Posted on 08/31/2010 10:14:35 AM PDT by mlizzy
A society needs more than just religion to survive. It needs the correct religion.
(Excerpt) Read more at youtube.com ...
This sounds like something a Muslim would say.
ML/NJ
I say it sounds similar to some of the sentiments expressed by FReepers on the Beck threads as well.
Under which of the following scenarios are we more likely to have a correct religion:
or
For conservatives, the answer is obvious. The later approach will guarantee that some ideas may be wrong but, in the end, truth is enduring and will win out when Jesus Christ comes again to either select which of the existing brands of Christianity is the most nearly correct or to establish his own.
For totalitarians, the former approach guarantees that brute force or political power will make those decisions for all of us. Neither of these approaches has ever been successful in helping mankind discover truth.
You’re limiting the free market of ideas to scripture and assuming that all people should believe scripture to be god’s word. Many don’t.
Perhaps, you should say...”2.A free market system of ideas where people are allowed to believe as they wish, put those ideas to the test and evaluate the results?”
I had hoped that was obvious from the first alternative description.
And I say this as a Christian Fundamentalist myself, though obviously not one from the Taliban wing.
Maybe to you. I suggest that Japan is less screwed up than the UK these days.
ML/NJ
Japan's greatest periods of invention and expansion were 1946-1991 when the government was weakest. Their greatest periods of stagnation were 1993 to date when their people got complacent and allowed their government to grow into the Godzilla which it is today. A Godzilla which, by the way, is still quite benign compared to the current U.S. model.
ML/NJ
. . . which was?
Glenn Beck is a mormon
Mormons are not Christians
Transcript:
http://www.realcatholictv.com/scripts/vort-2010-08-30.pdf
Beck and Religion
2010-08-30
Hello everyone .. and welcome to the Vortex .. where lies and falsehoods are trapped and exposed .. I’m Michael Voris.
Depending on who’s count you believe .. between 87 thousand and 1 million people gathered on the Washington Mall this past weekend for Glenn Beck’s Restore Honor Rally.
As we’ve been saying in the Vortex for sometime now .. the link .. at least in America between Church and State .. politics and religion .. theology and culture is so deep .. that it shapes our national identity.
That’s why if we get the religion part wrong .. the society descends into moral anarchy.
Becks’ rally was heavily laced with religious references throughout. When he said to the throng, “America today begins to turn back to God” .. it had the ring of a clarion call wrapped up in a tent revival meeting.
But as a Catholic .. some random thoughts are inescapable. The religion issue here has always been a two-edged sword.
On the surface .. it appears that Jesus has lots of cheerleaders. Most Americans are self professed followers of Our Blessed Lord. Roughly two-thirds are Protestant .. one quarter are Catholic and the remaining 10 percent are split between a variety.
So a huge majority believe in Jesus. Yet the country is hurtling toward spiritual suicide .. the Restore Honor crowd notwithstanding. Why is that?
It’s because of the OTHER edge on the two-edged sword. The lack of unity. Yes .. America has a lot of Christians .. an overwhelming majority .. but then .. way too many of them have THEIR OWN working definition of Jesus .. of Christianity.
It is .. in the last analysis .. an inauthentic Christianity. Looks good and sounds good from a distance .. but the closer you get .. the more vaporous it becomes.
It’s worthy to note that many of the leading lights in this Religious Restoration project sweeping over the land .. that will definitely cause a storm to break over Washington on election day .. are themselves .. promoters of inauthentic Christianity.
In the past two weeks .. Glenn Beck .. Ann Coulter .. Rush Limbaugh and others have each come out in favor of homosexual marriage – slash – civil unions. While they are not on the front lines necessarily promoting it .. they are not resisting it AND are giving their considerable nodding consent to it.
That’s not authentic Christianity. Not even close. But this is the problem with a multiculturalism .. everything needs to be compromised and there are simply some things that CANNOT be compromised .. the truth of God for one.
All societies eventually face high noon over religious questions. For a while .. a culture may be able to skirt these issues .. but eventually .. sooner or later .. when the right set of circumstances are brought to bear on religious and moral issues .. a civilization either rises to the occasion .. or meets its waterloo.
No society can survive without religion. Just ask the heirs of Lenin and Marx .. whose Communist utopia couldn’t survive even one century.
Nor can any society survive with major differences over religion. Individuals make choices based on their belief system.
When those choices begin to clash frequently enough .. the cultural begins to experience rupture and moral fault lines begin to develop. As history has shown .. moral fault lines always eventually result in social earthquakes.
America has been able to push the envelope in this regard because .. up until just two generations ago .. The US was generally united under the same moral code which flowed from Christianity.
But once that moral code began to be compromised .. and the heart of Christianity denied .. our society has become unraveled.
Just as no society can survive without religion .. nor survive under various religions .. No society can survive united under one wrong religion. And yes, there are “wrong” religions. Religions which do not adhere to objective truth .. those religions are false.
Some cultures have managed to dodge the bullet on this for a while .. but only because the religious issues are managed more as affairs of state .. then truly religious matters.
No, a society can only survive long term if it is united in mind and heart under the moral precepts that flow from correct religion.
Religious differences are much more than sectarian battles and squabbles. They are the expression of different world views .. which in turn cause different moralities to issue forth.
Those moralities result in different choices being made and eventually .. sooner or later .. these various orthodoxies are going to come into conflict.
The heart of the current cultural war over homosexual marriage .. is at it’s heart .. based on differing concepts of God. All those different concepts can’t each be right and true.
Someone has its seriously wrong. Every major division in society .. is in the end .. attributable to the division among people on religions.
That’s why .. a rally on the Washington Mall calling for America to have her honor restored .. is in the end .. a noble idea bereft of any REAL substance.
Until we ALL .. as a nation .. come to the same understanding of God .. religion and morality .. we will go the way every other civilization has gone .. which is to say .. a few chapters in the next civilization’s history books.
For Catholics .. remember .. the kingdom we belong to .. is not of this world.
GOD Bless you.
I’m Michael Voris.
Glenn Beck is ripe for the Holy Spirit to show him the truth.
That should be your prayer.
ML/NJ
This guy’s sleep-inducing droning on and on about the One True Religion reminds me of a joke:
The Pope gets a phone call from God and is, of course, delighted to take the call. It’s a first! No other pope ever received such a phone call.
“So why are you calling?” asks the Pope.
“Well,” says God, “I’m calling with good news and bad news. Which do you want first?”
“By all means,” says the Pope. “Please give me the Good News.”
“The Good News,” says God, “is that I’m going to end all denominations and ask mankind to come together into One True Church.”
“Why that’s wonderful news!” says the Pope, raising his voice so much in glee that he fears for a moment that he might be talking too loud to be polite over the telephone.
But then he has a thought.
“What, pray tell,” says the Pope, “could possibly be the bad news.”
“Well,” says God, “I’m calling from Salt Lake City.”
See my post #4.
You have just identified yourself as a supporter of the first method, top down.
ml/nj : Meet a Taliban Christian fundamentalist. Please don't confuse them with normal Christian fundamentalists like me.
Right vig, and why not ask the question WHY. Oh, that involves THEOLOGY things you don't want to address. Just as long as they say they believe in Jesus all is well is it?
Actually vig, you are the example of top down by your effort to silence the opinions of TN. Tell us - Christian fundamentalist - the fundamental definition of who Christ is; the nature of God/Trinity - and tell us is that what Mr. Beck believes in as a mormon? On the basis of WHAT Mr. Christian Fundamentalist, can you condemn the identification that mormonism is not Christian (besides the fact that most Christian denominations hold the same view).
See TN and myself are able to relate on the level of ideas, doctrines and scriptural standards for definitions as well as trying to point out the errors of mormonism (as well as other non-Christian religions). Vig likes to try to silence the debate by using emotionally laden adjectives such as 'taliban'.
Is the mormon "Jesus" who had to prove himself 'worthy' to become a god and the ontological brother of satan the same Jesus of Christian Fundamentalism? It would be interesting to see you clarify yourself for once.
I'm simply pointing out, as so many other have more eloquently than me have done, that Jesus Christ will ultimately decide who is and who is not Christian.
Not the Taliban wing of the Christian fundamentalists. And if the term insults you, it is only because it fits.
The fact of the matter is that our civilization is in a fight for our very survival against the forces of evil who would deny us all freedom of religion or anything else.
And presented with the choice of fighting alongside people who agree with fundamentalist Christianity on 80% to 98% of what we believe or fragging them, TFC's repeatedly choose fragging over cooperation.
Nothing has made that clearer than the Glenn Beck threads. If the TFC's really wanted to discuss theology, they would go to theological threads or entire websites devoted to that purpose.
You can decide where the percentage is between 2% and 20%, but you've made it clear that you are more interested in fragging a supposed enemy who does not agree with you sufficiently on theology rather than cooperating with them against a real enemy who would destroy our entire civilization if left unchecked.
It is a good thing your kind was not around when the Catholic Church alone beat back the Muslim invaders in Europe because they probably wouldn't have been sufficiently theologically pure enough to suit you either.
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