Joseph Smith Married Other Men's Wives: Would you share your spouse with the Prophet?

Rethinking Mormonism ^

[delacoert]

A Mormon Church apostle explained:

"When the family organization was revealed from heaven—the patriarchal order of God, and Joseph began, on the right and the left, to add to his family, what a quaking there was in Israel."

"Says one brother to another, "Joseph says all covenants [previous marriages] are done away, and none are binding but the new covenants [marriage by priesthood sealing power]; now suppose Joseph should come and say he wanted your wife, what would you say to that?" "I would tell him to go to hell." This was the spirit of many in the early days of this Church. . . . What would a man of God say, who felt aright, when Joseph asked him for his money? [he would give it all willingly] Or if he came and said, "I want your wife?" "O yes," he would say, "here she is, there are plenty more."

" . . . Did the Prophet Joseph want every man's wife he asked for? He did not . . . the grand object in view was to try the people of God, to see what was in them. If such a man of God should come to me and say, "I want your gold and silver, or your wives," I should say, "Here they are, I wish I had more to give you, take all I have got." A man who has got the Spirit of God, and the light of eternity in him, has no trouble about such matters."
- Apostle Jedediah M. Grant, second counselor to Brigham Young and father of President Heber J. Grant, sermon delivered on 19 February 1854 (JD 2: 13-14)

Joseph Smith's Failed Proposals to Married Women

John Taylor's Wife, Leonora
"The Prophet went to the home of President Taylor, and said to him, 'Brother John, I WANT LEONORA.'" Taylor was stunned, but after walking the floor all night, the obedient elder said to Smith, "If GOD wants Leonora He can have her." Woodruff concluded: "That was all the prophet was after, to see where President Taylor stood in the matter, and said to him, Brother Taylor, I dont want your wife, I just wanted to know just where you stood."
- Prophet Wilford Woodruff, John Mills Whitaker Journal, Nov. 1 1890; emphasis in original

Heber C. Kimball's Wife, Vilate
“During the summer of 1841, shortly after Heber's return from England, he was introduced to the doctrine of plural marriage directly through a startling test-a sacrifice which shook his very being and challenged his faith to the ultimate. He had already sacrificed homes, possessions, friends, relatives, all worldly rewards, peace, and tranquility for the Restoration. Nothing was left to place on the altar save his life, his children, and his wife. Joseph demanded for himself what to Heber was the unthinkable, his Vilate. Totally crushed spiritually and emotionally, Heber touched neither food nor water for three days and three nights and continually sought confirmation and comfort from God." Finally, after "some kind of assurance," Heber took Vilate to the upper room of Joseph's store on Water Street. The Prophet wept at this act of faith, devotion, and obedience. Joseph had never intended to take Vilate. It was all a test."
- Biography of Heber C. Kimball, "Heber C. Kimball, Mormon Patriarch and Pioneer." By Stanley B. Kimball, page 93.

Orson Pratt's Wife, Sarah
"Sometime in late 1840 or early 1841, Joseph Smith confided to his friend that he was smitten by the "amiable and accomplished" Sarah Pratt and wanted her for "one of hisspiritual wives, for the Lord had given her to him as a special favor for his faithfulness" (emphasis in original). Shortly afterward, the two men took some of Bennett's sewing to Sarah's house. During the visit, as Bennett describes it, Joseph said, "Sister Pratt, the Lord has given you to me as one of my spiritual wives. I have the blessings of Jacob granted me, as God granted holy men of old, and as I have long looked upon you with favor, and an earnest desire of connubial bliss, I hope you will not repulse or deny me." "And is that the great secret that I am not to utter," Sarah replied. "Am I called upon to break the marriage covenant, and prove recreant to my lawful husband! I never will." She added, "I care not for the blessings of Jacob. I have one good husband, and that is enough for me." But according to Bennett, the Prophet was persistent. Finally Sarah angrily told him on a subsequent visit, "Joseph, if you ever attempt any thing of the kind with me again, I will make a full disclosure to Mr. Pratt on his return home. Depend upon it, I will certainly do it." "Sister Pratt," the Prophet responded, "I hope you will not expose me, for if I suffer, all must suffer; so do not expose me. Will you promise me that you will not do it?" "If you will never insult me again," Sarah replied, "I will not expose you unless strong circumstances should require it." "If you should tell," the Prophet added, "I will ruin your reputation, remember that."
(Article "Sarah M. Pratt" by Richard A. Van Wagoner, Dialogue, Vol.19, No.2, p.72. Also see: http://www.xmission.com/~country/reason/spratt.htm)

William Law's Wife, Jane
"William Law, a former counselor in the First Presidency, wrote in his 13 May 1844 diary: "[Joseph] ha[s] lately endeavored to seduce my wife, and ha[s] found her a virtuous woman" The Laws elaborated on this in a public meeting shortly thereafter. "The Prophet had made dishonorable proposals to [my] wife . . . under cover of his asserted 'Revelation,' " Law stated. He further explained that Joseph came to the Law home in the middle of the night when William was absent and told Jane that "the Lord had commanded that he should take spiritual wives, to add to his glory." Law then called on his wife to corroborate what he had said. She did so and further explained that Joseph had "asked her to give him half her love; she was at liberty to keep the other half for her husband" Jane refused the Prophet, and according to William Law's 20 January 1887 letter to the Salt Lake Tribune, Smith then considered the couple apostates. "Jane had been speaking evil of him for a long time . . . slandered him, and lied about him without cause," Law reported Smith as saying. "My wife would not speak evil of . . . anyone . . . without cause," Law asserted. "Joseph is the liar and not she. That Smith admired and lusted after many men's wives and daughters, is a fact, but they could not help that. They or most of them considered his admiration an insult, and treated him with scorn. In return for this scorn, he generally managed to blacken their reputations--see the case of . . . Mrs. Pratt, a good, virtuous woman."
("Mormon Polygamy" by Richard S. Van Wagoner, page 44)

Hiram Kimball's wife, Sarah
Sarah M. Kimball, a prominent Nauvoo and Salt Lake City Relief Society leader was also approached by the Prophet in early 1842 despite her solid 1840 marriage to Hiram Kimball. Sarah later recalled that

"Joseph Smith taught me the principle of marriage for eternity, and the doctrine of plural marriage. He said that in teaching this he realized that he jeopardized his life; but God had revealed it to him many years before as a privilege with blessings, now God had revealed it again and instructed him to teach with commandment, as the Church could travel [progress] no further without the introduction of this principle." ("LDS Biographical Encyclopedia" By Elder Andrew Jensen, 6:232, 1887)

Sarah Kimball, like Sarah Pratt, was committed to her husband, and refused the Prophet's invitation, asking that he "teach it to someone else." Although she kept the matter quiet, her husband and Smith evidently had difficulties over Smith's proposal. On 19 May 1842, at a Nauvoo City Council meeting, Smith jotted down and then "threw across the room" a revelation to Kimball which declared that "Hiram Kimball has been insinuating evil, and formulating evil opinions" against the Prophet, which if he does not desist from, he "shall be accursed." Sarah remained a lifetime member of the Church and a lifelong wife to Hiram Kimball. 
- "LDS Biographical Encyclopedia" By Elder Andrew Jensen, 6:232, 1887, Official History of the Church 5: 12-13,

Note: Although Joseph Smith did not take Hiram Kimball's wife as a plural wife, Smith later secretly married Hiram's fourteen-year-old daughter, Helen Mar Kimball. Read her story here: http://www.wivesofjosephsmith.org/26-HelenMarKimball.htm

Sidney Rigdon's daughter, Nancy
Read her story and Joseph Smith's explanation here

Joseph Smith's Successful Proposals to Married Women

Adam Lightner's wife, Mary
Mary Elizabeth Rollins, already married to non-Mormon Adam Lightner since 11 August 1835, was one of the first women to accept a polyandrous proposal from Joseph Smith. "He was commanded to take me for a wife," she wrote in a 21 November 1880 letter to Emmeline B. Wells. "I was his, before I came here," she added in an 8 February 1902 statement. Brigham Young secretly sealed the two in February 1842 when Mary was eight months pregnant with her son George Algernon Lightner. She lived with her real husband Adam Lightner until his death in Utah many years later. In her 1880 letter to Emmeline B. Wells, Mary explained: "I could tell you why I stayed with Mr. Lightner. Things the leaders of the Church do not know anything about. I did just as Joseph told me to do, as he knew what troubles I would have to contend with." She added on 23 January 1892 in a letter to John R. Young: "I could explain some things in regard to my living with Mr. L[ightner] after becoming the Wife of Another (Joseph Smith), which would throw light, on what now seems mysterious--and you would be perfectly satisfied with me. I write this; because I have heard that it had been commented on to my injury"
(Lightner, Mary E. Statement. 8 Feb. 1902; Lightner to Emmeline B. Wells, 21 Nov. 1880; Lightner to John R. Young, 25 Jan. 1892. George A. Smith Papers. Special Collections. University of Utah)

Orson Hyde's Wife, Marinda
Marinda Nancy Johnson, sister of Apostles Luke and Lyman Johnson, married Orson Hyde in 1834. A year before Hyde returned from Jerusalem in 1843, Marinda was sealed to Joseph Smith in April of 1842, though she lived with Orson until their divorce in 1870. Many suspect Joseph Smith was the actual father of Marinda's son Frank Henry who was born on 23 Jan 1845, for two reasons. First, because Marinda had been the polygamous wife of Smith since Apr 1842. Second, because Smith had sent her first husband, Orson Hyde, on a mission to Washington on April 4, 1844 "immediately" after a meeting with Joseph Smith (History of the Church, pg. 286). The gestation period for a human is on average 266 days (not 9 months), which would date the conception to early May 1844. Of course, 266 is an average date and the figures vary. To give you an idea of the range, only four percent of pregnancies are actually carried two weeks or more beyond the average time (Guttmacher, 1983). Frank Henry was born on January 23, 1845. Orson Hyde left for Washington April 4, 1844. The difference in these two dates is 294 days! That is almost a month longer than expected and is basically physiologically impossible, especially considering that Orson Hyde had not returned to Nauvoo until August 6, 1844.
(Andrew Jenson, Church Chronology, August 6, 1844) Marinda later divorced Orson Hyde and voiced her disgust of polygamy.

Windsor Lyon's Wife, Sylvia
Sylvia P. Sessions, married to Windsor P. Lyon, gave birth to a daughter on 8 February 1844, less than five months before Joseph Smith's martyrdom. That daughter, Josephine, related in a 24 February 1915 statement that prior to her mother's death in 1882 "she called me to her bedside and told me that her days on earth were about numbered and before she passed away from mortality she desired to tell me something which she had kept as an entire secret from me and all others but which she now desired to communicate to me." Josephine's mother told her she was "the daughter of the Prophet Joseph Smith, she having been sealed to the Prophet at the time that her husband Mr. Lyon was out of fellowship with the Church."
(Affidavit to Church Historian Andrew Jenson, 24 Feb. 1915)

Norman Buell's Wife, Prescindia
Prescindia D. Huntington, a faithful Mormon and married woman in Nauvoo, was also a polyandrous wife of Joseph Smith. Prescindia had married Norman Buell in 1827 and had two sons by him before joining Mormonism in 1836. She was secretly sealed to Joseph Smith by her brother Dimick on 11 December 1841, though she continued to live with her husband Buell until 1846, when she left him to marry Heber C. Kimball. In a "letter to my eldest grand-daughter living in 1880," she explained that Norman Buell had left the Church in 1839, but that "the Lord gave me strength to Stand alone & keep the faith amid heavy persecution." (Mormon Polygamy: A History" by Richard S. Van Wagoner, page 44)

Prescindia, who was Normal Buell's wife and simultaneously a "plural wife" of the Prophet Joseph Smith, said that she did not know whether her husband Norman "or the Prophet was the father of her son, Oliver." And a glance at a photo of Oliver shows a strong resemblance to Emma Smith's boys.
(Mary Ettie V. Smith, "Fifteen Years Among the Mormons", page 34; Fawn Brodie "No Man Knows My History" pages 301-302, 437-39)

Lucinda Morgan Harris, wife of Far West high councilor George Harris, admitted in 1842 that she had been Smith's "mistress since four years," and it is known that she visited Smith while he was incarcerated in Liberty Jail in 1838.

Henry Jacob's Wife, Zina
Prescindia's twenty-year-old sister Zina was living in the Joseph Smith home when Elder Henry B. Jacobs married her in March 1841. According to family records, when Zina and Henry asked Joseph Smith why he had not honored them by performing their marriage, Smith replied that "the Lord had made it known to him that [Zina] was to be his Celestial wife." Believing that "whatever the Prophet did was right, without making the wisdom of God's authorities bend to the reasoning of any man," the devout Elder Jacobs consented for six-months-pregnant Zina to be sealed to Joseph Smith 27 October 1841. Some have suggested that the Jacobs's marriage was "unhappy" and that the couple had separated before her sealing to Joseph Smith. But, though sealed to Joseph Smith for eternity, Zina continued her connubial relationship with her husband Henry Jacobs. On 2 February 1846, pregnant with Henry's second son, Zina was re-sealed by proxy to the murdered Joseph Smith and in that same session was “sealed for time" to Brigham Young. Faithful Henry B. Jacobs stood by as an official witness to both ceremonies.
("History of Henry Bailey Jacobs." By Ora J. Cannon, page 5-7. also see "Recollections of Zina D. Young" by Mary Brown Firmage)

Zina and Henry lived together as husband and wife until the Mormon pioneers reached Mt. Pisgah, Iowa. At this temporary stop on the pioneer trail, Brigham Young announced that "it was time for men who were walking in other men's shoes to step out of them. Brother Jacobs, the woman you claim for a wife does not belong to you. She is the spiritual wife of brother Joseph, sealed up to him. I am his proxy, and she, in this behalf, with her children, are my property. You can go where you please, and get another, but be sure to get one of your own kindred spirit" (Hall 1853, 43-44). President Young then called Jacobs on a mission to England. Witnesses to his departure commented that he was so emotionally ill they had to "put him on a blanket and carry him to the boat to get him on his way".
("Short Sketch of the Life of Henry B. Jacobs" By Ora J. Cannon)

Henry returned from his mission and settled in California. But he was still in love with his wife Zina, now a plural wife of Brigham Young. Henry's letters to his wife Zina were heartrending. On 2 September 1852 he wrote: "O how happy I should be if I only could see you and the little children, bone of my bone, flesh of my flesh." "I am unhappy," Henry lamented, "there is no peace for poor me, my pleasure is you, my comfort has vanished.... O Zina, can I ever, will I ever get you again, answer the question please." In an undated Valentine he added:

Zina my mind never will change from Worlds without Ends, no never, the same affection is there and never can be moved I do not murmur nor complain of the handlings of God no verily, no but I feel alone and no one to speak to, to call my own. I feel like a lamb without a mother, I do not blame any person or persons, no--May the Lord our Father bless Brother Brigham and all purtains unto him forever. Tell him for me I have no feelings against him nor never had, all is right according to the Law of the Celestial Kingdom of our god Joseph [Smith]." ("Short Sketch of the Life of Henry B. Jacobs" By Ora J. Cannon)

It was the rule rather than the exception for Smith to encourage a polyandrous wife to remain with her legal husband.
Faithful Mormon Joseph Kingsbury even wrote that he served as a surrogate husband for Joseph Smith:
 

"I according to Pres. Joseph Smith & council & others, I agreed to stand by Sarah Ann Whitney [sealed to Smith 27 July 1843] as though I was supposed to be her husband and a pretended marriage for the purpose of shielding them from the enemy and for the purpose of bringing out the purposes of God." (Elder Joseph Kingsbury, "History of Joseph Kingsbury Written by His Own Hand," page 5, Utah State Historical Society)

Read Mormon apologist explanations for why Joseph Smith married other men's wives:
http://www.fairlds.org/pubs/polyandry.pdf

Did Joseph Smith have sex with his wives?
http://www.i4m.com/think/history/joseph_smith_sex.htm

Did Joseph Smith emotionally blackmail these women into marriage?
http://www.i4m.com/think/history/angel_sword.htm

Read the detailed history of each of Joseph Smith's 33 plural wives in Todd Compton's excellent book In Sacred Loneliness.

For some details on the other married women Joseph married and impregnated, see: 
http://www.wivesofjosephsmith.org 
http://www.xmission.com/~country/reason/polyg.htm
http://www.lds-mormon.com/isl.shtml
http://www.mormonismi.info/jamesdavid/menwives.htm

For more discussion on Mormon sexuality, see this on-line article:
Sexuality Within The Contemporary Mormon Experience

[Utah Binger]

HEY! Whatcha lookin' at?

[Elsie]

Keep in mind the Mormon Church did not allow black membership until the 1960's.

Oh; they could be MEMBERS, but could NOT attain a high ranging position in the church.

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"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind.

The first man that committed the odious crime of killing one of his brethren will be cursed the longest of any one of the children of Adam. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings.

This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another curse is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the 'servant of servants', and they will be, until that curse is removed."

Brigham Young - President and second 'Prophet' of the Mormon Church, 1844-1877- Extract from Journal of Discourses.

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Here are two examples from their 'other testament', the Book of Mormon.

  2 Nephi 5: 21    'And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people, the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.'

  Alma 3: 6    'And the skins of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against their brethren, who consisted of Nephi, Jacob and Joseph, and Sam, who were just and holy men.'

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August 27, 1954 in an address at Brigham Young University (BYU), Mormon Elder, Mark E Peterson, in speaking to a convention of teachers of religion at the college level, said:

"The discussion on civil rights, especially over the last 20 years, has drawn some very sharp lines. It has blinded the thinking of some of our own people, I believe. They have allowed their political affiliations to color their thinking to some extent.I think I have read enough to give you an idea of what the Negro is after."

"He is not just seeking the opportunity of sitting down in a cafe where white people eat. He isn't just trying to ride on the same streetcar or the same Pullman car with white people. It isn't that he just desires to go to the same theater as the white people. From this, and other interviews I have read, it appears that the Negro seeks absorption with the white race. He will not be satisfied until he achieves it by intermarriage."

"That is his objective and we must face it. We must not allow our feelings to carry us away, nor must we feel so sorry for Negroes that we will open our arms and embrace them with everything we have. Remember the little statement that we used to say about sin, 'First we pity, then endure, then embrace'...."

(Rosa Parks would have probably told Petersen under which wheel of the bus he should go sit.)

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 1967, (then) Mormon President Ezra Taft Benson said,

"The Communist program for revolution in America has been in progress for many years and is far advanced. First of all, we must not place the blame upon Negroes. They are merely the unfortunate group that has been selected by professional Communist agitators to be used as the primary source of cannon fodder."

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We are told that on June 8, 1978, it was 'revealed' to the then president, Spencer Kimball, that people of color could now gain entry into the priesthood.

According to the church, Kimball spent many long hours petitioning God, begging him to give worthy black people the priesthood. God finally relented.

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Sometime before the 'revelation' came to chief 'Prophet' Spencer Kimball in June 1978, General Authority, Bruce R McConkie had said:

"The Blacks are denied the Priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.

The Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow there from, but this inequality is not of man's origin, it is the Lord's doings."

(Mormon Doctrine, pp. 526-527).

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When Mormon 'Apostle' Mark E Petersen spoke on 'Race Problems- As they affect the Church' at the BYU campus in 1954, the following was also said:

"...if the negro accepts the gospel with real, sincere faith, and is really converted, to give him the blessings of baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost, he can and will enter the celestial kingdom. He will go there as a servant, but he will get celestial glory."

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When Mormon 'Prophet' and second President of the Church, Brigham Young, spoke in 1863 the following was also said:

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God is death on the spot. This will always be so."

(Journal of Discourses, Vo. 10, p. 110)

[Elsie]

Didn't one of them recently get Viking Kittified by JIM?

[Elsie]

He was much like the guy in Crime and Punishment...

Or on the Titanic!

[Elsie]

Joey Smith declared himself king of the world and above all laws...

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"Joseph; I advise you not to go to that jail."

 

"Darn gnats!!"

 

 

"Joseph; I'm telling you to not to go to that jail."

 

"Flies are BAD today!!"

 

 

"Joseph; It ain't gonna be pretty if you ignore me and go to that jail!"

 

"Crummy mosquitos are EVERYWHERE!!!"

 

 

"Joseph!  Do NOT go to that jail!"

 

"And those bedbugs really savaged me last night, too!"

 

 

"JOSEPH!!  Wake up boy!   Do Not Go To That JAIL!!!"

 

"All right Sheriff - here I am, so give me a nice room while my Lawyer, my Advocate, my Comforter presents the LAW to the Judge and I am VINDICATED!!!"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...and the rest is history.

[Osage Orange]

LDS, Inc.....

It’s an industry whose existence and success depends on spreading rumors, half-truths, and outright lies

[Elsie]

A few days back I got a FReepmail from someone, slandering and making derogatory remarks about Elsie. I promptly sent it, in its entirety to Elsie.

And let me tell you I was hurt - HURT! - I tell you!

I cried for DAYS!!!!

[Normandy]

Joseph Smith was called of God to be a prophet and the instrument through which the fullness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ was restored to the earth.

The Spirit bears witness of this fact to those who in faith, humility and sincerity pray to God to know the truth on this matter.

Regards,

Normandy

[Elsie]

OFFICIAL DECLARATION—2

 

To Whom It May Concern:

 

On September 30, 1978, at the 148th Semiannual General Conference of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the following was presented by President N. Eldon Tanner, First Counselor in the First Presidency of the Church:

 

In early June of this year, the First Presidency announced that a revelation had been received by President Spencer W. Kimball extending priesthood and temple blessings to all worthy male members of the Church. President Kimball has asked that I advise the conference that after he had received this revelation, which came to him after extended meditation and prayer in the sacred rooms of the holy temple, he presented it to his counselors, who accepted it and approved it. It was then presented to the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, who unanimously approved it, and was subsequently presented to all other General Authorities, who likewise approved it unanimously.

 

President Kimball has asked that I now read this letter:

 

June 8, 1978

 

To all general and local priesthood officers of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints throughout the world:

 

Dear Brethren:

 

As we have witnessed the expansion of the work of the Lord over the earth, we have been grateful that people of many nations have responded to the message of the restored gospel, and have joined the Church in ever-increasing numbers. This, in turn, has inspired us with a desire to extend to every worthy member of the Church all of the privileges and blessings which the gospel affords.

 

Aware of the promises made by the prophets and presidents of the Church who have preceded us that at some time, in God’s eternal plan, all of our brethren who are worthy may receive the priesthood, and witnessing the faithfulness of those from whom the priesthood has been withheld, we have pleaded long and earnestly in behalf of these, our faithful brethren, spending many hours in the Upper Room of the Temple supplicating the Lord for divine guidance.

 

He has heard our prayers, and by revelation has confirmed that the long-promised day has come when every faithful, worthy man in the Church may receive the holy priesthood, with power to exercise its divine authority, and enjoy with his loved ones every blessing that flows therefrom, including the blessings of the temple. Accordingly, all worthy male members of the Church may be ordained to the priesthood without regard for race or color. Priesthood leaders are instructed to follow the policy of carefully interviewing all candidates for ordination to either the Aaronic or the Melchizedek Priesthood to insure that they meet the established standards for worthiness.

 

We declare with soberness that the Lord has now made known his will for the blessing of all his children throughout the earth who will hearken to the voice of his authorized servants, and prepare themselves to receive every blessing of the gospel.

 

Sincerely yours,

Spencer W. Kimball
N. Eldon Tanner
Marion G. Romney

The First Presidency

 

Recognizing Spencer W. Kimball as the prophet, seer, and revelator, and president of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it is proposed that we as a constituent assembly accept this revelation as the word and will of the Lord. All in favor please signify by raising your right hand. Any opposed by the same sign.

 

The vote to sustain the foregoing motion was unanimous in the affirmative.

 

Salt Lake City, Utah, September 30, 1978.

 

The Official Scriptures of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © 2010 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. Rights and use information. Privacy policy.

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[Elsie]

HEY! Whatcha lookin' at?

[Elsie]

The Spirit bears witness of this fact to those who in faith, humility and sincerity pray to God to know the truth on this matter.

You are correct!

A 'spirit' DOES bear witness (false) to any who are foolish enough to actually TRY this 'method' of contacting GOD.

[Elsie]

Joseph Smith was called of God to be a prophet and the instrument through which the fullness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ was restored to the earth.

Uh...

Houston:

We have a problem.

NOwhere, in the Book of MORMON, is the Restored Gospel® to be found!

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[svcw]

The Spirit did bear witness to me that Joseph Smith was a flim flam man and his bastardization of the Word of Almighty God was blasphemy. The Spirit further said “run, run from these charlatans”.

[CodeToad]

“Joseph Smith was called of God to be a prophet and the instrument through which the fullness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ was restored to the earth.”

No, he didn’t. lol! God doesn’t call men to take other men’s wives or have sex with children like Joseph Smith did. God isn’t about sex, drugs, and rock-n-roll as all these “prophets” claim. Why is it every time some perverted dolt wants Earthly desires he brings God into it with “secret” scriptures, oral or written, that he cannot share with anybody? Next thing we know the feeble minded of the world will be telling us David Koresh really was Jesus!

[greyfoxx39]

Thanks

[Utah Binger]

Almighty and wonderful God our Creator please in the name of ugly lips and bad lipstick take that thing down!

[DelphiUser]

1. Mormons believe in many, many gods.
2. Mormons believe that Jesus Christ was created and not eternally God.
3. Mormons believe that the gods breed in heaven in order to create additional spirit children.
4. Mormons believe polygamy is STILL practiced in heaven.
5. Mormons believe they can qualify to become gods with their own planet, wives and worshippers.

OK, Saundra, which of those statements are TRUE (all of them are true, by the way), which are “rumors”, which are “half-truths”, and which are “outright lies?”

Hey Ampu, long time no see. I'll field this one, if that's OK, Saundra.

1. Lie, Articles of Faith #1, we believe in the Godhead, as defined in the Bible, not the The Trinity, a man made definition of God, which is not in the Bible anywhere, and was foisted of on the Church by Constantine in AD, 325. BTW, lurkers, the links go to either my page on FR where there are links to authoritative sources, or to the scriptures on line.

2. Lie. Jesus is eternal because he exists outside of time, he created time, and will still be God (as one of the three members of the Godhead) after time ends.

3. "Breed in heaven", Half truth. Breed is a crude phrase, Jesus himself said that we are the children of God, and that God is "the Father of Spirits, so do we believe that God is the Father of spirits? yes, breed? Get your mind out of the Gutter, that is not our belief.

4. Lie. No marriages happen in heaven, we do believe that marital relationships started here on earth continue in heaven, including all the polygamous ones by Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses and other prophets from the Bible who were polygamous.

5. Lie. We say nothing about inheriting a planet, we speak of inheriting all that God hath"Romans 8:16-17, allow me to excerpt it:

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

What does it mean to b e joint heir?

Jesus, God the father's only Begotten in the flesh (a very interesting phrase if you stop to think of all the meaning(s) there...) inherits all that his father hath, IE. The kingdom. We are if so be that we suffer with him joint heirs with Christ... We inherit the kingdom and everything that Jesus has... We become gods, through the grace of Jesus Christ, our savior. (which is why some want to say we are polytheists)

There is however, a logical problem with the polytheist thing, follow this logic:

I have a father.

I grew up and now have children.

I My bothers also grew up and have children.

My brother having children, does not make him my father.

There is no way his kids will call me father.

My children will not call my father when they don't like my rules in my house, there is no appeal to a "higher power"

I do not need any permission, or authority, or anything from my father to be a father, I have grown up, and am independent on my own.

All life is a type and a shadow of the eternities and God's structures, the structure of the family (which was designed by God) is a type and a shadow of the things that have been and the things to come.

Theosis is a concept from both the Bible, and the early church, compare these two quotations:

God became man so that man might become god

and

as man is god once was as god is man may be

now one was said by a "Church Father", the other by a Mormon prophet...

Most people, if they know at all will know because they will recognize the quote from Lorenzo Snow. Why has "Orthodox Christianity moved away from this doctrine that was so clear and common as to not be noticeable? When did "Orthodox Christianity change, and doesn't that call down Galatians 1:8-9 on those who changed the gospel?

For those who don't know, here is the passage:

8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Mormons, teach the Gospel as it was taught by the apostles, interpreting the scriptures as the apostles did, continuing in their work, thus we are attacked and maligned by those who don't want our message heard.

I have a page that answers most of the "charges leveled against Mormons here (hence there is no excuse for the continuing misstatements made by those opposed to us here).

For anyone who is interested, here is a link

I testify to all men that Jesus lives! In him only do I have hope, he is my lord, my God my Savior. I love him with all my heart. I know this to be true and if any man wishes to know as I know the truthfulness of the gospel, I recommend The Test found in both the Bible, and the Book of Mormon to you. I promise you that if you take this test in faith and with all diligence that God will testify to you of his truths and you will know of his goodness and mercy. God lives! He loves you! This I testify in the name of Jesus Christ, my lord, my God, my Savior.

God bless you all with his love and with his truth.

Delph

[svcw]

So the fact that lds teach that satan and Jesus are brothers.....oops is that a lie, a half truth just what is it Sandy?
psst.....Jesus is eternal NOT created.

[Godzilla]

The person who sent it to me, being clueless to the fact that I have been a proud member of the "Flying Inmans" since its inception.

An epic fail if ever!

[Tamar1973]

I believe that Heavenly Father created both Jesus Christ and Satan.

Wrong! Jesus Christ was NOT created by the Father. He co-existed with the Father before the foundations of the word. Satan, formerly known as Lucifer, was a created being. Putting the two of them on any kind of equal footing is blasphemy.