Posted on 07/21/2010 10:57:27 AM PDT by TSgt
EVEN WHEN a religious institution has its own procedures for punishing wayward clergy, the sexual abuse of children is a serious crime that warrants prosecution by civil authorities. But when the Vatican revised its disciplinary system for sex-abuser priests, it missed the opportunity to take an unambiguous stand against pedophiles and those who protect them. The new rules do not order church officials to report allegations of sex abuse to the police, nor do they establish even internal penalties for bishops who cover up cases of abuse. Until the church adopts a zero-tolerance policy, justice cannot be served, and the worldwide uproar over the church’s handling of such cases will continue.
(Excerpt) Read more at boston.com ...
Sorry, but whatever follows that lie is just more of the same.
Ratzinger was tasked with keeping a lid on the scandal and he just about succeeded, what with his letter to the bishops warning them that Crimen Sollicitationis was still in effect and absolute secrecy was still imposed on everyone under penalty of excommunication, victims included.
But when the pederast priest scandals erupted in Boston and Los Angeles and Germany and all over the planet, with billions of dollars paid out in fines and redress, the jig was up.
Ooops.
"And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil." -- John 3:19
Once they get done with us not practicing what we preach they'll go after us for practicing what we preach... then they'll move on to you.
I'll take that chance. Your rationalization of evil is repugnant.
It isn't like they care about the actual sexual abuse anyhow.
You're actually describing Ratzinger and Rome and all those pederast priests who consider themselves to be "another Christ" and thus think they are "entitled."
They're not.
About this hatred and bigotry stuff, maybe you have to be on the receiving end of it before you see it for what it is.
Perhaps also you might consider how a practicing Catholic sees “The Church”, if Catholics are your target audience in these “discussions” you should understand that when you make mocking statements about the Catholic Church WE read it as mockery of Christ.
I know you disagree with that and you’re perfectly within your rights to say you don’t care how we see it. But please think about it, every time you’ve made some mocking comment about Catholicism some Catholic (probably every Catholic who read it) felt that mockery in the core of his or her soul as a slap at Jesus Christ. Some (a lot?) of us react wrongly by returning fire but we’re not reacting in a vacuum.
That puts you in a pretty tough position, but since I believe you’re wrong there’s not much I can do to help you out of it. However, because I don’t want to collectivize or dehumanize you I’m trying to communicate with you the way I want people to try to talk to me. The way people perceive the message is often as important as the message itself. On the whole as I have lurked over the last several years it appears to me that very few people in the religion forum are willing to concede even a minimal level of good will on the part of those with whom they disagree, there are some notable exceptions.
God be with you.
Speaking out against sexually abusive priests and the Roman Catholic church which has been caught covering it up is hatred and bigotry and a slap in the face of Christ?
Really?
So, no one can criticize the church for anything, even when it’s clearly in the wrong without it being an insult to Christ Himself?
Really?
Are there no limits to what evil the church or priests can do that won’t raise the ire of Catholics when it’s exposed and condemned by non-Catholics? People looking in from the outside can recognize evil when they see it. Calling it evil isn’t hatred or bigotry, it’s speaking the truth, which is more than the Catholic church has been doing in these situations.
I mean that while “Rome” has its problems, stemming primarily from the active infiltration of homosexuals into the priesthood - because Satan knows the right address, attacking his only mortal enemy here on earth - we can still count on closed minded anti-Catholic bigots to use this satanic attack on us as a club to beat us with. And you provided a perfect case in point, as you are wont to do.
So I'm lying? Not misinformed, not confused, just lying? Those were my words and my opinion based on my understanding of the issue as it played out in my life. I had only been Catholic for five years when the explosion came in 2002 and it was not a welcoming present with which I was particularly pleased. I was very outspoken and offended a lot of people with my outrage, the only ally Catholics in the US had who actually believed in God was Cardinal Ratzinger. That was one of the primary reasons a lot of us were having daydreams about him being elected pope in 2005, we thought the "filth in the Church" statement was the nail in his pontifical coffin and then a miracle happened.
I'm not trying to trap you here, but you seem to be confused. In 2002 Cardinal Ratzinger was the only person in Rome who did care about what everyone else saw as an American problem.
In no way did I rationalize evil, I warned that the "civil, legal and moral authorities" to whom you were appealing, aren't. Down the path which you seem eager to run lies a great deal of danger. That is not a rationalization of evil, it is a warning that the hammer you're wanting to use may bounce back and break your nose.
Earlier in my initial response to Salvation I pointed out that the only reason any of the American bishops bothered to even issue statements about the scandalous behaviour of their priests was because of the constant pressure and scorn of the press. The American bishops are absolutely a problem, Benedict XVI is not.
I'm sure you've seen it many times before but for those who haven't:
How often do we celebrate only ourselves, without even realizing that he is there! How often is his Word twisted and misused! What little faith is present behind so many theories, so many empty words! How much filth there is in the Church, and even among those who, in the priesthood, ought to belong entirely to him! How much pride, how much self-complacency!
He wasn't talking about the dustbunnies in the corner. But then he wasn't just talking about the abuse of minors.
From your own link.
http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2007/06/18/80877.htm
260 Protestant REPORTS of abuse vs 13,000 CREDIBLE Catholic reports of abuse.
FAIL
Some of us have fought this to a degree you will never comprehend in this life. (See for instance this thread for the lengths to which the Lavender mafia in this diocese has gone to attack some of us personally.)
When you attack those of us who have been deep in the trenches in this battle, you are indeed further victimizing the victims. You'll never agree with that or accept it, but it is the truth nonetheless.
No it has not.
The bishops in the United States have adopted an "everyone is a molester" policy.
Every volunteer who may be in the vicinity of children must have criminal background checks, every employee regardless of who they may contact must have a criminal background check. Every employee and volunteer must attend "Virtus" training programs. And the children... God save us, the children have their innocence destroyed in a classroom setting so um, their innocence won't be destroyed. It's a nightmare, everyone from parish priest to kindergartner has to pretty much walk around constantly on guard that everyone around them is a child molester.
The program came out in 2004, my wife and I won't let our children be involved, we weighed the risks and decided the cure was worse than the disease. It's not so much zero tolerance as it's zero sense.
Its a pretty safe bet that 1 out of 4 to 1 out of 5 cases were false accusations, from my extensive experience in this state. I've seen no data to substantiate any claims that non-credible cases represent a higher proportion than that.
No, and I don't know.
Which is totally irrelevant. I can still recognize that sexual abuse by priests, who are supposed to be Christ's representatives on earth, and the covering up of said abuse by higher up Catholic clergy, is a special kind of evil considering that the Catholic church speaks out so much against it in the world and should be an example of proper moral behavior.
Is not the Catholic church supposed to be a light to the world and an example of Christ-likeness to the unsaved?
Do they not claim the higher moral ground? Shouldn't they?
Again, we're not just talking about allegations. There are more than enough verified cases of abuse for the Catholic church to deal with without worrying about groundless accusations, and they haven't been doing a stellar job with the legitimate ones anyway.
FAIL
That's 260 protestant reports PER YEAR vs 13,000 Catholic reports since 1950. I believe that works out to 228 per year for Catholics, 260 per year for Protestants. Or, since 1950, 13,000 for Catholics and 14,820 for Protestants.
It's worth pointing out that the 13,000 credible reports for Catholics cover everything but the reports for Protestants are for only the three insurance companies in the article. Apparently there are 224,000 Protestant churches in the US and the 260/annual number only covers 165,495 leaving 58,505 unaccounted for.
Furthermore even though 3 insurance companies were discussed only the report numbers for two of them were added into the total because one of the companies didn't have a breakdown based on the age of the alleged victims.
NOBODY should think this shows a bigger problem for Protestants though, Protestant congregations outnumber Catholic parishes by about 10/1.
For me it's immaterial what the Protestants get up to, we have our own problem.
It would be kind of refreshing to see more than one or two Catholics acknowledge that what the priests did was wrong and the way the Catholic church handled it was wrong.
Everyone else can see that it’s wrong. Why not Catholics?
No, instead they cry *hate* and *bigotry*.
For what? Forcing them to face the music by insisting on accountability?
I should have qualified that as to MOST Catholics.
To the best of my knowledge and recollection, you are the ONLY Catholic I’ve seen speak out against this situation and acknowledge it’s seriousness and the way it was handled.
It’s very reassuring to know that there are Catholics who are fighting for what is right in their own church.
Every volunteer who may be in the vicinity of children must have criminal background checks, every employee regardless of who they may contact must have a criminal background check. Every employee and volunteer must attend "Virtus" training programs. And the children... God save us, the children have their innocence destroyed in a classroom setting so um, their innocence won't be destroyed. It's a nightmare, everyone from parish priest to kindergartner has to pretty much walk around constantly on guard that everyone around them is a child molester.
That's pretty much the way it is everywhere.
Try being a nursery worker in a church, or a coach, or a camp councilor.
Anyone who works with kids, and even anyone who doesn't, lives under this shadow. No one is safe from the accusation.
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