistic.
No I didnt. There is no "water" or "waters" in Hebrew, only MAYIM. Your point fails.
So what if water takes different forms. That proves nothing. Youare still making G-d out to be a liar because he says he is One, NO FORM, No other savior, no other Rock, etc....If G-d was 3-in-1 he would have PLAINLY and DIRECTLY said so. He did not.
Only one giant problem with your statement. Mormons ARE Christian. Although you may have misunderstandings about what it means to be Christian you qualify too. It could be much better though if you got out of your anti-Mormon cult.
For the Christians who read this interchange between Blasater and myself, you might ask what has this to do with the subject of this thread? Plenty. Here’s the connection: Kabbalist Judaism - Gnosticism - Freemasonry - Joseph Smith - Mormonism.
Joseph Smith was a Freemason and an occultist. Many of Mormonism’s doctrines are Kabbalist/Gnostic/Masonic and occult based.
MORMONs believe and acknowledge the following.
What more do you want?
Joseph Smith continues: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (, p.270).Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (, p. 119).Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" ( 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" ( 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" ( 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (, vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" ( 10:230).Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (, p. 255).Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (, 18:172).President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (, vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (, 10:127).James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (, p.182).President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (, vol. 3, p.282).More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (, p.316).President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (, vol. 2, p.196).
A statue?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.