Posted on 12/26/2010 5:29:46 PM PST by Colofornian
Is Mormonism Christian? This may seem like a puzzling question to many Mormons as well as to some Christians. Mormons will note that they include the Bible among the four books which they recognize as Scripture, and that belief in Jesus Christ is central to their faith, as evidenced by their official name, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Furthermore, many Christians have heard the Mormon Tabernacle Choir sing Christian hymns and are favorably impressed with the Mormon commitment to high moral standards and strong families. Doesn’t it follow that Mormonism is Christian?
"To fairly and accurately resolve this question we need to carefully compare the basic doctrines of the Mormon religion with the basic doctrines of historic, biblical Christianity."
To fairly and accurately resolve this question we need to carefully compare the basic doctrines of the Mormon religion with the basic doctrines of historic, biblical Christianity. To represent the Mormon position we have relied on the following well-known Mormon doctrinal books, the first three of which are published by the Mormon Church: Gospel Principles (1997), Achieving a Celestial Marriage (1976), and A Study of the Articles of Faith (1979) by Mormon Apostle James E. Talmage, as well as Doctrines of Salvation (3 vols.) by the tenth Mormon President and prophet Joseph Fielding Smith, Mormon Doctrine (2nd ed., 1979) by Mormon apostle Bruce R. McConkie and Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith.
1. Is There More Than One True God?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that there is only one True and Living God and apart from Him there are no other Gods (Deuteronomy 6:4; Isaiah 43:10,11; 44:6,8; 45:21,22; 46:9; Mark 12:29-34).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that there are many Gods (Book of Abraham 4:3ff), and that we can become gods and goddesses in the celestial kingdom (Doctrine and Covenants 132:19-20; Gospel Principles, p. 245; Achieving a Celestial Marriage, p. 130). It also teaches that those who achieve godhood will have spirit children who will worship and pray to them, just as we worship and pray to God the Father (Gospel Principles, p. 302).
2. Was God Once a Man Like Us?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that God is Spirit (John 4:24; 1 Timothy 6:15,16), He is not a man (Numbers 23:19; Hosea 11:9; Romans 1:22, 23), and has always (eternally) existed as God — all powerful, all knowing, and everywhere present (Psalm 90:2; 139:7-10; Isaiah 40:28; Luke 1:37).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that God the Father was once a man like us who progressed to become a God and has a body of flesh and bone (Doctrine and Covenants 130:22; "God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!" from Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 345-347; Gospel Principles, p. 9; Articles of Faith, p. 430; Mormon Doctrine, p. 321). Indeed, the Mormon Church teaches that God himself has a father, and a grandfather, ad infinitum (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 373; Mormon Doctrine, p. 577).
3. Are Jesus and Satan Spirit Brothers?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that Jesus is the unique Son of God; he has always existed as God, and is co-eternal and co-equal with the Father (John 1:1, 14; 10:30; 14:9; Colossians 2:9). While never less than God, at the appointed time He laid aside the glory He shared with the Father (John 17:4, 5; Philippians 2:6-11) and was made flesh for our salvation; His incarnation was accomplished through being conceived supernaturally by the Holy Spirit and born of a virgin (Matthew 1:18-23; Luke 1:34-35).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that Jesus Christ is our elder brother who progressed to godhood, having first been procreated as a spirit child by Heavenly Father and a heavenly mother; He was later conceived physically through intercourse between Heavenly Father and the virgin Mary (D&C 93:21; Journal of Discourses, 1:50-51; Gospel Principles, p. 11-13; Achieving a Celestial Marriage, p. 129; Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, pp. 546-547; 742; Ezra Taft Benson, Come unto Christ, p. 4; Robert L. Millet, The Mormon Faith: Understanding Restored Christianity, p. 31). Mormon doctrine affirms that Jesus, all angels, Lucifer, all demons, and all human beings are originally spirit brothers and sisters (Abraham 3:22-27; Moses 4:1-2; Gospel Principles, pp. 17-18; Mormon Doctrine, p. 192).
4. Is God a Trinity?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost are not separate Gods or separate beings, but are distinct Persons within the one Triune Godhead. Throughout the New Testament the Son and the Holy Spirit, as well as the Father are separately identified as and act as God (Son: Mark 2:5-12; John 20:28; Philippians 2:10,11; Holy Spirit: Acts 5:3,4; 2 Corinthians 3:17,18; 13:14); yet at the same time the Bible teaches that these three are only one God (see point 1).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are three separate Gods (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 370; Mormon Doctrine, pp. 576-577), and that the Son and Holy Ghost are the literal offspring of Heavenly Father and a celestial wife (Joseph Fielding McConkie, Encyclopedia of Mormonism, vol. 2, p. 649).
5. Was The Sin Of Adam and Eve a Great Evil Or a Great Blessing?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that the disobedience of our first parents Adam and Eve was a great evil. Through their fall sin entered the world, bringing all human beings under condemnation and death. Thus we are born with a sinful nature, and will be judged for the sins we commit as individuals. (Ezekiel 18:1-20; Romans 5:12-21).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that Adam’s sin was "a necessary step in the plan of life and a great blessing to all of us" (Gospel Principles, p. 33; Book of Mormon — 2 Nephi 2:25; Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, pp. 114-115).
6. Can We Make Ourselves Worthy Before God?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that apart from the saving work of Jesus Christ on the cross we are spiritually "dead in trespasses and sins" (Ephesians 2:1,5) and are powerless to save ourselves. By grace alone, apart from self-righteous works, God forgives our sins and makes us worthy to live in His presence (Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5-6). Our part is only to cling to Christ in heartfelt faith. (However, it is certainly true that without the evidence of changed conduct, a person’s testimony of faith in Christ must be questioned; salvation by grace alone through faith, does not mean we can live as we please — Romans 6:1-4).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that eternal life in the presence of God (which it terms "exaltation in the celestial kingdom") must be earned through obedience to all the commands of the Mormon Church, including exclusive Mormon temple rituals. Works are a requirement for salvation (entrance into the "celestial kingdom") — Gospel Principles, p. 303-304; Pearl of Great Price — Third Article of Faith; Mormon Doctrine, pp. 339, 671; Book of Mormon — 2 Nephi 25:23).
7. Does Christ's Atoning Death Benefit Those Who Reject Him?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that the purpose of the atoning work of Christ on the cross was to provide the complete solution for humankind’s sin problem. However, those who reject God’s grace in this life will have no part in this salvation but are under the judgment of God for eternity (John 3:36; Hebrews 9:27; 1 John 5:11-12).
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that the purpose of the atonement was to bring resurrection and immortality to all people, regardless of whether they receive Christ by faith. Christ’s atonement is only a partial basis for worthiness and eternal life, which also requires obedience to all the commands of the Mormon church, including exclusive Mormon temple rituals (Gospel Principles, pp. 74-75; Mormon Doctrine, p. 669).
8. Is The Bible The Unique and Final Word of God?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that the Bible is the unique, final and infallible Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16; Hebrews 1:1,2; 2 Peter 1:21) and that it will stand forever (1 Peter 1:23-25). God’s providential preservation of the text of the Bible was marvelously illustrated in the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that the Bible has been corrupted, is missing many "plain and precious parts" and does not contain the fullness of the Gospel (Book of Mormon — 1 Nephi 13:26-29; Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, pp. 190-191).
9. Did The Early Church Fall Into Total Apostasy?
The Bible teaches and orthodox Christians through the ages have believed that the true Church was divinely established by Jesus and could never and will never disappear from the earth (Matthew 16:18; John 15:16; 17:11). Christians acknowledge that there have been times of corruption and apostasy within the Church, but believe there has always been a remnant that held fast to the biblical essentials.
By contrast, the Mormon Church teaches that there was a great and total apostasy of the Church as established by Jesus Christ; this state of apostasy "still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" of the Mormon Church (Gospel Principles, pp. 105-106; Mormon Doctrine, p. 44).
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Conclusion: The above points in italics constitute the common gospel believed by all orthodox Christians through the ages regardless of denominational labels. On the other hand, some new religions such as Mormonism claim to be Christian, but accept as Scripture writings outside of the Bible, teach doctrines that contradict the Bible, and hold to beliefs completely foreign to the teachings of Jesus and His apostles.
Mormons share with orthodox Christians some important moral precepts from the Bible. However, the above points are examples of the many fundamental and irreconcilable differences between historic, biblical Christianity and Mormonism. While these differences do not keep us from being friendly with Mormons, we cannot consider them brothers and sisters in Christ. The Bible specifically warns of false prophets who will teach "another gospel" centered around "another Jesus," and witnessed to by "another spirit" (2 Corinthians 11:4,13-15; Galatians 1:6-9). Based on the evidence presented above, we believe Mormonism represents just such a counterfeit gospel.
It has been pointed out that if one claimed to be a Mormon but denied all the basic tenets of Mormonism — that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, that the Book of Mormon is true and divinely inspired, that god was once a man who progressed to godhood through keeping the laws and ordinances of the Mormon Church, and that the Mormon Church was divinely established — the Mormon Church would reject such a person’s claim to being a Latter-day Saint. One cannot fairly call oneself a Mormon if one does not believe the fundamental doctrines taught by the Mormon Church. By the same token, if the Mormon Church does not hold to even the basic biblical truths believed by the greater Christian community down through the ages, how can Christians reasonably be expected to accept Mormonism as authentic Christianity?
If the Mormon Church believes it is the only true Christian Church, it should not attempt to publicly present itself as a part of a broader Christian community. Instead it should tell the world openly that those who claim to be orthodox Christians are not really Christians at all, and that the Mormon Church is the only true Christian Church. This in fact is what it teaches privately, but not publicly.
Statements of 5 Christian Denominations on Mormonism
Christian churches teach belief in God as an eternal, self-existent, immortal being, unfettered by corporeal limitations and unchanging in both character and nature. In recent years, several Christian denominations have made studies of Mormon teaching and come to the conclusion that there are irreconcilable differences between LDS doctrine and Christian beliefs based on the Bible.
• Statement of the Lutheran Church, Missouri Synod
• Statement of the Presbyterian Church (USA)
• Statement of the Roman Catholic Church
• Statement of the Southern Baptist Convention
• Statement of the United Methodist Church
..
LOL. I’m not in this for the money either. I support my ministry of my own funds from my own business.
What is that supposed to mean? I know Reaganaut personally and believe me, she has nothing to do with money-hungry, power-hungry, egotistical, phoney pastors, preachers or prophets.
Practically eveyone I know is. It's a great place to live, very nice people.
Thank you, T.
If people can teach their children in their homes, why not worship God in their homes also?
That sounds very pleasant.
New International Version (©1984) And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.
Note he uses the word Hades, not Hell. Most Christians know less about Heaven and Hell than the average Greek pagan of Jesus' time. Look up Hades to learn what Jesus was really talking about.
The entire sentence in Greek is really awesome. The "gates of Hades" will not get the upper hand, that is death cannot cheat the redemption offered by Christ Jesus.
Jesus knew the score and picked his words accordingly. It's an honest mistake to make, though, when you're relying on the precepts of men. They obscure the truth, but revelation by revelation the truth gets out.
Stick with the Bible and what it says and you cannot go wrong.
You may want to tell your mormon friends that...
Apparently, they didn't get the memo.
Interesting, though about the Hades v. Hell, no? A lot gets lost in some translations into English.
Hmm. You’re emphasizing complete, but let’s first get some definitions down so we’re not talking a different language or at cross purposes. That happens a lot between believers.
What do you mean by Christ’s church and complete apostasy as opposed to apostasy?
This is the definition I’m talking about: http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resource=Webster%27s&word=apostasy&use1913=on&use1828=on
Here’s the LDS definition which is somewhat similar: http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Apostasy
What else would I be emphasizing? The mormons claim it. It’s the cornerstone of their faith, without believing in JS’s stories, they’re left with nothing.
1832 - Joseph [my son] thy Sins are forgiven thee. go thy [way] walk in my Statutes and keep my commandments behold I am the Lord of glory I was crucifyed for the world that all those who believe on my name may have Eternal life [behold] the world lieth in sin {and} at this time and none doeth good no not one they have turned asside from the Gospel and keep not [my] commandments they draw near to me with their lips while their hearts are far from me and mine anger is kindling against the inhabitants of the earth to visit them acording to this ungodliness and to bring to pass that which [hath] been spoken by the mouth of the prophets and Apostles
Subsequent versions of the purported 1st vision - that all the religious denominations were believing in incorrect doctrines; and consequently, that none of them was acknowledged of God, as his church and kingdom. And he was expressly commanded, to go not after them; and he received a promise that the true doctrine—the fulness of the gospel, should, at some future time, be made known to him;
Then there’s this pretty good thesis by a Catholic on the topic. I have no position (yet) on Catholic claims to apostolic succession via Popes. (So you Catholics/Proddies out there, don’t fire up your flamethrowers. I’m an ex-mo finding my way.)
http://patrickmadrid.com/madrid_apostasy.pdf
What I’m talking about, is the mormon claim of a “complete” apostasy.
Note the use of the words “all” in JS’s account [one of many].
“I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt” (Joseph Smith – History 1:19).
That means “complete”, there is not one shred of truth left, “complete apostasy”.
Pick a version to peruse, there are too many to list or post here.
http://www.irr.org/mit/first-vision/fvision-accounts.html
“I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt” (Joseph Smith – History 1:19).
SZonian: That means “complete”, there is not one shred of truth left, “complete apostasy”.
I don't think the usage of "all" means "complete", at least not how you quoted it above. It would seem that some partial level of apostasy could be the case. Such as anything less than the whole truth is a lie. God's standard is perfection, no?
“I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong [that is that not one of them had it right - truth being 100% and not anything less]; and the Personage who addressed me said that all [everyone of] their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that [everyone of] those professors were (all is omitted) corrupt” (Joseph Smith – History 1:19).
You can see that the meaning doesn't change. Smith is quoting the Personage (God) and the Personage is answering. If the Personage meant "completely" he could have used it instead of all. So "all" is being used to modify that there isn't one of them that is correct, as opposed to there isn't one of them that has any truth at all.
You really got me thinking and I spent a little time on the LDS site I'd found previously: the LDS definition of Apostasy
Latter-day Saints believe that apostasy occurs whenever an individual or community rejects the revelations and ordinances of God, changes the gospel of Jesus Christ, or rebels against the commandments of God, thereby losing the blessings of the Holy Ghost and of divine authority.
So you have four conditions that satisfy apostasy:
1. Rejection of revelations of God
2. Rejection of the ordinances of God
3. Changes to the gospel of Jesus Christ
4. Rebellion against the commandments of God
Apostasy like this has happened throughout the Bible.
What you “think” it means and what I was taught it means by mormon missionaries, the mormon lessons and my 6 years as an active, temple attending mormon are two different things.
I don’t entertain the parsing of words. I’m fully aware of what the mormons teach in this regard and stand by my assertion that is supported by their founders’ own words and by their teachings.
So you’re saying that the LDS teach that there was not one whit of gospel truth left on the earth at the time of Joseph Smith’s vision?
That it was all 100% lost?
Your argument is with SLC, that’s what they’ve said from the beginning.
“Complete apostasy”.
Now you are attempting to segue into “...not one whit of gospel truth...”. That’s mormon doubletalk, backing off of their original assertion. Not buying it.
B.H. Roberts, an LDS Seventy and LDS Church historian, in his introduction to the History of the Church, stated that the LDS Church is founded upon this very premise. He wrote, “Nothing less than a complete apostasy from the Christian religion would warrant the establishment of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (vol. 1:XL).
How could there have been a total apostasy of the church since Jesus promised that “the gates of hell shall not prevail against it”? (Matt. 16:18) Jesus also promised, “lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.” (Matt. 28:20) There couldn’t have been unless Jesus lied.
Another problem with the LDS claim of a total apostasy is their own teaching that John, one of Christ’s twelve apostles, did not die (see D&C 7:1-3) but was to remain on the earth to “prophesy before nations.” Besides John, three of the twelve disciples in the Book of Mormon were granted their desire to remain on earth, to “bring the souls of men unto me,” until Christ’s return (Book of Mormon, 3 Nephi 28:6-9).
With four apostles remaining on the earth, how could there have been a total apostasy? The only obvious answer, is there wasn’t one.
SLC perpetuates a lie of their own making.
By definition and context SZ's citation of smith's statement does mean complete.
I find it incredable the parsing of your words 10. It is stamped in every missionaries mind that the apostasy was complete and total. In the updated "Gospel Principles" it states “More and more error crept into Church doctrine, and soon the dissolution of the Church was complete. The period of time when the true Church no longer existed on earth is called the Great Apostasy”.
smith stated it even more clearly - “Nothing less than a complete apostasy from the Christian religion would warrant the establishment of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.”
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Jr., History of the Church, v. 1, p. xl
Notice the word complete - there can be no waffling on its definition - complete is complete. Now if we follow your line of reasoning 10 that the apostasy was not 100% - then the 'apostasy' was NOT complete and there would be no need for the lds church.
Your tack may work for milk to the masses, but the fundamental doctrine of mormonism teaches otherwise.
Bump!
Page XL Announcement of the Universal Apostasy
It looks to be fascinating reading. I'll start in on it asap and get back to you both.
This is a great topic. Clearly apostasy occurred at some level in the Christian Church or the Church of Jesus Christ, no?
Some levels of apostasy - yes, even Jesus predicted it. But these never were a COMPLETE apostasy, the true church remained intact throughout history.
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