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Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ
LDS.org ^ | Dennis B. Neuenschwander

Posted on 01/02/2011 5:46:30 PM PST by Paragon Defender

Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ

By Elder Dennis B. Neuenschwander Of the Seventy

 

 

 

Dennis B. Neuenschwander, “Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ,” Ensign, Jan 2009, 16–22

Adapted from a presentation to the Seventy.

 

 

 

In the Doctrine and Covenants we read that Joseph Smith was “called of God, and ordained an apostle of Jesus Christ” (D&C 20:2). The call of an Apostle is first to witness or testify of Jesus Christ. Old Testament prophets testified of His coming. The New Testament Apostles bore personal witness of Christ’s being and of the absolute reality of His Resurrection. This apostolic witness was the basis of their teaching. “Ye shall be witnesses unto me” (Acts 1:8) was Jesus’s instruction to the original Twelve. Peter testified on the day of Pentecost to the Jews who had gathered “out of every nation” (Acts 2:5) that “this Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses” (Acts 2:32). Similarly, Paul wrote to the Corinthians that Jesus “was seen of me also” (1 Corinthians 15:8). The sure witness of Christ’s being and the reality of His Resurrection is the first pillar of apostolic testimony.

The second pillar is centered on the Savior’s redemptive and saving power. Peter teaches that to the Lord “give all the Prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins” (Acts 10:43).

Without these twin pillars of testimony concerning Christ, there could be no Apostle. Such testimonies are born of experience, divine command, and instruction. For example, Luke writes that Christ showed Himself to the Apostles “alive after his passion … being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God” (Acts 1:3).

How does the Prophet Joseph Smith fit into these apostolic requirements? The answer is “Perfectly.”

The First Vision

Joseph Smith’s apostolic instruction began in 1820. Pondering the questions of religion, he soon found that there was no way to reason or argue one’s opinion to an authoritative conclusion concerning the correctness of the various churches or their doctrines. Short of a divine manifestation, young Joseph could add only one more opinion to the already existing “war of words and tumult of opinions” (Joseph Smith—History 1:10). But Joseph’s questions on religion were answered by the personal and physical manifestation of God the Father and His divine and living Son, Jesus Christ—an experience referred to as the First Vision.

Like that of the original Apostles, Joseph’s experience with Deity was direct and personal. There was no need for the opinion of others or the deliberations of a council to define what he saw or what it came to mean to him. Joseph’s vision was at first an intensely personal experience—an answer to a specific question. Over time, however, illuminated by additional experience and instruction, it became the founding revelation of the Restoration.

As apostolic as this manifestation of Christ’s being, existence, and Resurrection was to Joseph Smith, it was not the only thing Jesus wanted to teach him. The boy Joseph’s first lesson arose from the manifestation of Christ’s absolute, omnipotent, and divine power. Joseph learned firsthand at least one meaning of the redeeming and saving power of Christ when he prayed in the grove. As he began to pray, “Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction” (Joseph Smith—History 1:15). With every bit of energy Joseph had, he began to call upon God to deliver him from the grasp of this enemy.

“At the very moment when I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction … , I saw a pillar of light. …

“It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound” (Joseph Smith—History 1:16–17).

Joseph Smith’s confrontation with the adversary is reminiscent of an experience Moses had, about which the Prophet would learn some few years later. Unlike the boy Joseph, however, Moses saw God’s greatness first and then was confronted with the power of the adversary before being delivered from his influence. (See Moses 1.)

The difference in the order of events is significant. Moses was already far into maturity and had much knowledge and influence prior to this event. By displaying His magnificent power to Moses before he faced the adversary, the Lord helped Moses put his life into perspective. After experiencing God’s glory, Moses said, “Now, for this cause I know that man is nothing, which thing I never had supposed” (Moses 1:10). This incident enabled Moses to withstand the temptations of the adversary that followed.

Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was an inexperienced young man, who in his lifetime would repeatedly face adversarial power and the overwhelming problems it brings. By facing the adversary first, then being saved from his assault by the appearance of the Father and the Son, Joseph learned this indelible lesson: as great as the power of evil might be, it must always withdraw with the appearance of righteousness.

This lesson was critical in Joseph’s apostolic education. He needed this knowledge not only because of the personal trials that lay ahead of him but also because of the overwhelming opposition he would face in founding and directing the Church.

The boy Joseph went into the grove seeking wisdom, and wisdom he received. His apostolic instruction had begun. Among the great apostolic lessons of this First Vision were both the physical nature of the Savior and Heavenly Father and the initial and fundamental lessons relating to Their power—each a pillar of apostolic testimony.

The Book of Mormon

Joseph Smith’s early apostolic instruction continued with his translation of the Book of Mormon. The Book of Mormon gave Joseph access to “the fulness of the everlasting Gospel” (Joseph Smith—History 1:34), principles that were necessary to understand even prior to the organization of the Church. The Prophet was introduced to numerous “plain and most precious” (1 Nephi 13:26) prophetic and apostolic testimonies regarding the Savior, all of which served as models for him.

Indeed, the Book of Mormon prophets employ over 100 titles in their teachings of Christ, each of which helped Joseph understand the Savior’s divine role.1 By virtue of these teachings, Joseph Smith became intimately acquainted with ancient prophets, giving him insight into the divine purpose of his responsibilities.

The Book of Mormon illuminates the universality of Christ’s Atonement. The Savior’s holy sacrifice is not confined to the borders of the Holy Land of His day or even restricted to the apostolic world of the original Twelve. The Atonement encompasses all of God’s creations—past, present, and future. What an impression Jacob’s teaching of the “infinite atonement” (2 Nephi 9:7) must have made on the mind of young Joseph, especially in contrast to Christian teachings at the time.

The Book of Mormon also introduces the universality of the Resurrection and other doctrines relating to it. Discourses on this doctrine by Lehi, Jacob, King Benjamin, Abinadi, Alma, Amulek, Samuel the Lamanite, and Moroni are all rich sources of instruction.

During the translation of the Book of Mormon, the Prophet received additional valuable personal instruction concerning the redemptive and saving power of Christ. In 1828 Martin Harris persuaded Joseph to lend him the first 116 pages of the Book of Mormon manuscript. When Martin Harris lost those pages, the Prophet felt an enormous despair.2 His mother, Lucy Mack Smith, recorded that Joseph exclaimed: “Oh, my God! … All is lost! all is lost! What shall I do? I have sinned—it is I who tempted the wrath of God. … How shall I appear before the Lord? Of what rebuke am I not worthy from the angel of the Most High?”3

For well over a month the Lord left Joseph in this terrible condition of remorse.4 Then came relief and the apostolic lesson. The Lord told Joseph:

“The works, and the designs, and the purposes of God cannot be frustrated, neither can they come to naught. …

“For although a man may have many revelations, and have power to do many mighty works, yet if he boasts in his own strength, and sets at naught the counsels of God, and follows after the dictates of his own will and carnal desires, he must fall and incur the vengeance of a just God upon him” (D&C 3:1, 4).

These words carefully describe what Joseph Smith had been experiencing. He had learned the exacting nature of the apostolic call and to whom the Apostle, at all cost, owes his loyalty. “Although men set at naught the counsels of God, and despise his words,” Joseph was told, “yet you should have been faithful” (D&C 3:7–8). Joseph Smith had lost access to the plates for a season and had been taught an invaluable lesson. Subsequently, the plates were returned, and his position as translator restored.

How critical were the lessons provided by the translation of the Book of Mormon as Joseph Smith grew in his apostolic calling! The Book of Mormon is the “keystone of our religion”5 because it contains so many prophetic testimonies of Christ and stands as a tangible witness of the Restoration.

Continuing Revelation and Scripture

After finishing the translation of the Book of Mormon in 1829 and organizing the Church in 1830, Joseph Smith had the opportunity to receive continuing apostolic education through the process of translating other scripture. This included three years of translating the Bible and, beginning in 1835, translating the book of Abraham. Joseph Smith’s translation of the Bible expanded his understanding of the role of Old Testament prophets and New Testament Apostles. It also resulted in additional revelation, namely the book of Moses.

The book of Moses provided the Prophet with important knowledge about the Savior’s ministry, including His role in the Creation. “The Lord spake unto Moses, saying: … I am the Beginning and the End, the Almighty God; by mine Only Begotten I created these things” (Moses 2:1). Further, He said, “And worlds without number have I created; … and by the Son I created them, which is mine Only Begotten” (Moses 1:33).

The book of Moses clarified Christ’s relationship to the Father in the premortal existence and reinforced the Prophet’s understanding of the ascendant power of righteousness. One of the most beautiful of all the apostolic lessons that came to Joseph Smith in this revelation was the confirmation of God’s love. It was so different from the harsh, unforgiving, and judgmental personage so many believed God to be; the book of Moses reveals a God of infinite compassion. Enoch saw that the “God of heaven … wept” (Moses 7:28) over those who would not receive Him. Wishing to know how it was possible, Enoch was given an answer that has a familiar biblical feel to it: “I [have] given commandment, that they should love one another, and that they should choose me, their Father. … Wherefore should not the heavens weep, seeing these shall suffer?” (Moses 7:33, 37; see also Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18; Matthew 22:37–39).

Through the translation of the book of Moses, the Prophet also became more acquainted with the redeeming and saving power of the Savior. As the Lord said, this earth was created “by the word of my power” (Moses 1:32) for the purpose of bringing “to pass the immortality and eternal life of man” (Moses 1:39). Many long years before the Savior taught Thomas and the Twelve that “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me” (John 14:6), He revealed to Moses that “this is the plan of salvation unto all men, through the blood of mine Only Begotten, who shall come in the meridian of time” (Moses 6:62).

The First Vision in the grove, the translation of the Book of Mormon, the revision of the Bible, the revelation of the book of Moses, and the translation of the book of Abraham laid the basic foundation of the Church, largely through the rapidly expanding knowledge and testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith relating to Jesus Christ.

Revelations given to him and compiled in the Doctrine and Covenants contain a wealth of knowledge concerning the Savior. One could research the numerous topics and cross-references of the Topical Guide and Guide to the Scriptures referring to Jesus Christ and still not understand the breadth of information on the Savior that the Prophet Joseph Smith brought to the world. I am grateful to know that Jesus was “in the beginning with the Father” (D&C 93:21). I am grateful to know that He “suffered these things for [me], that [I] might not suffer if [I] would repent” (D&C 19:16).

My Testimony of What the Prophet Revealed

I am grateful for yet one other thing about the Savior’s ministry that stirs my soul deeply. From studying the promises of Malachi, Moroni’s initial visit with Joseph, the Savior’s words to the Nephites, and the visit of Elijah in the Kirtland Temple, I learn that God loves His children and has provided a way for each to return to Him. I know of no doctrine more just, no teaching that gives more hope than that of redemption of the dead. I am so grateful for the revelations that teach me that the Savior’s Atonement reaches to those who have lived, loved, served, and hoped for a better day yet never heard of Jesus or had the opportunity to embrace His gospel. This knowledge alone would be sufficient to convert me to the gospel if I knew nothing else at all. Here, at least for me, is the ultimate testimony of Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice.

What, then, can be said of the incomparable saving power of Christ? That which Joseph Smith learned in the Sacred Grove about the power of righteousness overcoming evil foreshadows the final scene. So reveals the Lord:

“I, having accomplished and finished the will of him whose I am, even the Father, concerning me—having done this that I might subdue all things unto myself—

“Retaining all power, even to the destroying of Satan and his works at the end of the world, and the last great day of judgment” (D&C 19:2–3).

Our own testimonies of the Savior are framed by the testimony and teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith. Is it any wonder then that the Prophet taught that “the fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it.”6

Joseph Smith’s apostolic testimony of the divine reality and the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, as well as his knowledge of the redemptive and saving power of the Savior, can best be seen by the Prophet’s own beautiful, powerful, and succinct witness:

“And now, after the many testimonies which have been given of him, this is the testimony, last of all, which we give of him: That he lives!

“For we saw him, even on the right hand of God; and we heard the voice bearing record that he is the Only Begotten of the Father—

“That by him, and through him, and of him, the worlds are and were created, and the inhabitants thereof are begotten sons and daughters unto God” (D&C 76:22–24).

How grateful I am for the apostolic call of Joseph Smith.

 

 

 

Notes

1. See Book of Mormon Reference Companion, ed. Dennis L. Largey (2003), 457–58.

2. See Lucy Mack Smith, History of Joseph Smith, ed. Preston Nibley (1958), 128–29.

3. History of Joseph Smith, 128, 129.

4. The 116 pages were lost in June 1828. In July Joseph Smith received what is now section 3 of the Doctrine and Covenants. In September the plates were returned to the Prophet. See the historical introductions to D&C 3; 10.

5. History of the Church, 4:461.

6. History of the Church, 3:30.

 

 

 

 

 

 


TOPICS: Breaking News; Other Christian; Theology; Worship
KEYWORDS: braking; cult; heresy; inman; lds; lies; mormon; notbreakingnews; propaganda; religion
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To: MHGinTN

> “In Satira Veritas”

= = = =

Copyright me... but I’m honored that you wish to quote it.

:O)


1,441 posted on 01/04/2011 11:12:13 AM PST by Clique
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To: F15Eagle
Certainly quite a difference when you study under somebody who actually knows it and believes it.

Absolutely there's a difference...and you soak it up when you understand and recognize that difference. Plus, once you have an outstanding teacher you seek those out when possible, having now a point of reference. Unfortunately there are many who should not be teaching at all...they are far from God and have little grasp of His word for that.

I had the great Privilege to learn from a very wise and dedicated Pastor/Teacher in a church attended. Learning more in that year than at any other church along the way. He was unafraid to go into the deep things of God and encouraged the participants opinions and incite, many of which were other Pastors who came to hear him.

You can imagine the dynamics that occurred in this small group of 25. All learned and grew to know more about Jesus and love Him more for that.....This Pastor was big on equipping the saints...and he did just that. Once you know what that is about you also recognize what it isn't.

When I finally did leave it was in the midst of a huge endeavor....of going thru the complete works of "William Barclay"...we all purchased our own set which I have to this day.

1,442 posted on 01/04/2011 11:24:53 AM PST by caww
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To: greyfoxx39; Jim Robinson; Admin Moderator; Religion Moderator; Sidebar Moderator; restornu; ...
When someone OWNS a site, he can darn well make or break any so-called rule he wishes. Additionally, just exactly WHERE are you finding these rules? The "back room, the warning, then the suspension then the banning?"

Many moons ago, when I first transgressed in a religion forum, a kindly Religion Mod explained the rules to me.

I have been corrected from time to time since, and I have accepted that correction. This was an overreaction.

I had someone on this forum tell me once that I was not qualified to judge something I could not do my self.

My response was that I did not play the Violin, but that did not keep me from knowing when someone else shouldn't either.

I do not run a forum on-line, that does not keep me from knowing when someone else hit a sour note on their violin in the midst of a symphony.

I do note that you are pinging everyone you can in the hopes of getting me banned. If it happens, It happens. I like a good conservative will not be coerced, corrupted, or cajoled into changing my support for what I know to be true.

If Mormons are not welcome here, then ban me forthwith and make it clear to all.

If Mormons who are conservative are welcome on this site (which is supposed to be about being conservative) similarly show it by telling posters like grefoxx39 to knock it off.

I guess there is the third way which is to leave it unclear by doing nothing, "anti"s of all stripes will continue to attack, religious defenders will continue to respond and the site will spend more time on religion than on politics, which would be sad.

Jim, what do you want Free-republic to be when it grows up, a religion debate site, or a site about fixing our political system?

Let me be clear, Mormons cannot do anything to hurt Free republic, only free republic can hurt itself. and Free republic and the posters here cannot hurt the church, only the church can do that to itself.

Delph
1,443 posted on 01/04/2011 11:29:15 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser
"Lying for the lord" is a concept I did not even have until I came to FR and saw it in action by "so called Christians"

I believe you knew it and are adept in the practice.

Google the term "lying for the Lord" and is it a huge coincidence that almost ever hit is Mormon related?

1,444 posted on 01/04/2011 11:30:10 AM PST by colorcountry (Comforting lies are not your friends. Painful truths are not your enemies.)
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To: DelphiUser

Please link a post by me where I threatened to ban Mormons.


1,445 posted on 01/04/2011 11:32:18 AM PST by Jim Robinson (Rebellion is brewing!! Nuke the corrupt commie bastards to HELL!!)
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To: WVKayaker; Elsie; County Agent Hank Kimball; F15Eagle; Osage Orange

WVKayaker-First off if I was a Jehovah Witness, I would have no problem saying so, but I am not...

My religious life started with the Jehovah Witnesses as a child, and for that I am greatful, as that is who introduced me to GOD...... I was baptized in the Lutheran Church, spent years in that denomination until I married and ended up in a Catholic Church for a few years, then I left to attend a non-denominational Christian Church where I have remained.

I do not have to prove my relationship with Jesus Christ to you or my salvation, and frankly I find your post very odd as you seem to have *Chosen* yourself a *False GOD* by what you have *Fooled* yourself to know about me....

IMHO you seek to divide by your comments...

A house divided can not stand nor is the Body of Christ divided (the church). What body member do you have that has attacked another?

LUKE 9:50

When the disciples came to Jesus to tell Him that others were preaching in His name. They came in a self-righteous attitude of “how dare they!” What does Jesus do but rebuke them and says, “Do not hinder him; for he who is not against you is for you

IN CLOSING:
One Christ unit’s One Body of His and has one central theme:

Jesus died for our sins, He was crucified in our place so that we might have eternal fellowship and life with God to enjoy Him forever, and glorify, praise and worship Him for eternity in great joy.

When Christians lower their swords against each other and wield them against the one who it is intended for, then the true purpose for the sword is found. Scripture indicated that It is most certainly not intended for other Christians.


1,446 posted on 01/04/2011 11:35:47 AM PST by TaraP (An APPEASER is one who feeds a crocodile - hoping it will eat him last)
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To: Elsie
Just WHY don't you folks follow what GOD told you to do in D&C 132 instead of what the GOV'T tells you not to do?

Because God told us to obey the law of the land... AOF 12

Delph
1,447 posted on 01/04/2011 11:35:52 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: T Minus Four
Thanks, but I didn’t ask for a definition of “burning in the bosom”. I asked what brought you to believe that the bible is true.

God told me it was true at the same time, in the same way and in response to the same prayer where he told me the Book of Mormon was true.

God also testified that Jesus was my savior, that he came down to earth, died for me, and broke the bands of death for me.

I will never be worthy of the love Jesus has shown me. That love is reflected in all the Christians I have ever met. I have never met an anti of any religion that showed that love, therefore, all anti's in my opinion have never come to Jesus, or they would be too busy loving people to attack them.

God bless and teach you his ways.

Delph
1,448 posted on 01/04/2011 11:41:40 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: reaganaut; T Minus Four
If the Bible is true, Mormonism is false. If Mormonism is true then the Bible is false.

real simple there.


Real simple minded there...Fixed it!

Delph
1,449 posted on 01/04/2011 11:43:42 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser
OK, let's try to nail down this jello. I asked know you "knew" the bible was true.

You said "God told me it was true at the same time, in the same way and in response to the same prayer where he told me the Book of Mormon was true"

So in what was was that? a feeling? a burning? Had you ever read either book before this prayer? How do you know it was God who answered the prayer?

1,450 posted on 01/04/2011 11:49:52 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: DelphiUser; All

If I could ask one question to everyone who has taken this thread to almost 1500 posts..

I would ask:

If everyone on here has accepted Jesus Christ into thier heart, repented of thier sins,and are trying to lead a life of Christ by praise, worship and service....

*THEN WHAT IS THE PROBLEM*????

Sorry did not mean to scream...


1,451 posted on 01/04/2011 11:51:14 AM PST by TaraP (An APPEASER is one who feeds a crocodile - hoping it will eat him last)
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To: DelphiUser; restornu
Like the Allies surrounded in WWII, I am free to attack in any direction!

Keep up DU, Resty's already fighting World War ELEVEN! :-)

1,452 posted on 01/04/2011 11:52:45 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: T Minus Four
Delph: Tithing was not a mosaic law, Abraham followed it, so it was not fulfilled, besides the early Christians followed it too.

T: How would you know?

I read the Bible, Tithing is all through it, some of the early Christians even wanted to have all things in common, that's in there too.

IMHO Regardless of what denomination you are, all Bible followers should be paying tithing to their church

So your opinion on the matter is final?

Yep, My opinion is final, yours may vary.

Delph
1,453 posted on 01/04/2011 11:53:22 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: cruise_missile; greyfoxx39; colorcountry; Colofornian; Elsie; Godzilla; MHGinTN; narses; ...
I thought it was Brigham Young that said their was Quaker like people on the moon?

You're on the right track.

It was actually Joseph who said that the moon was inhabited by a race of tall humans who dressed like Quakers.

However, Brigham prophesied that there were people who lived in the sun. More specifically:

Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening, called the moon?...when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the ignorant of their fellows. So it is in regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain." - Journal of Discourses, vol. 13, p. 271)

As anyone familiar with the LDS doctrine you can clearly see that the BOM CONDRADICTS their own theology.

Actually, all Mormon scripture blatantly contradicts itself. For example in this SOURCE. The author provides numerous clear-cut examples with links directly to Mormon Scripture. Some of the examples include:

And these contradictions remain despite thousands of documented changes to Mormon Scripture, which was supposedly either divinely translated by Joseph or provided to him by direct revelation from Mormonisms god.

All of this evidence leads to a most distressing question: How is it possible to claim that Mormon scripture is unimpugnable when it in fact impugns itself?

1,454 posted on 01/04/2011 11:55:22 AM PST by Zakeet (Always trust in the five G's: God, Gold, Guns, Grub, and the Government screwing up)
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To: SENTINEL
Man, I'm laughing here. You were answering everyone else's posts so I know you were around.
I guess you're the minority here, trying to stand up against a dozen of us single handedly at times.


Thanks for the understanding, I wish there were more than one of me at times, sorry for the delay. I think I'm getting further and further behind too.

I'm sure you were just busy and not waiting until you though T.P. had me stumped to answer.

Not sure who T.P. is, but sorry about the delay, and for Good measure, I red the KJV, several different printings, on in Chinese to try to keep my Chinese up.

Delph
1,455 posted on 01/04/2011 11:56:27 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser

You should stick to the News Forums. Perhaps what’s going on in Egypt right now will make you feel better about your own little personal martyrdom.


1,456 posted on 01/04/2011 11:56:38 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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Comment #1,457 Removed by Moderator

To: T Minus Four

LOL! I love the Sin offering for eating too much meat parody!


1,458 posted on 01/04/2011 11:57:32 AM PST by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser; Religion Moderator; Anti-Bubba182; Paragon Defender; All

Speaking of “antis,” I may not be the greatest Christian in the world, but I do believe there is only One True God and He is the Judeo-Christian God. I also believe in the KJV Christian Bible and was taught not to follow false prophets or false prophecy. I’m sorry, but I cannot believe that Joseph Smith was ever an Apostle of Christ as the original thread in question claimed and I cannot believe that the so-called Books of Mormon are true Christian Scripture or Christian Gospel. In fact, it may be that Smith’s Mormonism was actually created to be ANTI-Christian and if that’s true then it’s the followers of his Mormonism who are the antis.

Furthermore, I broke no rule in removing the caucus designation from the thread in question. Again, the thread’s title and content were highly inflammatory to me as a Christian, and RM can correct me if I’m wrong, but IMHO, it did not deserve to be posted to this forum as a protected caucus thread. If you’re going to make false claims or comparisons about Christianity on this forum, do not expect NOT to be called on it. Paragon Defender seems to be trying to take advantage of our forum to take cheap shots at Christianity (probably for his audience on the “anti” sites) and I’ll be putting a stop to it. You can bet your bottom dollar on that.

My moving it to breaking news may have been a cheap shot by me in return, but it truly was breaking news to me. I had no idea that the Church of Latter Day Saints actually claimed that Joseph Smith was ever an Apostle of Christ and it was a shock to me. My dear sainted mother would roll over in her grave if her son allowed that nonsense to go unchallenged on FR.


1,459 posted on 01/04/2011 12:03:52 PM PST by Jim Robinson (Rebellion is brewing!! Nuke the corrupt commie bastards to HELL!!)
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To: reaganaut

So you really believe that a person say who is born into a Mormon Family or Muslim Family or an Orthodox Jewish family who has made a individual confession to Jesus Christ to repent of thier sins, and to love GOD with all of thier heart mind an soul, and to love thier neighbor as themselves are going to *Hell* because out of respect for thier families they still attend a Mosqu’e or a Jewish or Mormon Temple?

Do you think Jesus cares more about religious doctrine or more about the Gospel Message and what is in the heart of MAN??????


1,460 posted on 01/04/2011 12:04:22 PM PST by TaraP (An APPEASER is one who feeds a crocodile - hoping it will eat him last)
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